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a 4x4 200R4

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by karroome, Jan 21, 2004.

  1. karroome

    karroome Registered Member

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    the search facility is out so I thought I might post this q?.Can a 200R4 be mated to any transfer case?.
    Thanks in advance.
    A. Karim
     
  2. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

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    Welcome to CK5.

    Why would you want to do such a thing?

    It's possible that you could use the same stuff that'd work for a 700R4 on a 2004R with a stock 4wd tailshaft swapped into it. I can't say for sure though as I really just don't know, nor do I know of anyone attempting this swap.
     
  3. karroome

    karroome Registered Member

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    well... I just found out that they are plenty, some fit all GM V8(and some V6) bellhousing paterns(dual patern bellhousing),they are smaller, consume less power, weigh less(I think /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif)the TH-400 ratio style with the added overdrive(which is by the way 0.67 or so /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif), can be beefed up to handle a hurd of horses /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif. I know some may favour the deeper first gear ratio in the 700R4 but with a 200, there is not that much of a drop between 1st & second(good for drag, though but not a crime when dunning /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif.besides, if it is possible then we have one more option /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif(which to me is not bad).
    what do you guys think, is it worthy of thinking about?
     
  4. 4X4HIGH

    4X4HIGH 1 ton status Premium Member GMOTM Winner

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    You cannot use a 200R4 because there is not a removable tail housing.
    I should have said you cannot use it with an adapter like your existing one is but you could do a divorced T-case I suppose.
     
  5. beater_k20

    beater_k20 Banned

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    [ QUOTE ]
    well... I just found out that they are plenty

    [/ QUOTE ]

    someone has mislead you terribly there...
    [ QUOTE ]
    can be beefed up to handle a hurd of horses /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif.

    [/ QUOTE ] read: mucho deneiro to even come close to a stock TH400

    i say ditch the idea altogether, because you're going to be really upset when you thrash you high dollar trans with a stock small block.
     
  6. karroome

    karroome Registered Member

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    let me then tell you way exactly I want to research it: hopefully it bolts to a northstar( I know this is a K5 place but can you please check out www.chrfab.com).
    well.. I think I got too much spare time and spend most of it gazing at the computer /forums/images/graemlins/ears.gif . GVE ME A BREAK, THE IDEA IS CATCHY to say the least /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif
     
  7. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    because you're going to be really upset when you thrash you high dollar trans with a stock small block.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    That isn't even REMOTELY true. Are we forgetting which transmission the Grand National used? How about the Turbo TA's in '89? Don't even get me started on the somewhat recent (and baffling because it took so long) shift to the 2004R from the 700 in many, many applications, from street rodders to racers. The ONLY reason it's not a popular swap to trucks is because of the extension housing issue.

    The 2004R isn't a practical idea for a couple of reasons, but inherent strength of the internals isn't one of them anymore than it is with a 700. The case can't be had in the "thick" K case configuration like most Chev trans can be, and as was stated, there is no "extension housing" that you can unbolt to mate up with a t-case adapter. You could run it divorced, but since there were no fixed yoke 2004R's, you have a lot of work to do to get it useable.

    However, comparing the 2004R stock to a TH400 stock, obviously the 400 is stronger. Spend the same money on a TH400 and a 2004R, and the TH400 will be stronger. The 2004R is better compared to the 700R4, where for everything except crawl ratio, the 2004R is better. Better gear spacing 1-3, less parasitic drag, just as much strength, and better OD ratio.(.67:1)

    You spend some decent money on a 2004R, and you've got a good tranny. You can build a beefy one for around $500 yourself, I'm sure paying someone would be a bunch more.
     
  8. karroome

    karroome Registered Member

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    4x4HIGH you are leading me somewhere /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif thanks!
     
  9. karroome

    karroome Registered Member

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    [/ QUOTE ]

    Don't even get me started on the somewhat recent (and baffling because it took so long) shift to the 2004R from the 700 in many, many applications, from street rodders to racers

    [/ QUOTE ]
    music to my ears /forums/images/graemlins/ears.gif
    keep them comming guys. any thoughts about the northstars and the link I gave
     
  10. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

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    I couldn't agree more with Dorian. Everyone thought the 2004R was junk, but it's coming out from the shadows to be a common/popular swap to avoid the huge gear jump that makes the 700R4 suck so bad for drag racing.

    /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif Dorian!
     
  11. beater_k20

    beater_k20 Banned

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    in STOCK form, a 2004R is junk when put behind anything with power like a small block produces. i know several people with Buick GNs. one started with a stock trans and only upgraded his turbo, stock trans didnt last but for about a month. the comparison to the TH400 was made, assuming a stock TH400, and a modded 2004R. the internals of the 2004R are nowhere near the size of the TH400 parts. beefy parts = strong trans. also keep in mind, this trans was designed to be put in a 4000# MAX car for fuel economy, NOT a 6000# truck.
     
