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Amp Question

Discussion in 'Audio' started by MudFrog, Mar 11, 2003.

  1. MudFrog

    MudFrog 1/2 ton status

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    Ok.. I bought 2 10" Kicker Competition subs, I need an amp to run them on. If I get a 2 ch amp I run the subs just like they are normal speakers, correct? Bridging is only for 1 sub, correct? Are mono amps like bridged amps only for more then 1 sub? Sorry about the lame newbie question but amps really have me confused and I want to make sure I choose the correct one.
     
  2. Z3PR

    Z3PR Banned

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    You can bridge some amps with 2 subs. Depends on if the subs are SVC or DVC, also if the amp is stable at the lower ohm load, ...ect.
     
  3. zcarczar

    zcarczar 1/2 ton status

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    You can buy just one amp. Check out www.thezeb.com They have some killer deals on amps right now because they are trying to get rid of last years models. Im running an Audiobahn A1300HC and it kicks ass, puts out a TON of power to run my 2 12's.
     
  4. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Scott,

    Don't worry about the questions....we all have something new to learn! /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    Most 2-Channel amps can be "bridged" to create a single, more powerful channel. It's not 100% efficient, but as an example, a 100W x 2 amp could be bridged to create a 200W x 1 amp

    Mainly, this is done for subwoofers since they require a lot of power. The only part you seem confused about is the number of speakers that can be driven from a single channel of an amp (bridged or not, it doesn't matter).

    In fact, you can connect as MANY speakers as you want to an amp....! The key is to make sure that you wire the speakers correctly. If you start wiring a bunch of speakers in parallel (All the + connected to other +'s, all the - connected to other -'s) the resistance is going to drop REALLY low, and the amp will either go into "protective shutdown" (if it's designed well), or simply burn up (if it's not designed well)

    If your objective is to run two subs on a bridged amp, all you need to figure out is what the ohm rating is on the subs you've got (also knowing whether they are dual voice coil will be helpful) and how stable your amp is with small loads (2 ohm stable, 1 ohm stable, .5 ohm stable, etc)

    There are ways to wire up multiple subs (series, series-parallel) so that you don't ruin the amp.
     
  5. MudFrog

    MudFrog 1/2 ton status

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    Thanks for the feedback guys!

    Greg.. I bought the Kicker C10 subs. Here are the specs:

    Kicker 01C10 comp subwoofer c10.
    Features / Specifications:
    Size (IN., CM):10, 25.4
    Impedance (OHMS):4
    Maximum Amplifier Power (WATTS PEAK):250
    Maximum Amplifier Power (WATTS RMS):125
    Sensitivity (dB 1W/1M):87.7
    Frequency Response (HZ):30-500
    Mounting Depth (IN., CM):4-9/16, 11.6
    Mounting Hole Diameter (IN., CM)):9-3/16, 23.3
    Min Rec Sealed Box Vol (CU. FT., LITERS):1.0, 28.3
    Max Rec Sealed Box Vol (CU. FT., LITERS):2.4, 67.9
    Min Rec Vented Box Vol (CU. FT., LITERS):1.25, 35.4
    Max Rec Vented Box Vol (CU. FT., LITERS):1.75, 49.6

    I know these aren't the best subs on earth but they can't be the worst. I don't listen to RAP, mainly country and metal/alternative so I don't need an extremely loud earth shaking system.

    I was talking to someone at BestBuy today and he explained what RMS and that kind of stuff was. He recommended that I go with a Rockford Fosgate amp because they do not list their watts as max power but actually RMS. He also said I should kind of daisy chain the speakers with a bridged amp. Take the + line from the amp to one sub then out to the other sub then back to the amp. I didn't understand 100% how to hook it up but I got the general idea.

    Based on the specs of the Sub do you have a recomendation for an amp? Also I want to do the 3/4" MDF for my side panels, can I just cut a hole for the sub and install the sidepanels or is there more to it then that?

    Thanks for the help guys!
     
  6. Z3PR

    Z3PR Banned

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    I'd use a MTX befor a Rockford Fosgate anyday, and I'm not a big MTX fan if that tells you anything !!!!!!
     
