Dismiss Notice

Welcome To CK5!

Registering is free and easy! Hope to see you on the forums soon.

Score a FREE t-shirt and membership sticker when you sign up for a Premium Membership and choose the recurring plan.

Best location for mid's & high's??

Discussion in 'Audio' started by flash_point, Dec 5, 2001.

  1. flash_point

    flash_point Registered Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2001
    Posts:
    27
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    CA
    Best location for mid\'s & high\'s??

    I'm sure that most of you guys agree that the dash speakers in the K5's are less than desireable. What have you guys done to improve the mid's & high's clarity in your system so that the bass doesn't override them? Did you guys upgrade your dash speakers or disconnect them & installed kick panels speakers or insalled speakers in the doors? Are kick panel speakers even possible due to the E-brake or would that just require a little bending of the pedal?
     
  2. '73 K5

    '73 K5 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2000
    Posts:
    1,763
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Kansas
    Re: Best location for mid\'s & high\'s??

    Kickpanels with a little E-brake modification like you said is by far the best way to go.
    I have kickpanel pods in my daily driver and they're just about perfect.

    '73 K5
    Chevy good...Ford bad
     
  3. 4x4_76

    4x4_76 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2001
    Posts:
    628
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Ylämaa, Finland
    Re: Best location for mid\'s & high\'s??

    Though I don't have K5/K10 yet,I'm going to modifie dash so I can mount 3,5" coaxials in there.6,5" mids I was going to mount to doors,with 10" subs also in doors.My brothers Suburban will probably have samekind of system,exept subwoofers,we were thinking of making centerconsole that has sub enclosure.

    I'm too lazy to stick shift,that's why I prefer autotranny.
     
  4. '73 K5

    '73 K5 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2000
    Posts:
    1,763
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Kansas
    Re: Best location for mid\'s & high\'s??

    Did you really say you're going to put a 10 inch sub in each door? I don't think there is enough Dynamat in the world to stop all the rattles...let alone the air leaks.

    '73 K5
    Chevy good...Ford bad
     
  5. 8_YOUR_H2

    8_YOUR_H2 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2000
    Posts:
    2,663
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Iowa
    Re: Best location for mid\'s & high\'s??

    I think the easiest way to do separates is to go as far down and towards the front of the door as possable with the mid-woof and as high and towards the front with the tweets. take the lower carpeted panel off and use it as a template on some 1/2 mdf, cut it out and carpet (or vinyl, or tweed for that matter) it, then cut a hole for the mid bass and attach it to the door its self. I did this with a set of MB quarts and the 6 1/2 sounded so nice and actually hit hard, it made me appricate good music.
     
  6. 4x4_76

    4x4_76 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2001
    Posts:
    628
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Ylämaa, Finland
    Re: Best location for mid\'s & high\'s??

    Yep,that's my plan.I'm going to make sealed enclosures for those subs.I cut one door into pieces to see if it's possible and it seems that there is enough room for sub box,and windows will also go all the way down.

    I'm too lazy to stick shift,that's why I prefer autotranny.
     
  7. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2001
    Posts:
    15,680
    Likes Received:
    1,391
    Location:
    642 Days to BB2018
    Re: Best location for mid\'s & high\'s??

    Ryan (73K5),

    Yep....That 4x4_76 is CRAZY!!!!! He seems really serious about doing the subs in the doors, we've talked about it together and he seems to have thought it through pretty well.

    PLUS: Wouldn't you love to see the pictures of something like that if he actually figures out how to do it???? [​IMG]

    I know I would...



    -Greg72

    '72 K5 Blazer - 427BB/TH350/NP205/6" Lift/35x12.50's
    <font color=blue>See it here: </font color=blue><a target="_blank" href=http://coloradok5.com/gallery/albun38>http://coloradok5.com/gallery/albun38</a>
     
  8. '73 K5

    '73 K5 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2000
    Posts:
    1,763
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Kansas
    Re: Best location for mid\'s & high\'s??

    What about the extra weight on the doors? Do you suppose it would pull the doors out of alignment?
    I say go for it though. It would be cool to see.

    '73 K5
    Chevy good...Ford bad
     
  9. 4x4_76

    4x4_76 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2001
    Posts:
    628
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Ylämaa, Finland
    Re: Best location for mid\'s & high\'s??

    I'm not too concerned about the doors getting misaligned,I guess they can handle it.More I'm worried about hinges,they might wear out quicker,but maybe it can be fixed.
    Enclosure itself wont be heavy,because it's going to be fiberglass.Sub is placed about feet away from hinges,so it wont stress them too much.I need to figure out a few things,but so far,no big problems.I let you guys know when I have something ready.

    I'm too lazy to stick shift,that's why I prefer autotranny.
     
  10. flash_point

    flash_point Registered Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2001
    Posts:
    27
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    CA
    Re: Best location for mid\'s & high\'s??

    Ok, so how does this setup sound. 6.5" or 5.25" kickpanels in the front, upgraded dash location speakers (I beleive they are 4x6"), disconnect the 4x10" in the rear cause they will be drowned out by the subs &amp; cut out a location in the back seat area right around the ash tray area for 6x9"'s. Does that sound like a good mid range &amp; high's setup for a K5 Blazer? Any suggestions to this idea? Thanx
     
  11. taterblazer

    taterblazer 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2001
    Posts:
    277
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Boise, ID
    Re: Best location for mid\'s & high\'s??

    Greg is the real authority but that sounds like it could possibly be to many speakers. I'm starting with two in mine then maybe 3.5's under the dash in the factory holes.
     
