Dismiss Notice

Welcome To CK5!

Registering is free and easy! Hope to see you on the forums soon.

Score a FREE t-shirt and membership sticker when you sign up for a Premium Membership and choose the recurring plan.

14 Bolt Posi ?s

Discussion in '1973-1991 K5 Blazer | Truck | Suburban' started by smp, Dec 27, 2000.

  1. smp

    smp 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2000
    Posts:
    708
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Florida
    If you pull the cover off should you be able to see the clutches for the posi?
    I was told that a 14 bolt that i got has posi but i can't see any clutches and there is no ID tag on it.

    [image]http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1289941&a=9562647&p=31489733&Sequence=2&res=high[/image]


    <A target="_blank" HREF=http://WWW.SMP.COLORADOK5.COM>http://WWW.SMP.COLORADOK5.COM</A>
     
  2. HarryH3

    HarryH3 1 ton status Author

    Joined:
    May 31, 2000
    Posts:
    10,384
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Georgetown, TX
    You should see clutches and a what looks like a big watch gear next to the ring gear. The good news is, if it isn't a Gov-Lock (The only posi available for a 14-bolt) then it's easy to add a Detroit Locker! [​IMG]

    <font color=black>HarryH3 - '75 K5</font color=black>
    <A target="_blank" HREF=http://ThunderTruck.ColoradoK5.com>http://ThunderTruck.ColoradoK5.com</A>
     
  3. Emmettology 101

    Emmettology 101 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    May 9, 2000
    Posts:
    8,126
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    FL
    Look through the holes in the carrier where you can see the spidar gears. If you look in there and you see the spidar gears AND a few springs and clutches, then it is a Gov-lok. If you see only spidar gears then it is an open carrier.

    I am not sure what Harry is talking about with a gear next to the ring gear..

    HTH

    Mike [​IMG]
    See <font color=green>EMMETT</font color=green> -&gt; <A target="_blank" HREF=http://emmett.coloradok5.com>http://emmett.coloradok5.com</A>
     
  4. HarryH3

    HarryH3 1 ton status Author

    Joined:
    May 31, 2000
    Posts:
    10,384
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Georgetown, TX
    The gear next to the ring gear is what engages a Gov-Lock. It drives a set of spring loaded weights that work like a governer mechanism. When both axles are turning at the same speed, the gear is stationary, so the weights aren't spinning. The parts look like they belong in a large watch. [​IMG]

    A difference in speed between the axles will cause the weights to start spinning. When the difference reaches 100 RPM or so, the weights cause the clutches to engage, usually with quite a clunk from the rear end. This is also what causes Gov-Locks to explode. Large tires and a heavy right foot will exceed the ability of the Gov-Lock to stay together. [​IMG]

    A Gov-Lock is the only posi that I'm aware of that you can't detect by jacking up the rig and spinning one wheel. Most posi's will cause the wheel on the other side to spin the same direction, because the spring pressure on the clutches in the posi is transferring the motion through the diff. A Gov-Lock doesn't have any pre-load so it will behave just like an open diff. The wheel on the other side will rotate in the opposite direction. There's no power transfer through a Goc-Lock until the speed difference is enough to cause it to engage the clutches.

    <font color=black>HarryH3 - '75 K5</font color=black>
    <A target="_blank" HREF=http://ThunderTruck.ColoradoK5.com>http://ThunderTruck.ColoradoK5.com</A>
     
  5. Emmettology 101

    Emmettology 101 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    May 9, 2000
    Posts:
    8,126
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    FL
    I am aware of what a gov-lok is and how it works. I have had 3 rear ends with Gov-loks(and numerous friends with them) and have never seen a gear next to the ring gear.
    Two of the Gov-loks I had out of the rearends so I know I have seen the entire unit.

    The only carriers with rings next to the ring gears that I have seen are for vehicles that are equipped with ABS.


    All the Gov-loks, posi's and lockers that I have seen are all internal mechanisims and have nothing outside the carrier or by the ring gear.

    See if you can find some pics of what you are talking about about and we'll go from there.

    :)


    Mike [​IMG]
    See <font color=green>EMMETT</font color=green> -&gt; <A target="_blank" HREF=http://emmett.coloradok5.com>http://emmett.coloradok5.com</A>
     
  6. Kyle89K5

    Kyle89K5 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2000
    Posts:
    2,273
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    OKLAHOMA
    On a 14 full float, when you pull the cover, count the number of crossshafts that you can see protruding through the side of the case. The case on a 10.5" 14 is a little different than others. You're not going to be able to see down inside there worth a darn. If you've got 3 cross shafts showing, then you have a gov-loc. If there are 4, then it's an open case and ready for a detroit. That's the easiest way that I know of to check. Look on off-road.com/chevy for the review that Shawn did of the detroit install, it will give you some good pic's of the carrier.

    HTH

    Kyle
    89K5
     
  7. HarryH3

    HarryH3 1 ton status Author

    Joined:
    May 31, 2000
    Posts:
    10,384
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Georgetown, TX
    Mike, the gear I'm talking about is parallel to the ring gear, but it's inside the diff case. It's not the same diameter as the ring gear. It's maybe 1/8th of an inch thick and has tiny (and I mean TINY) teeth that drive the flyweight. I'm not sure how easy it is to see on a 14-bolt as my 14-bolt had an open diff. It's easy to see on my S-10's puny little rear end.

    Can't find a picture on the net. Eaton's web site doesn't load properly for me, so I can't see if they have a decent pic. I did find their "Electronic Locker" however! Too bad they prefer to sell only to the auto manufacturers! [​IMG] If I get a chance, I'll see if the GM manual has a good exploded diagram of a Gov-Lock.

