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Borgeson shaft. WTF? ** UPDATED SOLUTION **

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by 73k5blazer, May 17, 2005.

  1. 73k5blazer

    73k5blazer Unplug the matrix cable from the back of your head Premium Member

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    So I order a borgeson 935 shaft from summit (cheapest price for that shaft), it comes today, and it doesn't fit in any way what so ever.
    The D shape column end of the shaft that is supposed to fit over the column D ('79-91 had d shaft sticking out of column, '73-78 shaft had splined round sticking out), doesn't fit, although I feel I may be able to beat that on (how? without damaging), the splined end of the shaft that is supposed to fit on the steering box, isn't even close, my box has a flat on an edge, this thing doesn't, not to mention it's an 1/8" too small in diameter to begin with. Then there's the length, the shaft is like 6" too long. They do give directions for cutting down the shaft, so I guess they anticipate lengths being off. Has aynone else had trouble with these shafts? My application is a bit custom, the box is a stock '73, the column is an '84. They list rag joints for '73-91, so I think the box ends are the same for all years, so I figured the difference in the shaft numbers (they list '73-78 one number and 79-91 another) was the difference I see between my '73 column having the splined end, and the '84 coumn having the D end.
    But this doesn't fit anything. I guess it could be my fault, only if I am supposed to beat on the one end, and '84 steering boxes had smaller dia. splines with no flat, and one is supposed to cut to length all the time. Am I just a jack-A** or is did someone screwup and I got some other shaft than what thier 935 is supposed to be. What gives?
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2005
  2. mini_mull

    mini_mull 1/2 ton status

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    bump...I'd like someone to answer you, since I have a 935 in my plans further down the road.
     
  3. K10ANDYKHAMNIC

    K10ANDYKHAMNIC 1/2 ton status

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  4. Smitty

    Smitty 1/2 ton status

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    Might be worth your time to actually call Borgeson. Let them know what you have on your truck and they can tell you what parts you should have bought. I had an aftermarket column going to an '80 steering box. They fixed me up after answering a few of their questions: spline count on box, spline count on column, and distance from the column to the box.

    Hopefully Summit will take a return on the shaft.
     
  5. 73k5blazer

    73k5blazer Unplug the matrix cable from the back of your head Premium Member

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    I"m not really bashing it, it's a great shaft, it just doesn't fit. They don't list any differences for box ends in thier catalog, perhaps GM changed the box spline dia. the same year they changed the steering column output, but at the very least the column end should fit. But if you bought a rag joint from borgeson, it wouldn't fit either because they list those the same from '73-91.
    BTW, nice job on the custom shaft with the pto u-joints, that's not a bad idea.
    Anyway, it's going back. But I'd still love to hear though from someone who's got these borgeson shafts and thier expierences with the fit.
     
  6. 73k5blazer

    73k5blazer Unplug the matrix cable from the back of your head Premium Member

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    Thats where I was going next...
     
  7. 73k5blazer

    73k5blazer Unplug the matrix cable from the back of your head Premium Member

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    So I called Borgeson. I stood over my vehicle with calipers in hand and gave them any measurement they wanted. Appently on the box end, I have a 13/16" 36 spline, the 935 shaft comes with 3/4" 30 spline. Borgeson did admit thier catalog is lacking there, it seems GM used mostly 3/4", but some vehicles, more commonly found on earlier vehicles like my '73, had the bigger 13/16" 36 spline one.
    Now, on the column end, there's a whole different story. I forgot I have an assembled '86 C10 in the driveway (daily driver), so I pop the hood on that and pop off the steering shaft from the column. That vehicle has the same end, double D, except the two D sides have little flats machined in them. Borgeson joint slides right on. Then my buddy shows up with his '84 K10, we pop his off and he's got what I got, the double D, but only 1 D has a little flat machined into it. Borgesion joint doesn't fit his. The column in the truck I'm fitting is from an '84. Mabey it's an oddball year, but borgeson kept telling me on the phone what I was describing they've never seen and they didn't have anything to fit it. Now, here's where it get very interesting, curious me, I goto my '78-84 parts book, it lists different shaft numbers for ck1,2,3 w/col shift, exc tilt
    ck1,2,3 w/mt(m20), exc tilt
    ck1,2,3 w/tilt
    ck1,2,3 w/o tilt
    Vehicle I'm fitting is K10 MT with tilt. The numbers seem to revolv around wheather the truck had tilt or not, and no I double checked in the illustration, this is the intermediate steering shaft, not some shaft inside the column. So now I'm really like, WTF!!!