  12. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2001
    Posts:
    15,680
    Likes Received:
    1,391
    Location:
    642 Days to BB2018
    Re: Best location for mid\'s & high\'s??

    Flashpoint,

    The thing to remember if you are going to spend the money on seperate subs, you won't need to worry about spending money on 6x9's (which are typically designed to try to play full-range music)

    You could probably get away with something less expensive in the rear (A normal co-axial type speaker). Remember, the majority of sound should be coming from up front to give you a proper soundstage....so the rear speakers are only filling in "ambient" sounds anyway.

    The front configuration you described... (speakers both low in the door &amp; up high in the dash) is not ideal....but it comes down to personal preference, and also how many compromises you are willing to make to get the best possible speaker locations. The best locations are the ones in which both the left and right front speakers are equidistant from your ears.

    The only way to get those distances as close as possible is to mount them low in the front footwells, and angle them upwards. The more the speakers move up the door or into the dash, the more dramatic the difference in "path length" will be. The result is that the stereo image doesn't appear "centered" in the dash, but sounds "pulled" to the closer speaker.

    AGAIN...it doesn't mean you can't have an enjoyable system, but if you are willing to do the extra work to get the speakers into a kickpanel location, you will be rewarded with an even MORE accurate sounding system.



    -Greg72

    '72 K5 Blazer - 427BB/TH350/NP205/6" Lift/35x12.50's
    <font color=blue>See it here: </font color=blue><a target="_blank" href=http://coloradok5.com/gallery/albun38>http://coloradok5.com/gallery/albun38</a>
     
  13. '73 K5

    '73 K5 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2000
    Posts:
    1,763
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Kansas
    Re: Best location for mid\'s & high\'s??

    My man Greg is speaking the truth. If it was me I would completely forget about the 3.5 inch dash speakers....forever. And go with the speakers down in the kickpanels. The size isn't going to matter a ton between 5.25 versus 6.5. If you are using 10's or 12's for subs then I'd use 5.25. If you are retarded like me and have 15's or 18's then 6.5's would make for a smoother transition.
    6x9's in the back are fine, but you don't need speakers that big. Matching the rear speakers with the front would be fine. And here is the key: DO NOT give the front and rear speakers the same job. Use the fader or a crossover or an EQ or an L-pad so the front speakers are going to play louder than the rear. Otherwise your imaging is going to suck. The singer is going to sound like he's sitting on your console instead of up high on the dash. The Blazer I had in high school had component set up front, 6x9's in the back and a couple 18's. I had the components and subs on one side of the fader and the 6x9's on the other side. If I was by myself I usually had the 6x9's playing around 30%. If I was hauling around some fine weemon in the backseat, then I'd fade it so the 6x9's were at 100%
    The last thing cool about that was listening to stereo with the engine off. The sub amp would drain the battery pretty fast, so all I had to do was fade it so only the 6x9's were playing and the battery would last forever.
    The point Greg and I are trying to make is that for speakers that play over 100 Hz or so, think about them like brakes. Brake force I mean. 70% in the front, 30% in the rear. Its just a good rule of thumb I guess. In some cases more or less would be better. In my daily driver I have a component set in the kickpanels and sub...absolutely no rear fill...and it sounds pretty good.

    '73 K5
    Chevy good...Ford bad
     
  14. '73 K5

    '73 K5 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2000
    Posts:
    1,763
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Kansas
    Re: Best location for mid\'s & high\'s??

    Hey Greg, this post has got me thinking about rear fill again...its been a while. I was going to ask what you have done for rear fill in your K5? What speakers and how are they crossed over?
    The reason I bring this up is I thought maybe you'd want to play around with this a little bit...depending on how your crossover/EQ situation is. Changing around the frequency of the rear fill speakers. In the Blazer I mentioned in the above post, I had the fronts crossed over at 80, and the 6x9's only played 300 Hz on up. Of course the subs were 80 on down. I really liked the way the 6x9's added to the system that way...with no midbass.
    Here is an even better example: A couple of guys I used to hang out with made passbands for their rear fill speakers so they were only playing 500-3500 Hz for example. They were using AudioControl processors so the slopes were dropping off like rocks...24 dB per octave. And it sounded really really good. I've always hated rear speakers that were overpowering and this made for a nice sound. What do you think? Ever heard anything like that?

    '73 K5
    Chevy good...Ford bad
     
  15. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2001
    Posts:
    15,680
    Likes Received:
    1,391
    Location:
    642 Days to BB2018
    Re: Best location for mid\'s & high\'s??

    Ryan,

    The only "rear fill" I get in my Blazer is the result of those front tweeters bouncing off the hardtop and then coming back around to the front a few milliseconds later. With the top off, there is NO rear fill at all.

    I suppose I should have something in the rear for "fill" but I put the importance of that rear fill at about 10% (that's ME personally)

    I do agree with your philosophy about the nature of what those rear speakers should do....they should NOT play very loud relative to the fronts, and they should have a limited frequency range....they exact frequency is something I'd like to play with a little "by ear" to see what gave the most natural sounding effect. But I would use a 4th Order crossover (24dB/Octave) or MORE to very tightly control the range of frequencies back there...

    I guess that when I think about the minimal effect those speakers have....I just hate to give up a couple amplifier channels....and buy a set of speakers.....so that they can "loaf along" most of the time. Though I suppose it would be nice to have a rear set of speakers if I ever carried passengers in the back.

    -Greg72

    '72 K5 Blazer - 427BB/TH350/NP205/6" Lift/35x12.50's
    <font color=blue>See it here: </font color=blue><a target="_blank" href=http://coloradok5.com/gallery/albun38>http://coloradok5.com/gallery/albun38</a>
     

Share This Page