    <font color=black>HarryH3 - '75 K5</font color=black>
    <A target="_blank" HREF=http://ThunderTruck.ColoradoK5.com>http://ThunderTruck.ColoradoK5.com</A>
     
  8. Emmettology 101

    Emmettology 101 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    May 9, 2000
    Posts:
    8,126
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    FL
    10-4.. On the units I have had, All I could see where the spidar gears and the springs/clutches through the hole where you pull the c-clips out(on the 10 bolt)...


    Electric lockers would be cool!! :)

    Mike [​IMG]
    See <font color=green>EMMETT</font color=green> -&gt; <A target="_blank" HREF=http://emmett.coloradok5.com>http://emmett.coloradok5.com</A>
     
  9. HarryH3

    HarryH3 1 ton status Author

    Joined:
    May 31, 2000
    Posts:
    10,384
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Georgetown, TX
    I found one of the patents for the Gov-Lock online. It has drawings and a description. Check out <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/US04266445__>http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/US04266445__</A>. Page 3 shows a side view of the governor drive gear that I was talking about.

    <font color=black>HarryH3 - '75 K5</font color=black>
    <A target="_blank" HREF=http://ThunderTruck.ColoradoK5.com>http://ThunderTruck.ColoradoK5.com</A>
     
  10. Emmettology 101

    Emmettology 101 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    May 9, 2000
    Posts:
    8,126
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    FL
    I see what you mean know! :)

    I couldn't see that ring on any of the Gov-Loks that i have had...

    Thanks. :)

    Mike [​IMG]
    See <font color=green>EMMETT</font color=green> -&gt; <A target="_blank" HREF=http://emmett.coloradok5.com>http://emmett.coloradok5.com</A>
     
  11. HarryH3

    HarryH3 1 ton status Author

    Joined:
    May 31, 2000
    Posts:
    10,384
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Georgetown, TX
    That's the heart of what makes a Gov-Lock work. It's attached to one of the side gears and only spins, relative to the other side gear, when there's a wheel speed differential. When that speed difference reaches 100 RPM, it locks the differential. When it's working, it works very well. When it breaks, it's quite ugly. [​IMG]

    The governor mechanism is the "Gov" part of the Gov-Lock name. [​IMG]

    <font color=black>HarryH3 - '75 K5</font color=black>
    <A target="_blank" HREF=http://ThunderTruck.ColoradoK5.com>http://ThunderTruck.ColoradoK5.com</A>
     
  12. Emmettology 101

    Emmettology 101 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    May 9, 2000
    Posts:
    8,126
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    FL
    Cool beans... Thanks...

    I never had a Gov-Lok break on me. I hada an axle snap off right in the carrier, but no problems with the carrier(Gov-Lok). This suprized me since I hear a lot of horror stroies about them breaking.

    oh well.. :)

    Mike [​IMG]
    See <font color=green>EMMETT</font color=green> -&gt; <A target="_blank" HREF=http://emmett.coloradok5.com>http://emmett.coloradok5.com</A>
     
  13. 6.2Blazer

    6.2Blazer 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2000
    Posts:
    4,675
    Likes Received:
    26
    Location:
    Ohio
    The Detroit Tru-Trac is also like that (spin one tire and the other will spin the opposite direction, just like an open diff).
     
  14. HarryH3

    HarryH3 1 ton status Author

    Joined:
    May 31, 2000
    Posts:
    10,384
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Georgetown, TX
    I've also never blown up a Gov-Lock. The one in my S-10 doesn't lock up any more, but there aren't any unusual noises coming from the rear end. I need to open it up and see what's going on. It 4-wheeled a lot better when the Gov-Lock worked! [​IMG]

    I didn't know that about the Tru-Trac. Never owned or even seen one!

    <font color=black>HarryH3 - '75 K5</font color=black>
    <A target="_blank" HREF=http://ThunderTruck.ColoradoK5.com>http://ThunderTruck.ColoradoK5.com</A>
     
  15. Emmettology 101

    Emmettology 101 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    May 9, 2000
    Posts:
    8,126
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    FL
    To all:

    My brother has a True Trac in the front of hisand I dont really care for it. He was trying to climb straight up a vertical point. He was making it with the Detroit in the rear, but what bothered me was, the tire that was on the object did not spin often and the tire that was off the ground spun alot. I figured the True-Trac would grab better than that.......

    Mike [​IMG]
    See <font color=green>EMMETT</font color=green> -&gt; <A target="_blank" HREF=http://emmett.coloradok5.com>http://emmett.coloradok5.com</A>
     
  16. 6.2Blazer

    6.2Blazer 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2000
    Posts:
    4,675
    Likes Received:
    26
    Location:
    Ohio
    I have yet to see any limited slip that works very well under the conditions you mentioned (aka: one tire off the ground and all the weight on the other). Just the fact that the tire on the obstacle did receive some power shows that the Tru-Trac does a good job....for being a limited slip. The one thing I really like about the Tru-Trac is that it seems really easy to "fool" by applying light brake pressure, which helps it lock up. I've had experience with Gov-Loks in GM vehicles, Trac-Loks in Dodges, and other aftermarket limited slips, and this trick helps out in some situations with those brands.....but I can always get both tires to spin with the Tru-Trac by just tapping the brake pedal a little. You should tell your brother to try this.
     
  17. Emmettology 101

    Emmettology 101 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    May 9, 2000
    Posts:
    8,126
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    FL
    Next time we are out, I will have him try it..

    How is it in your area?

    Mike [​IMG]
    See <font color=green>EMMETT</font color=green> -&gt; <A target="_blank" HREF=http://emmett.coloradok5.com>http://emmett.coloradok5.com</A>
     

Share This Page