    So, I said screw it, busted out the die grinder, and "machined" :grind: a flat into the other D side of my column, and presto, the borgeson joint slipped right on. Then I ordered the ujoint that fits my steering box, of course I'll have to cut down the shaft to fit still, but they said that is standard. There were nice enough and said if I return the ujoint I have to them(even though I didn't order it from them directly), they would credit me for it, less shipping both ways of course.
    Whew, what a pain. I can't believe I'm the first one to fit a borgeson shaft to a tilt gm column. Still dont' know what's going on, but I think I'm taken care of now. Moral of the story, I don't think I go ordering replacment shafts, I'd call whoever I was getting the shaft from and give them all the measurments and let them build it, or at least just give you all the right part numbers you need to assemble it yourself.
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2005
  8. sweetk30

    sweetk30 professional hooker Premium Member

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    well my shaft with both ujoints when on out of the box just cut it and bam it was on. sorry for your trubbles.
     
  9. 73k5blazer

    73k5blazer Unplug the matrix cable from the back of your head Premium Member

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    From you profile you have an '86 body on a '78 frame. If that's right, which shaft did you order? Does your '86 body have the '86 column? Did you order one of the pre-assembled shaft numbers or call direct and give them specs on what you had?
     
  10. seschev3

    seschev3 1/2 ton status

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    I have a 81-83 tilt column and an AGR 2wd box on my 75'. My borgeson shaft went on fairly smooth. It has been a few years since I put it on, but I believe I had to grind down a flat spot as well. And if you care, paint the shaft because they rust almost over night.
     
  11. sweetk30

    sweetk30 professional hooker Premium Member

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    i have the 86 body and 85or 86 2x4 box. on my project truck.
     
  12. NEK5

    NEK5 3/4 ton status Premium Member

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    ok. i know this is an old thread but i`m in need of info. i want to get a borgeson 935 and need to know what must be done for it to fit and if there are any other shafts that will bolt right on???
     
  13. sandawgk5

    sandawgk5 3/4 ton status

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    I used a shaft from a late 80s XJ. I had to use a drill and clearance the steering wheel Dshaft to clear the bolt for the upper joint. Other than that it is a prefect fit no cutting or anything. I paid $20 at a junkyard for it.

    I will get pics tomorrow.

    Ira
     
  14. NEK5

    NEK5 3/4 ton status Premium Member

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    greatly appreciated...did this get rid of all of ur play???
     
  15. sandawgk5

    sandawgk5 3/4 ton status

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    Everything except what was in the box. I also went crossover so I dont know how much this actually got rid of. Mine also has an isolater on it so it does not transmit a lot of vibration like some u-joint shafts can.

    Ira
     
  16. NEK5

    NEK5 3/4 ton status Premium Member

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    so would you recommend going double u joint or get the one with the rag joint?? also does the shaft come one with the bearing for where it goes into the column or is it seperate??? part #s?
     
  17. sandawgk5

    sandawgk5 3/4 ton status

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    I just removed my old shaft and installed the new one. basically I undid the bolt clamping the upper joint on the column and the bolt that clamps the rag joint around the box input and removed it. The new one slid right in place and I installed the two clamp bolts and that was it. I will always recommend removing the Rag joint. Personnally there is something not safe about large steering forces and a piece of conveyor belt holding the system together.

    Just my .02

    Ira
     
  18. NEK5

    NEK5 3/4 ton status Premium Member

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    what shaft did you use? & will mine do as yours did(bolt right in?)
     
  19. sandawgk5

    sandawgk5 3/4 ton status

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    Mine is out of a late 80s XJ. I think Rene has one from a 90 XJ that is the same.

    Ira
     
  20. NEK5

    NEK5 3/4 ton status Premium Member

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    did they bolt right in..if not what is necessary to be done?
     

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