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Bathroom remodeling sanity needed..my house SUCKS! -Updated

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by newyorkin, May 15, 2004.

  1. newyorkin

    newyorkin 1 ton status

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    I'm a little troubled by my bathroom project...

    The house is 1920's era, and seems to have a concrete/mortor subfloor on the second floor bathroom. Not just subfloor, between the joist's seems to be filled in with masonry. I've been told it's there to eliminate any flex that would crack the finished tile floor (it must've worked, the tile floor only had one small crack).
    I've gutted the bathroom completely now, but am not sure if I should remove the concrete between the joists. I started chopping a channel into it for new piping, and in the process moved and cracked up a lot more than I meant to.

    I'm planning a plywood/cementboard/tile floor. So here's my question:
    SHould I leave in the original masonry (re-pouring what I took out) and put new work on top of it, as the house was designed? Or should I remove all the old stuff between the joists, and work on top of newly hollowed floor?

    I am a little concerned about strength of the old floor. I guess in the 20's, they hacked the everloving poop (no pun intended) out of joists to run pipes across them, so I don't know if the concrete reinforced and compensated for the hacking. 2 of the 6 joists are doubled.

    Another concern is that if I leave everything as is, with chunks removed as I'd originally intended, will those parts of the floor flex differently than other parts, cracking the new tile?

    Here's a shot of the floor with original tile and without it. You can see the joists and the pipes hacked through them:
    [image removed for sake of thread loading time]
     
  2. HarryH3

    HarryH3 1 ton status Author

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    This is probably a good question for the folks at www.BobVila.com /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     
  3. fjleiter

    fjleiter 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    Having been there, and done that... Leave it alone, fix anything you changed and just go over the top with the new.

    In a house that age, if you start changing anything you'll fall into the domino effect of old homes, "fix" one thing and you'll find 10 more things that have to be "fixed" because of the first. I made the mistake of "fixing" a bad piece of tile in my kitchen when we first bought the house... 3 layers of flooring, two layers of subfloor and LOTS of money later I was able to put in a new floor and call it fixed...

    Some things yor just better off not knowing in an old house... If you have to ask "gee, I wonder why I did that" your probably better off not knowing...
     
  4. hi pinion

    hi pinion 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    hey man.....its good to be able to see /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gifin this case,if you cant acsess underneath the floor there,run your copper h /c in the closet for the shower valve,continue on up through the attict(if you cant acsess through floor)(i diddnt see a wate and overflow triplever by the stero or a tub spout so im assuming valve will be by closet)swing your copper down the wall from the attict,by the lavy,tie in your 1/2 copper tees for h/c supply,and continue one single cold line over for the water closet.I think /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gifwithought being there its hard.Good luck.jacob
     
  5. newyorkin

    newyorkin 1 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    Well, several hours later, all I can say is
    @(#*$&@(#*&%(*$&%(*$%(*#$^*&@#^$*&
    #(*$&(*&!(@*#)%(*$#)(%&$(*^(*#^$(#*$)_(
    ":"}{}@#{P$}{@#P$)(&
    !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Quite a bit of the friggin cement is out. Some might say that's good, some might say that's bad. Guys that would replace rotting joists would say that's good. Guys that wish they'd just done what everyone said and just changed some fixtures and call it done would say Friggin a.

    More pics later, I'm taking a shower (in the OTHER leaking bathroom)...
     
  6. Stickseler

    Stickseler 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    Actually the way they used to do mud bases was cool, since youve already started, I won't tell you to leave it alone and patch the loose crete and cover with isolation membrane or hardi backer./forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

    Since you tore into it you can see how cool they ues to builde..it had to do with spans of 2x8's and bathrooms, if you have a 2x8 (7.5" or so) and put a 1x4 (3.5-4" or so) flush to the bottom, put 1x on the 1x4 cleat to hold the mortar upyou've got close to 4" of mortar, then the tops of the joist are ripped to a 90deg point and the mortar is poured 1/2"-1" above the joist .

    Have you been to Taunton ? goto the breaktime forum. there is some good stuff there. Then of course theres always me, I'm a virtual plethora of useless construction info /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif /forums/images/graemlins/hack.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grind.gif
     
  7. newyorkin

    newyorkin 1 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    You know, I was gonna pm you about it last week and I forgot. Damn. It's *exactly* how you describe it. I haven't been to that site, I found NOTHING on the net about it since I started this job.

