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Anybody ever tried to rig up a d60 for rear steer?

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by dirtwarrior17, Mar 5, 2005.

  1. dirtwarrior17

    dirtwarrior17 Banned

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    I just saw a d60 sittin on the floor(pics of my rig with 42's post) and started to wonder if anybody has ever had a rig with two d60's F and R fourwheel steer? Seems like an electric motor running a powersteering pump rigged up off a high amp alternator would do the trick... I have no clue what it would in volve, but its pretty damn cool to think about.
     
  2. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

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    its been done. There was a guy on here who did it before, and there are a few on Pirate. One of the guys on Pirate runs 2 front axles and it works quite well for him. Requires custom shafts to make a rear one, as well as inner Cs, knuckles, spindles and all the parts. Its not cheap but its bling and worth it I'd say. Sooner or later maybe I'll do it.
     
  3. 84gmcjimmy

    84gmcjimmy 1 ton status

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    what? How would you use a front axle in the rear? :confused:
     
  4. dirtwarrior17

    dirtwarrior17 Banned

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    like sled dog said... a lot of fabrication and some $$$.


    Hey sled dog, what were they using to turn it? was it with an electric motor like i thought?
     
  5. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

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    not sure. I'd personally run another motor driven pump. I've seen electric motor setups though. Wish I could remember who it was that ran rear steer here. I know he had 38s and a dana 44 front on a First gen... Sold it as far as I remember. Pictures would be gone by now since the forum change.
     
  6. dirtwarrior17

    dirtwarrior17 Banned

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    I wouldn't be able to figure out how to rig up a shaft to make it work in the rear... not to mention extend the lines 20 ft.
     
  7. rjfguitar

    rjfguitar 3/4 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    I highly, HIGHLY doubt that. That is a very ineffecient way of driving a pump. A person would either modify a single hydralic pump to supply enough oil to two rams or a second, motor driven, pump would be used.
     
  8. afroman006

    afroman006 1/2 ton status

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    His name on the board was 1FNHIK5 or something like that. He did it badass. Couldnt tell you how though.
     
  9. darkshadow

    darkshadow 1 ton status

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    i would just do it with this guy if i had some coin.

    could do 4 wheel stear and crab turn. 4w stear

    hydro box, feeding the back axle is how i would do it, if i dident have that truck.

    just have a handle insted or a wheel and turn it where you want for the best turn!
     
  10. dirtwarrior17

    dirtwarrior17 Banned

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    here we go....

    an electric motor running a hydraulic pump would have no problem at all. Would need big fan but thats it. It wouldn't be working the whole time and would have plenty of time to cool.
     
  11. dirtwarrior17

    dirtwarrior17 Banned

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    lot easier to understand when you see it....

    if i was going to do it(i'm not) it would look like that.
     
  12. rjfguitar

    rjfguitar 3/4 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    Cooling would not be an issue. The first small problem would be with one engine driven pump and one steadily driven pump by an electric motor is that they would both have different PSI levels depending engine RPM. THat would cause the axles to turn at slightly different speeds, probably not a real big deal.

    The main thing is it would require even more amperage from the altenator and most crawlers have electric fans, winches, rock lights, etc and already run hi ampers just to keep up with that stuff. You don't want a vehicle that requires the amperage of a small town.

    It would be much more effecient to use one single hydralic pump to power both rams (assuming it's a full hydro crawler of course) like almost all heavy duty equipment. During the fall I drive a piece of equipment that has monster tractor tires taller than me and has full hydro 4wheel steering, one pump supplies plenty of oil.

    IIRC Willyswanter had two seperate GM power steering pumps for (I think) a hydralic winch. Obviously, two pumps can be mounted on a V8.

    A freind of mine was restoring a 70's Cadi and for some reason had no room under hood for a York A/C pump so he mounted it in the trunk with an electric motor powering it. It seemed to work fairly good but came with a headache of wiring with an inverter from 12v to 110V, besides the fact that it sucked serious amperage.

    Like I said, there are a lot better ways to power two steering axles than with a second power steering pump and an electric motor turning it.

    Your braking system is a simple hydralic system and GM designed one master cylinder to power both axles because a single "pump" is more effecient.
     
  13. K5MONSTERCHEV

    K5MONSTERCHEV 1/2 ton status

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    Its really not that complicated. I am going to do that to my 14 bolt one of these days (like my front). Its not that expensive either. I am going to make the rear full hydraulic (obvioulsy) with lock pins.
     
  14. dirtwarrior17

    dirtwarrior17 Banned

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    I would go with an electric setup simply because I wouln't have to worry about a 20 ft power steering hose springing a leak, i would have full control of the rear steer with the flip of a swicth and wouldn't have to run a pump constantly and block off the pressure to the rear when i don't need it. I would just leave it off when i don't need it. ... even if a high volt alternator isn't enough (it would be, gm makes crazy 140 amp alternators...twice as much as oem) just run a second battery in the back.


    brakes is a WHOLE different story.
     
  15. rjfguitar

    rjfguitar 3/4 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    Not really, both are hydraulics. Brakes are a low flow, high pressure hydraulic system. Power steering is a high flow, low pressure hydraulic system.

    I don't think you understand what it takes to make a hydraulic system work properly. You can't just have a pump in the back with some lines coming out of it and hope it works.

    You would have to have numerous things. One way would be to have a standard steering gear box like the front, just mounted on the back of the frame but there is a BUNCH of mechanical linkage that would have to be made and probably never would be perfect. You could probably use the hydraulic pump to power a hydraulic motor or flow valve that could turn in two seperate directions but there again you would have to have some sort of linkage to tell the motor or valve which way to flow oil, which would move the ram.

    The easiest way would be to have one powerfull pump with one stype of hydraulic steering gear box or flow valve that is tee'd to go to both the front and rear rams.

    I don't know a lot about the 4wheel steer setups on most rock crawlers but I do know a lot of them are full hydro and hydraulics are hydraulics.

    I've worked on a lot of different hydraulic systems on tractors and other heavy machinery from 4 wheel steering to hydro powered unloading systems and have never seen a rear mounted, seperate pump just for the rear.
     
  16. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

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    Hydraulics are hydraulics :rotfl:

    I've never seen a crawler rear steer setup that was not fully hydraulic. The factory GM setup is electric I believe. Crawlers run a handle controlled valve that directs which way the rears turn, a second motor driven pump would be the way to go I think, and a single or double ended ram in the rear.\

    As for the idea of long hoses, heavy equipment uses long ass hoses in harsh conditions day in and day out, most getting far more use and abuse than our trail rigs in their lifetime.
     
  17. dirtwarrior17

    dirtwarrior17 Banned

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    I meant there is no reason for gm to use an electric motor.

    i was thinking you would have a four wire two way switch telling the motor which way to turn hooked up the the motor driving the lincage and a simple on of switch for the one driving the pump.

    I am not saying its the best way just easier than linking the front steering shaft to the back.
     
  18. rjfguitar

    rjfguitar 3/4 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    oops... :tongue1:
     
  19. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

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    you wouldn't have a pump spin different ways. The motor would pressurize the hydraulic system, then a hand controlled lever setup like I mentioned would direct the pressure to turn. A system where the motor switched directions would be very inefficient. It would have to slow down, stop, then restart, just to turn the other way. Things that use electric hydraulic pumps work the way I described.
     
  20. rjfguitar

    rjfguitar 3/4 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    A flow control valve if I'm not mistaken.
     

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