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14 Bolt with removeable drums, what year?

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by BadDog, Sep 23, 2003.

  1. BadDog

    BadDog SOL Staff Member Super Moderator Author

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    What year did they change the 14 bolts to have drums that could be removed without pulling down the hub? I'm so ticked right now. No time to fool with stuff and now my left rear is locking and won't release. So I have to pull the entire freaking hub just to check it out inside. /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif

    Also, what would it take to convert my older style to a removeable drum style? Is it maybe a bolt on change, or get a new axle housing change?

    I hate working on brakes...

    BTW, best I can tell right now, it over adjusted somehow. Manually backed it off by a couple of teeth, now it works fine and will no longer "lock". But I would have sworn it was a "not bleeding pressure" issue by the way it was behaving earlier... /forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif
     
  2. rjfguitar

    rjfguitar 3/4 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    They are called outboard drums and I haven't seen a 14bolt with them. The style we have are inboard and suck. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif
     
  3. 55Willy

    55Willy 3/4 ton status

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    I think your choices are swapping to a semi floater or rear disc.

    -Jeremy
     
  4. willyswanter

    willyswanter 1/2 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    Actually, there are 14 bolts with the slip off drums. I believe they started around 91 or so... My 96 k3500 has them. I'm converting mine over to the older style like you have so I can run discs since you can't run discs on the hubs on these 14 bolts. Oh yeah, all you change is the hub and the brake parts, axle housing is the same.
     
  5. u2slow

    u2slow 1/2 ton status

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    My 91 V3500 has inboard drums... The slide-off ones seem to come on 92-up 1-ton SRWs and 3/4-ton Burbs w/diesel or 454. All are 13x3.5" drums.
     
  6. K5MONSTERCHEV

    K5MONSTERCHEV 1/2 ton status

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    Yeah iv seen them on later model 2500 and 3500 vans.
     
  7. BadDog

    BadDog SOL Staff Member Super Moderator Author

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    So looks like I need everything from the spindles out on a 91/92 post R/V series SRW HD truck. I have no interest in disks since I like having a fully functional parking brake that will hold my 42s.

    Hey, Jason (WillysWanter), you want to trade even up? I've got the big (13 x 3.5 I think?) drums and everything is in good shape as far as I know... That should be the same as yours and would be a bolt on for me while getting you the hubs for rear disks...
     
  8. prjt_blzr

    prjt_blzr 1/2 ton status

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    I've recently played with a 1 ton rear that used the outboard drums. It was from a '99 and putting those hubs and drums on the older axle had a small problem. The spindle on a '99 is about 3/4" shorter than the older 14BFF. That means that you can not swap the hubs between early and late models. I don't know when GM started the short spindle but measure carefully before you buy as they are deceivingly close.
     
  9. jac6695

    jac6695 1/2 ton status

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    I knew I had seen some late model GM trucks like this. My K2500 6.5 Diesel has inboard drums. I hate them /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif
     
  10. BadDog

    BadDog SOL Staff Member Super Moderator Author

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    Ok, now we have heard "they are the same and will interchange" and "they are different". Can anyone confirm either? Is it possible that they are both correct and the split is across different years?
     
  11. willyswanter

    willyswanter 1/2 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    I know my 96 has the same spindle as my 78 14 bolt. I've already test fit the hubs on it... Maybe they changed them when the new models came out /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

    Oh, I'm not going to be doing mine for a while still so I would be willing to trade but it's not going to be for a while...
     
  12. BadDog

    BadDog SOL Staff Member Super Moderator Author

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    Great! /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif Any way I could rush you up a bit? /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
     
  13. COLLISION

    COLLISION 1/2 ton status

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    I rcently had the pleasure of building one rear end out of five different 14 bolts.Housing was a 79 or 80 with the 10.5" drums behind the hub, hubs came off 92 3/4 ton with 13 inch or so drums, also behind the hubs. 4.10 ratio came out of a 95 3/4 ton with the large drums behind the hubs.Hub bearings came off a 2002 3/4 ton with disk brakes (rotors on outside the hubs, slightly shorter spindles) axle shafts good through all previously mentioned axles. Got my rotors, E-brakes and calipers of a 03 1ton with an 11.5 inch ring gear. also had shorter spindles, but parts interchanged with the 2002 axle.