  12. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    I *think* someone over on oldsgmail.com put a northstar in a cutlass. I know nothing about the transmission used, or hassle involved, but you might check out the sight, and peruse the archives if there are any.
     
  13. skratch

    skratch 1/2 ton status

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    I'd just ignore the doom sayers, somewhere along the line they forgot how to dream.

    The Northstar is a wonderful engine, but it was designed for a FWD not a longitudal mount.
    I'm not sure what the bellhousing of a conventional tranny would bolt to it, unless it had some serious machine work.
    I'm sure it could be done with some creative fab work and it looks like that shop is capable of doing it, but at what cost?
    And to make full use of that engine will require the full suite of electronics that came with it in the caddy if you stay FI, which is where that motor shines.
    There really aren't a whole lot of aftermarket parts for it and serivce parts are very expensive.
    I don't know if you've ever worked on one before but I have and even something like the starter (which is located in the lifter valley under the intake) is a nightmare to replace.
    If your committed to that engine it is a good strong motor, capable of handling a ton of HP, but it will be difficult and costly to utilize. Again though if you have the funding and desire to do it I'd say go for it, it sure would be one of a kind. /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     
  14. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    in STOCK form, a 2004R is junk when put behind anything with power like a small block produces. i know several people with Buick GNs. one started with a stock trans and only upgraded his turbo, stock trans didnt last but for about a month.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    If you can explain how the 2004R internals are any weaker than a 700R4, I'm all ears. Comparing a 15 year old tranny in a turbo'd application putting out PROBABLY in excess of 300HP to a new one, or a power sucking, non-OD TH400 isn't exactly fair.

    I've known people to run STOCK 200's behind 455's and have them live. I know of PLENTY of GN guys that have or had over 200,000 miles on the trannies. I had one in my car that only failed because an idiot PO put the wrong driveshaft (too long) into it. It too had over 150,000 miles on it. All Olds 307's with OD had 2004R's behind them, and the '85+ Monte SS used the 2004R exclusively as well, so the SBC meaning catastrophe to them is wrong.

    None of those motors are "powerhouses" by any stretch of the imagination, but I guarantee that a SBC does not spell death to every 2004R ever made.

    Comparing a 2004R to a 400 is pointless, as everyone knows how strong a TH400 is. It also doesn't have OD, and it is a parasitic drag monster, unlike the 200.

    If a 200 holds up to more abuse than a 700, or even an equivalent amount (which they do) I see no justification for saying they won't work in a truck. As I said before, the K-case would be an issue that you can't really work around, but as YOU stated, it's not the original application. Calling all 2004R's junk or weak sounds just like the people that 10 years ago were saying quadrajets were junk.
     
  15. 88Silverado

    88Silverado 1/2 ton status

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    Currently a 200R4 can be built MUCH stronger than a 700R4 because the aftermarket manufacturers decided the 200 was a better trans to build for high HP applications than the 700 and built the parts. The parts dont exist for a 700 to be stronger than a 200. PST in No.Cal builds 200's that can handle 800-1000 HP for the Turbo Buick racing crowd.
     
  16. dave_90_blazer

    dave_90_blazer 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    I'd just ignore the doom sayers, somewhere along the line they forgot how to dream.

    The Northstar is a wonderful engine, but it was designed for a FWD not a longitudal mount.
    I'm not sure what the bellhousing of a conventional tranny would bolt to it, unless it had some serious machine work.
    I'm sure it could be done with some creative fab work and it looks like that shop is capable of doing it, but at what cost?
    And to make full use of that engine will require the full suite of electronics that came with it in the caddy if you stay FI, which is where that motor shines.
    There really aren't a whole lot of aftermarket parts for it and serivce parts are very expensive.
    I don't know if you've ever worked on one before but I have and even something like the starter (which is located in the lifter valley under the intake) is a nightmare to replace.
    If your committed to that engine it is a good strong motor, capable of handling a ton of HP, but it will be difficult and costly to utilize. Again though if you have the funding and desire to do it I'd say go for it, it sure would be one of a kind. /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif

    [/ QUOTE ]


    the northstar has the same bellhousing pattern as a 2.8 v6, most guys using them in swaps, are using a 2.8 v6 700R4 case w/v8 vette internals
     
  17. R72K5

    R72K5 Banned

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    200r4 are built and run by the caddy guys and the caddy guys run huge hot engines
    soo...

    but only real bad thing about the 2004r and thm200C is that the tailshaft bshings wear out very fast and makes the tailshaft sloppy bad
    have to keep an eye on that
     
  18. skratch

    skratch 1/2 ton status

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    Yup, did a bit more reading up and found that out, just requires one bolt hole moved on the tranny case.

    This idea becomes more and more intriguing. /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
     
  19. earl87gta

    earl87gta 1/2 ton status

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    Im a member to a msg board for first gen fire birds and the norm over thier is to put a 200 behinde 455s and if they can handel those engines I dont think a northstar will be a problem.
     

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