  7. purple76pearl

    purple76pearl 1/2 ton status

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    hey man, i sold stereo equipment for 2 years, and been around it all my lift, with those sups, what you need is an aamp that is one chanel, 2 ohm stable, and around 250 - 500 watts, they will hold them trust me
    memphis makes a really nice studio series aamp 250 watts and 2 ohm, depending on where you get them 150- 275 for the aamp, its small, dont get hot, and works for ever
    but whatever you get make sure you get it 2 ohm stable,
    aamps that are 4 ohm stable and 2 channel, usally arent stable at 2 ohm brigged
    jut get ya a good one channel 2 ohm stable aamp and you will be find
    when hooking up the 2 subs brigged rem you have 2 subs, 2 voice coiles, this is a simple wire
    possitive to possitive, negative to negative, thats not hard
    now if you have dual 4 ohm subs, it can be tricky, then you can run them at 4 ohm or 1 ohm, not alot of aamps are stable at 1 ohm audiobahn makes some of the best stuff i have ever seen, last few models that have came out, arent as good if you get one of the class d aamps, stick with the high current aamps, great aamps, lots of power /forums/images/graemlins/k5.gif

    if that wasnt any hlep, sorry to waist ya time bro
     
  8. purple76pearl

    purple76pearl 1/2 ton status

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    hey man, i sold stereo equipment for 2 years, and been around it all my lift, with those sups, what you need is an aamp that is one chanel, 2 ohm stable, and around 250 - 500 watts, they will hold them trust me
    memphis makes a really nice studio series aamp 250 watts and 2 ohm, depending on where you get them 150- 275 for the aamp, its small, dont get hot, and works for ever
    but whatever you get make sure you get it 2 ohm stable,
    aamps that are 4 ohm stable and 2 channel, usally arent stable at 2 ohm brigged
    jut get ya a good one channel 2 ohm stable aamp and you will be find
    when hooking up the 2 subs brigged rem you have 2 subs, 2 voice coiles, this is a simple wire
    possitive to possitive, negative to negative, thats not hard
    now if you have dual 4 ohm subs, it can be tricky, then you can run them at 4 ohm or 1 ohm, not alot of aamps are stable at 1 ohm audiobahn makes some of the best stuff i have ever seen, last few models that have came out, arent as good if you get one of the class d aamps, stick with the high current aamps, great aamps, lots of power /forums/images/graemlins/k5.gif

    if that wasnt any hlep, sorry to waist ya time bro
     
  9. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Scott,

    OK you've already gotten some responses based on those specs, but I'll add a little more.

    The subs are 4 ohm and it looks like they are a conventional "single voicecoil" design. That means that if you want to buy a single large amp to drive them, a perfect one would be 2 ohm stable and produce around 100 - 125 Watts RMS... think of RMS sort of like a "duty cycle" rating. The speakers can handle power up to 250 Watts, but can't dissipate that much heat on a continuous basis...if you push the system hard for long periods of time (and exceed the RMS rating) the subs will have a meltdown!! /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

    The wiring of two subs will be simple....as mentioned, connect the positive leads of each speaker to the positive output on the amp, and the negative leads to the negative side of the amp. That wiring will produce a 2 ohm load on the amp, and everything will be fine.

    As for the enclosure, you will probably be disappointed if all you do is build a 3/4" baffleboard as your side panel. That enclosure needs to be AIRTIGHT (I'm assuming you are trying for a sealed box, not ported) and strong on all sides....otherwise, when the speaker pressurizes the enclosure, the energy that would normally move the cone forward to produce strong bass....will bleed off through the gaps, and really cheat you out of good bass.

    If you want to put the subs in the side panels, you still have to build a "real" enclosure (6 sides!) then cut out a hole in the side panel so the speaker can play through it.

    If you want other ideas, you can check my gallery (link below) and see how I did sub boxes in my truck. I built the box I needed, then built a modified side panel to cover the remaining space....it worked out well.
     
  10. MudFrog

    MudFrog 1/2 ton status

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    Greg.. I saw your boxes and ideally I would love to have a setup like that. Only problem is I would not be able to build it myself and I have a feeling a stereo shop would charge a small fortune for a comparable box.

    I don't understand how people put subs in the sidepanels while still having a true box behind it. It seems like there is barely enough room for the sub much less a hidden box. If you don't mind I might print off a pic or two of your setup and see what I can get price wise on a similar setup.
     
  11. Z3PR

    Z3PR Banned

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    I love your box design. Do you think something simular would work for 12" subs ???
     
  12. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    [ QUOTE ]
    I love your box design. Do you think something simular would work for 12" subs ???

    [/ QUOTE ]



    Paul,

    Maybe.... those boxes "net" about 1.0 Cu ft per driver (That's subtracting out the port and the displacement of the speaker itself. 1.0 cu ft isn't much, but some 12's are specifically designed for small enclosures so you never can tell.

