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Bought a used doubler, looking for info

Discussion in 'OffRoad Design' started by azblazor, Jul 29, 2003.

  1. azblazor

    azblazor 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    I bought a used doubler from a guy here in Arizona, He said it is a first generation. I have not dissassembled it yet.

    This unit has an aluminum plate behind the 203, another smaller aluminum plate behind that, and then a 205 adapter in front of the NP205. It does not look like the first generation doublers I recall seeing.

    I was wondering what the differences were if any on the 203 output/205 input, between the 1st gen, and the current model.
     
  2. Stephen

    Stephen 1/2 ton status Moderator Vendor

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    If it's the one from the samurai, that's my old Doubler and 205. Basically it has a 27 spline output and uses the factory 27 spline drivesleeve and input gear, and obviously the the factory adapter. Then GEN2 is shorter by 3" and stronger because it uses a 32 spline shaft and no factory adapter. The 203 was a junkyard core that I checked out (all the bearings sounded OK) and used. The 205 was rebuilt in 1996 and run in my K5 from then till '01 when we put the current GEN2 in for TTC.
    Really, we didn't have many problems with the GEN1's in lighter duty use. I broke several front axleshafts and ujoints in the 10 bolt with that setup and wouldn't mind a bit running it in a rig with a lighter duty front axle. I also have a friend that's broken a D60 inner and took out a detroit with the same setup. It was a really old axle but still, he's had a lot of fun with what he has.
     
  3. azblazor

    azblazor 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    Yes it is the one from Erik's Samuri. He has stripped the the Samy and is building a CJ. So...it has 27 splines between the 203 and the 205. Was this a prototype of sorts for the production Gen 1 doubler?
    Thanks
     
  4. Stephen

    Stephen 1/2 ton status Moderator Vendor

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    That was one of the first batch of 2 shaft, so it was one of our first. I inspected the shaft before we sent it down there and didn't find any wear so I can't imagine there being any problems with it.
    It sounds like you got a pretty good deal.
     
  5. azblazor

    azblazor 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    Sorry, I may be missing an obvious thing, but what does your reference to "two shaft " mean. I bought this for my oldest son (with his money) who is still over in Iraq. He is trying to build a low budget truggy and was thrilled for me to find it for him. I am slowly getting ready to order a doubler for my 4L80E (K5). I have my 203 fitup just about done.
    Thanks
    Mark
     
  6. marv_springer

    marv_springer 1/2 ton status

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    Mark,

    I bought and installed a Gen I Doubler in my Ugly Green thing in Dec '99. I've had NO problems except the 4 bolts that hold the tail flange of the T350 to the 203 Adapter came loose once - which has nothing to do w/ the integrity of the doubler....

    Anyway, mine has served me well. /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif I've prolly racked up 50k miles of road driving and many miles in "Double Low" behind my Vortec small block and have had no strength probs with the 27 spl shafts.

    Marv
     
  7. Stephen

    Stephen 1/2 ton status Moderator Vendor

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    The first order of shafts that I did for prototypes was 2 shafts, one TH350 version 27 spline, one was a 10 spline for the sm465 version. I used the 27 in my own and the 10 spline went to someone who's name I forgot in TX.
     
  8. azblazor

    azblazor 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    Stephen,
    Thanks for all the information. It's interesting to know the complete history of the parts in one's truck. I think my son will think it's pretty cool to have a piece of your truck in his project.
    Mark

    Marv,
    Thanks for the info also. I don't think the 27 spline strength is too much of an issue for what use it will see. But if it breaks, we'll just have to upgrade to a 32 spline doubler /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif He intends to put it into a cut up M1008 with 4.56-d60/14FF and a 6.2 we are rebuilding, I guess we will try running a TH350 behind the 6.2 and see how it holds up. He only has a set of worn out 35" TSLs for rubber. I hope he will be back in time to get it all together for BB03....but realistically I don't think he'll even be back by then.
     
  9. crwln73

    crwln73 1/2 ton status

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    Just to add another satisfied customer.Ive had mine behind my 465 since March or April of 2000.Logged alot of hardcore wheelin with not a single problem.(knock on wood)
    Hope Im not jinxing myself. /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif
    I would and have recommended ORD to anyone who is serious about wheelin.I am so pleased with it Im thinking of buying the updated version of the 465 kit.
     
  10. TrcksR4ME

    TrcksR4ME 1/2 ton status

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    not to hijack this thread...but it sounds like the 27 spline version doubler did just fine, so why was it discontinued? I realize the 32 spline version is much better, but why not an option for the 27 spline version for those of us with not so much money to spend?
     
  11. Stephen

    Stephen 1/2 ton status Moderator Vendor

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    We did have a couple of snapped Doubler shafts and a couple of snapped input gears, so they are definitely not bulletproof. I have no doubt they were used hard when they broke, but regardless, they broke.
    We've considered bringing the Gen1 kit(s) back but for the customer's sake, I'm still not sure it's that good of a deal. Upgrading the 205 is usually about a $250 deal and when you're done, your DONE, there is nothing to worry about in the transfer case. At current prices, you'll have $940 into the Doubler kit and input conversion and if you add roughly $60 for the machine work, you're right around $1000 total. Just using the old price for the SM465 GEN1, $680, you would save $320.00 and the labor to take your 205 apart. Is it worth it? I guess that's up to the individual customer, but for me spending $300 to know that it's DONE is worth it.

    I also find it a lot easier to sell a customer a part, (especially for the transfer case which I believe should be totally reliable) that I know will be 100% as good as it can be. No exlaining that the 27 spline kit should be strong enough if they're only running 37's and will work fine with 40's if they're careful to never run the 205 in high when the 203 is in low, and you probably can't load the 205 enough with a D44 to break it but with a D60, you should be thinking about the stronger kit and no you can't just upgrade from one kit to the other because all the parts are different, etc, etc, etc. I don't have to judge how hard a guy is on parts from a phone conversation, with the GEN2, I'm just about 100% guaranteed he can't break it.

    There were some extra costs for most customers, like buying TH350/205 adapters, swapping input gears (anyway) and dealing with extra length. A few have had to buy factory adapters a 2nd time if they break the original one, and that's not cheap anymore.

    On the other hand, choices are good, and the older style kits would be a bit cheaper than the Gen2 kit if you already have a TH350 version 205 or SM465 version 205. The 465/205 adapters aren't that rare yet so if you need one it's not that hard to find, or if you break one. And some guys do have long vehicles that will never be short.
    We'll see what happens.
     
  12. TrcksR4ME

    TrcksR4ME 1/2 ton status

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    Thats a good explanation of the situation /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif

    For my set-up a gen 1 kit would probably work, although rear driveline length becomes more of an issue. You could always call the gen 1 <35" and gen 2 35"> or something like that.

    Thanks for the info
     

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