    After I figure out how to replace these rotted joists, you think I should replace the stuff I broke out and build over that? Ripping it out, I can see how they used it to support stuff, and it looks good and solid, and I can see why even with the rot, the floor didn't flex. When I first saw it I was thinking "what the ????", but now I can see how beefy it makes it. It's mortar? Same bag stuff home depot sells?

    Hi Pinion, I'm kinda kicking myself for not asking you about piping through the attic. I thought about that wayyy back when I was thinking I'd leave all the old plumbing in and put the new floor over it and seal it in, but I figured pipes in the unheated/insulated attic would freeze. You think they're ok up there?
     
  8. hi pinion

    hi pinion 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    oh gosh,,,,are you really in the arctic circle?? /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gifif you are,definatly insulate them tight,they should be ok.The stuff is expensive,but,it should do fine.Tape it good,over the insulation.Be SURE to wear a mask up there,if you have insulation,otherwise you could get mesofelioma.I wouldnt want to see your virgin lungs and brain get destroyed.Its too late for me i think /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gifi dont care anymore,i just get it done. /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif...How cold are we talking???20 friggin below? /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     
  9. hi pinion

    hi pinion 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    Another good plumbing buddy of mine here is STORM TROOPER /forums/images/graemlins/bow.gif /forums/images/graemlins/peace.gifhe might be able to help some too.But i think i got ya covered /forums/images/graemlins/waytogo.gif /forums/images/graemlins/peace.gif
     
  10. newyorkin

    newyorkin 1 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif

    I changed my location to arctic circle in the winter one sarcastic day, totally forgot about it!!

    No, I'm on Long Island/New York City area. Coldest we've hit is a couple degree's below, which doesn't happen often, but I've been in my attic in the winter and it's frioggin cold.
     
  11. Corey 78K5

    Corey 78K5 1 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    [ QUOTE ]
    seems to have a concrete/mortor subfloor on the second floor bathroom.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gifJimmy Hoffa in there /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif
     
  12. Stickseler

    Stickseler 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    Depends on how much youve torn out, Just try to patch the bad joist, put in some mortar (I'm not 100% sure what you use but I can call one of my customers on Monday). If you have a problem using thinset for you tile buy the pre mixed stuff its 50 vs 8 for the same coverage, but it can save a marriage /forums/images/graemlins/ignore.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif.
     
  13. BlazerGuy

    BlazerGuy 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    [ QUOTE ]
    Jimmy Hoffa in there

    [/ QUOTE ]

    BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
    /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif
     
  14. hi pinion

    hi pinion 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    man.......whatever you do,dont run hot water line to the toilet!!!!!!! /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gifI remember one time this guy fubarred a job and did that /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gifto a nice little asian gal,,,,,,SHE SAID=THAT WATA HOT !!!THAT WATA BURN MY BUTT !!!!!!!!!!! /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/usaflag.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     
  15. nc87k5

    nc87k5 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif
     
  16. ChevyCaGal

    ChevyCaGal 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    Older plumbing sucks. I slowly was doing stuff at my house bit by bit, but I am now stuck because I don't really want to try to do some of my stuff, out of I am not sure wtf to do because of room, age and such. Only thing I really wish was to get my disposal installed. But it'll have to wait because I can't afford to hire someone. I feel your pain. I can't even imagine the deal you have going there because yours is older then mine.... least you sounds like you have a good handle on what needs to be done. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    I just noticed the tile is the little small pieces. Must be a 1920's thing. My friend here just moved into a 4 plex built in the 20's. Same thing, little tiles. Same color theme too. Guess it was popular back then.
     
  17. hi pinion

    hi pinion 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
     
  18. ChevyCaGal

    ChevyCaGal 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    [ QUOTE ]
    /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif

    [/ QUOTE ]

    /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
     
  19. Corey 78K5

    Corey 78K5 1 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    [ QUOTE ]
    Only thing I really wish was I get my disposal installed. But it'll have to wait because I can't afford to hire someone.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif Sounds like a good job for Your local plumber /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
    /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gifJake /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif
     
  20. hi pinion

    hi pinion 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Bathroom remodeling info needed - 1920\'s house oddities

    WilL WoRk 4 FoOd /forums/images/graemlins/dunno.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     

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