    Of course, if you went with sealed boxes instead of ported, you could just keep letting the box "creep" over the wheel hump area towards the back, until you got the box volume you needed. I stopped where I did because I needed room for the caps and distribution blocks. There's probably another .5 cu ft (or more) available if you're willing to fight for it.
     
  13. Z3PR

    Z3PR Banned

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    K, after getting a good look at the pics of the way you built them, I was like, "Damn, now thats cool.". For a long time I was thinking 15's behind the rear seat. But after seeing how yours are, I think you'd hear it better like you have them. I'm not opposed to moving the rear seat back a foot or so, and I don't have a roll bar to deal with (76 K5) Think I could get alittle more cubic inchs outta mine sence the floor is different in a 76 from a 72 ???
     
  14. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Having the subs firing into the 1/2 cab area seems like it will help contain the bass somewhat with the top off....

    Help me remember....on the '76, where is the "step" to the backseat area? I know on a '77 I worked on recently the step is DIRECTLY behind the front seats. Somewhere later on, I guess they kept the floor LOW until the rear seat area, which would give you a taller side panel area to work with....

    The actual rear wheel "humps" are different between the 1st Gen and the 2nd Gens...I know that for a fact. My enclosures did NOT fit in a later truck. The hump on yours is longer (front to back)

    Still......if you want it BAD enough, there's always a way to get the subs in there. Have you considered mounting a metal subwoofer cabinet in the floor and UNDER the truck between the framerails and firing up under the rear seat area? I keep thinking that's what I might do on my "Version 2" stereo re-installation. There appears to be around 3.5 cu ft available that way.....should easily hold two 12's....maybe more! /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
     
  15. Z3PR

    Z3PR Banned

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    I really don't want to do the floor thing. I like the way you have your fireing. I'll figure something out. I've got a friend that builds boxs for a local car stereo shop. I need to talk to him about it. For a long time I wanted to go full out with the MMATS Juggernauts and MMATS amps. Well, reality has sunk in and I've come too relize, I can't afford stuff like that anymore. So now I'm looking at: Amp- (Precision Power PCX-2125) to power the subs./ Subwoofers- Infinty (Perfect 12.1) for this app. SVC 500 watt RMS 1400 Peak. That amp does 500 Watts briged at 4 ohm. Do you think that'll work good together ???
     
  16. tecton

    tecton 1/2 ton status

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    [​IMG]
    what kind of ohm load are you going to get from that setup?

    cause i thought that the only obvious way to maintain stereo subs
     
  17. Dale fan

    Dale fan 1/2 ton status

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    tecton it depends on what subs you're running. Dual or single voice coils and are you using one channel or two on your amp. Here's a link for everyone to rockford fosgate's technical page. Whlie you may not like their products this page has a great wealth of information. Use their woofer wiring wizard for diagrams on hooking up subs in different configuratiosn and the resulting ohm load. /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif

    http://www.rockfordfosgate.com/scripts/rightnow.cfg/php.exe/enduser/home.php
     
  18. Z3PR

    Z3PR Banned

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    [ QUOTE ]
    [​IMG]
    what kind of ohm load are you going to get from that setup?

    cause i thought that the only obvious way to maintain stereo subs

    [/ QUOTE ] Bridge that 2-channel amp with SCV (single voice coil) subs !!!!!
     
  19. MudFrog

    MudFrog 1/2 ton status

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    Well I bought an amp... finally. I know it's not the best amp but for the price I wanted and the functions I need I think it will do well.

    Lightning Audio B300.4

    2-, 3-, or 4-channel output
    Tri-Way capable
    900 watts Max Power
    150 watts rms x 2 in bridged mode
    50 watts rms x 4 into 4 ohms
    75 watts rms x 4 into 2 ohms
    requires 4-gauge power and ground leads — wiring and hardware not included with amplifier
    preamp outputs
    front/rear selectable 40-400 Hz variable high-pass/low-pass crossover, 12 dB/octave
    12 dB bass boost at 50 Hz
    speaker-level inputs
    13-7/8"W x 2-1/4"H x 11-1/8"D

    I think it was a pretty good deal for under $100 shipped to my door. Brand new and not refurbished.
     
  20. 72GMCJIMMY

    72GMCJIMMY 1/2 ton status

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    Let us know what you think of it after it is up and running. The price is right. /forums/images/graemlins/usaflag.gif
     

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