    I have never seen drums on the outside of the hubs on a 3/4 ton rig (gm) that is. Maybe it was only an option on the 1 ton units.

    That being said if they are out there I would assume there would have to be some difference in the hub, spindle, backing plate or mount flange to bring the drum in the correct distance to the backing plate.

    Why don't you move your drum to the outside of the hub and build an adapter plate to move your backing plate out the same distance as the drum moved.Even an idea like the spacers used in the disk brake conversion kits might work.

    Just some thoughts on the subject /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
     
  14. BadDog

    BadDog SOL Staff Member Super Moderator Author

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    /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif Hmmm, good info, thanks... I hope we can get someone with the knowledge/access (Twiz?) to get specifics on when and where these are found.

    I had already talked with Nick (mosesburb) about that exact thing (he suggested it). That may be what I'm left with, but it won't be any time soon. I'm getting burned out getting ready for Moab... I just found out that my PTO cable doesn't have enough "push" to shift my range box even with extended leverage... Now I get to cobble up another shifter in the next day or so. The closer it gets, the further away it is... /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif
     
  15. prjt_blzr

    prjt_blzr 1/2 ton status

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    FWIW. I checked my axle again last night. The hubs do not interchange. Not sure why it would be different as it was out of a '99 4WD SRW 1 ton. If I put my '77 hubs on the '99 spindle, there is no room for the spindle nuts and the bearing is riding on the threads. If I put the '99 hub on my '77 it does not seat properly on the seal and bearing surfaces.
    Mike
     
  16. Twiz

    Twiz 1/2 ton status

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    I'm not much help here. You see, after doing this for a number of years - everything tends to get jumbled up into one big steaming pile of cast-iron. It's sometimes a little difficult to remember what was installed on what and when.

    As-far as I can recall, the non-dmountable rear drums seemed as tho' they extended well into the 90s, allthough - they might have been dualy only units.

    Try calling up a bone-yard, whatever system they have - might have the information you need.

    Allthough, seems like converting to a demountable, would be alot of work - just to keep from haveing to pull the hub apart. Which isn't really that big of a deal, anyway.

    Ohh- by the way,
    We see heavy rear drums locking up every so often. Check for:
    - Out-of-round drums. Totaly size related, the size of those monster rear brakes - tend to make them far more sensitive to shoe-to-drum clearanceses.
    - Oil or grease contamination. Leaking hub-seals or worn spindle surfaces throwing gear oil onto the contact surfaces of the brakes.
    - Rust. If it's been sitting for awhile, without being driven - the drums and shoes can get rusty, causeing the brakes to lock-up. Both can be cleaned by sanding with emery cloth.

    Most of the problems we see, can be directly related to the size of 'em. They just seem to be more sensitive.
     
  17. BadDog

    BadDog SOL Staff Member Super Moderator Author

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    Tearing the hub down isn't the problem. It's having to go get new seals and install them. I would never get away with reusing one, as you know, my luck is not that good. /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif Also, one of my hubs is a bit undersize in the seal mount and I have to destroy the seal taking it out. The seal press flattened the steel face of the seal last time pressing it in, and I cleaned it up good with emery cloth before installation. Those 2 things are why I hate going into mine. Swapping a hub or having it turned on a lather to clean up the seal surface would fix one problem, but not the other...

    On your locking up ideas, thanks.

    1) Out of round. Hmm, don't think that's it. The drag is pretty steady. Out of round I would think would be more lurchy. I had to put the case in double low to drive throught the brakes and didn't notice any modulation in the resistance. Detroit sure gave it hell though! /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

    2) The wheel cylinder is weeping just a bit so that's probably part of it. I've got a new one to put on if/when I get time to go in...

    3) Rust; it's been sitting for about 4 months while I made all these changes..

    So, it's working fine since I backed it off about 2-4 teeth. Maybe it will last through Moab. If not, I've got the parts to rebuild that side one evening...
     

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