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Car hauler axle idea

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by BigBurban350, Dec 6, 2005.

  1. BigBurban350

    BigBurban350 1/2 ton status

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    Car hauler axle idea....

    One 14bff or D60 housing with 2 offset dually rims on the outside.

    Will this axle housing handle 3 tons?
    Do the axle shafts add to strenght?
    Will a trailer toung with hydralic breaking work with the big drum brakes?

    Thank you for the input on this crazy idea.
     
  2. darenofears

    darenofears Registered Member

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    14bff cab and chassis axle Should Handle the weight as long as the axle is attached to the frame of the trailer with heavy duty leaf springs and overloads, my brothers c30 had 3 tons of mulch on it
     
  3. Inu-Hanyou1776

    Inu-Hanyou1776 1/2 ton status

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    Just to add to a little bit of useless info along with it, but I do think you've got a misconception.

    Full-float axles like the 14-bolt and D60/70 are called full-float because the axle-shafts do not help support the weight of the vehicle in any manner. They are built such that the axle housing carries 100% of the load imposed from the weight of the vehicle, and the axle-shafts are only subjected to the twisting forces imposed from the ring and pinion driving the wheels.

    Semi-float axles, like the 10-bolt, 12-bolt, and D44 are called semi-float because in these axles, the axleshafts actually do carry the weight of the vehicle on their outer bearings and are used for weight carrying duty besides transferring the power from the ring and pinion to the wheels.
     
  4. BigBurban350

    BigBurban350 1/2 ton status

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    Thank you for the replies.

    darenofears, was that truck a dualie?

    Another important factor in my idea is having a wide wheelbase to reduce the trailer ride height, to do this you would have to use a super offset rim like a dualie rim or mega spacer. I guess it would be a dualie axle weight rating divided by two.
     
  5. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

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    Cybrfire was talking about cutting the spindles off of a 14 bolt and just puting a piece of tube between them. Would work well for trailer axle. The problem you have is, you can't have the center sections there. You want a trailer as low as you can get it. And a 14 bolt or Dana 60 center section will stick up into the deck.

    I wouldn't be expecting the dually rim idea to be kind on wheel bearings at all.
     
  6. Inu-Hanyou1776

    Inu-Hanyou1776 1/2 ton status

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    Yeah, the dually rim idea you mentioned will beat the living hell out of the wheel bearings and I think be a potential safety hazard as well, because you'd risk then, IMO, a wheel bearing failing while on the highway at 60-70 mph. :eek1: Very, VERY scary thought!
     
  7. afroman006

    afroman006 1/2 ton status

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    I've thought about doing this too though, a little differently. I Was thinking, cut the tube of a 14 bolt right at the differential on both sides, and discard the diff. Now knock the spring perches and shock mounts off the tubes and find a piece of pipe just the right size to sleeve over the axle tubes. Now you can make it the width of a normal trailer axle. For bearing lubrication, I was thinking, cap the ends of the axle tubes before you put them in the big outter tube, and install some sort of drain plug on bottom and fill plug on top to fill each side. For brakes, I figured a hydraulic surge brake setup can be bought with the money you saved on axles, and will be easier to use, cna be used on any vehicle and work better. Not to mention you can just get old work out brake parts off other 14 bolts.
     
  8. BigBurban350

    BigBurban350 1/2 ton status

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    That is a real good idea with cutting it and putting a tube in place. This would eliminate the offset wheel idea. I guess installing disc brakes would be even better too.

    Thanks guys.
     
  9. diesel4me

    diesel4me 1 ton status Premium Member

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    old school...

    Stock car racers around here have been building car trailers for years that way..they just get a FF 3/4 or 1 ton rear axle ,and cut the tubes off at the differential,and toss the pumpkin in the scrap pile!...pipe is ok,as long as its heavy schedule 40 or 80 grade pipe...most of the guys used square tubing instead,if it was available..most of them just packed the bearings with grease,and drilled and tapped the hubs for zerk fittings..most of them were "dead axle" trailers without springs though..

    Some guys put the axle tubes OVER the square tubing,to lower the ride height of the trailer..made welding it together a bit of a chore--it needed lots of reinforcement..they used flat plates to join the two together.. :crazy:

    I'd note the DOT frowns upon such rigs here now..all trailers hauling other vehicles are required to have brakes over 3000 lbs..you could use the brakes in the axle with a "surge" master cylinder though..not sure if dead axl trailers are legal here anynmore either.. :crazy:
     
  10. ntsqd

    ntsqd 1/2 ton status

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    MISF & I built the axle under our military GM p'up bedded utility trailer that way. Had a 19 spline D60 laying around. We put it's axle tubes and spindles in the round tube he was given to brace behind the seat of his demo derby car. We set the original spring perches on the springs to set the width. That's right, spring under - trailer tows awesome loaded and unloaded. The axle holds about 2.75 gallons of 90wt. now. Ask me how I know.
    I'd not use the dually rims either, get some SRW rims and run those instead. If you build the axle you can make it the width you need w/o resorting to dually wheels.
     
  11. divorced

    divorced 3/4 ton status

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    So are you wanting a 6,000 pound single axle trailer?



    .
     
  12. BigBurban350

    BigBurban350 1/2 ton status

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    Pretty much. I have to have a trailer by this spring, so I am looking at options and maybe buying one or building one. Obviously i'm going for inexpensive. I was thinking a tilt trailer too, with the one axle it would be easyer. The toung just needs to pull and support half the weight. Haven't drawn anything up, just deliberation in my head.
     
  13. ntsqd

    ntsqd 1/2 ton status

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    I don't think I'd go there. That's excessive tongue weight.
     
  14. MTMike

    MTMike 1/2 ton status

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    I wouldn't risk an expensive trail rig and a more expensive tow rig, my life, and the lives of the people on the highway with me by building a frankenstein trailer with no brakes, just to save a few bones.

    A 5K trailer axle with brakes can be had for fairly cheap. You could build a trailer frame and use 2 real 5K trailer axles with electric brakes for not much more $ than a frankenstein 14 bolt hybrid trailer, and have 5 tons of safe carrying capacity.

    Even if it were to cost you $1k more to do it right, best-case scenereo: That's just the deductible on most insurance coverage if you were to save that $1k and have something go wrong and cause a wreck.

    Just my opinion.
     
  15. BigBurban350

    BigBurban350 1/2 ton status

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    In no way do I want to endanger peoples lives. In no way would I want to be a position to take the responsibility of anothers life I took, accident or not (not murder, just like manslaughter or something). I absolutly hate people who do this on the roads, like weaving in and out of traffic going 90+mph. Maybe they don't care about their life thats great, but they don't realize it puts others in danger and the is bull****. Like drunk driving, you should be put in jail for attempted murder.

    Back to the trailer:
    From my understanding, the trailers you buy are built from steel and welded in an orderly manner then painted pretty. Why can't a normal person do the same? I can pick up an older used car hauler for $900 (still looking). I'm pricing out if it is more cost effective to build a new one myself.
     
  16. MTMike

    MTMike 1/2 ton status

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    I'm not saying that your driving habits would endanger peoples lives... don't get me wrong. What I was saying that if you build a trailer with parts that aren't suitable for trailers, and a part fails (I.E. bearing failure locks up the wheel(s) on 1 side of the trailer and tires blow out, causing you to loose control and roll over, or a wheel falls off the trailer and becomes a 100lb, 65mph projectile) the $ you saved versus buying or building the trailer with suitable trailer parts seems less important.

    I'm sure it could work, but I'm saying please, for the safety of you, your stuff, me, everybody else, build it right.

    Again, it's just my opinion and please don't take it personally :)

    Mike
     
  17. BigBurban350

    BigBurban350 1/2 ton status

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    lol kk, what I wrote was a really vague implication that I wouldn't tow something what was unsafe.
     
  18. divorced

    divorced 3/4 ton status

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    I would think that hauling close to 6,000 pounds on a single axle trailer wouldn't pull very well. It seems like it would bounce up/down too much on the tongue.
     
  19. diesel4me

    diesel4me 1 ton status Premium Member

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    scary See-saw!

    I have seen boccats and backhoes hauled around on single axle trailers made from a large front "I" beam axle like a straight job truck or a semi would use..they work,but are scary..you have to position the load perfectly balanced or slightly on the tounge heavy side for them to be towable..only good for back roads and slow speeds..most had NO brakes whatsoever!:eek1: ..

    I've never been a fan of those type of axles that were designed to steer,and just have blobs of weld on the kingpins to keep the wheels in a "straight ahead" position,or tie rods anchored to the trailer frame..its too easy for one to break loose..you don't want one wheel taking a turn whlie the other is straight..

    Its a miracle all the stuff hauled around on home built trailers hasn't caused more accidents and deaths than they have..not saying ALL are junk--but I've seen a good many very scary rigs pull up to the scales at the scrapyard,and at the junkyard I worked at..:eek1: ..I'm talking car-hauling trailers,not your "go to the dump" trash haulers for light duty use..

    You can buy ready made trailer axles very reasonably in places like the Northern Tool catalog..a 6000 lb axle costs anywhere from 200-370 bucks!..for that price its not worth cobbing one from leftover truck rear ends..for 229 bucks,you can get a rubber "torsion" suspension 3500 lb axle..6000 lb springs cost 58 bucks a pair if you use leaf style springs..add another few hundred for hangers,shackles,tires,rims,etc..you can see even though an axle is fairly cheap--all the other stuff you need adds up fast--not to mention the price of steel,even used steel is costly now--and so are welding rods and hours of your time..

    I'd just keep looking for a used trailer--its not easy to build a roadworthy one yourself that will rival a factory built one..it takes lots of time and skill..the days of making your own are about outlawed anyway..A good used trailer IS rather expensive..expect to pay 2 grand or more.."cheap" doesn't exist as far as a "safe" or legal trailer goes anymore...you'll spend at least that much time trying to "save" money building your own,and might end up with a trailer you might not even be able to use legally..:crazy:
     
  20. cok5

    cok5 Registered Member

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    I would not run the torsion axles, they are not for real heavy duty use IMO. I priced some 5200# axles today and they were $233.25 for brake axles and $121.80 for non-brake. The slipper spring kit (includes everything for both sides) was $117.10. For that kinda money I would not even think about doing some kind of booty fab crap.
     

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