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Chose a gun, now need caliber choice

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by gjk5, Aug 29, 2006.

  1. gjk5

    gjk5 3/4 ton status

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    OK, went down to the shop today with the intent of walking out with a PT140, but made the mistake of looking at the 145. Same exact size and capacity (10+1)and 2 .oz heavier. So now I'm torn.


    Never shot a .40 period, haven't shot a .45 in ten years or more.

    I'd like some opinions on what to expect from both these rounds in a little gun like that (3.25" barrel)

    I'd also like to know your opinions on whether or not the .45 is a suitable replacement for a .357 as a "backcountry gun" for the chance bear encounter. I could buy the 140/145 and save the extra towards the next purchase (AR-15) rather than buy the Tracker .357.


    Any input is appreciated. (and pip, I read your angelfire link from the CCW thread and there was some good info there!)

    Thanks guys!
     
  2. OrangeCrushK10

    OrangeCrushK10 1/2 ton status

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    http://www.remington.com/products/ammunition/ballistics/

    Scroll down to the "Online Ballistics Tables" and it'll give you velocity, energy,etc for about any round.

    It's pretty handy for comparing rounds. But you also need to consider such factors as magazine capacity.

    I would narrow the ammo to .357sig, .40s&w, or .45acp

    And I think I'd probably go with the .40s&w for your use... even though I love the good ol' .45

    Oh, and none of them can compare to the .357mag, so you can expect it to be easier to handle than that round.

    I also seem to remember my SigP220 .45 having more kick than my brothers Glock22 .40, even though the .40 has more energy and velocity. But that could also be the difference in pistols, not rounds.
     
  3. Thunder

    Thunder 3/4 ton status

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    A 45 auto for bear portection ? In a word NO! Unless you enjoy a good mauling. 10 shots out of a 40 or 45 may be enough to piss of a griz. But wont stop it. I would stick with a 357 Mag. They have taken every big game animal in North America. 45 ACP work great on thin skinned humans but not so good on 1"thick skulls.
    If you really want a good bear protection hand gun I sugguest a Smith and Wesson X frame model .500 mag. 1.25 tons of stopping power will put the hurt on o'l Mr Griz. .
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2006
  4. big dan

    big dan 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    yeah .357mag is my favorite pistol round. when I buy a handgun thats what its gonna be. I want one for concealed carry but it will be kinda hard to conceal a six gun with a ten inch barrel which is what.:D
     
  5. OrangeCrushK10

    OrangeCrushK10 1/2 ton status

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    Yeah, the S&W 500 would do best, but while being charged by a bear, would you rathar be pulling out a 6" pistol, or a 10" (or more) hand cannon?

    This isn't for hunting, just self defense. I'm sure at close range 400 lbs of pressure in a half inch point would be more than sufficient to penetrate the bear.

    And with the .45 you'd get a minimum of 7 shots. That's 2 more than a large calibur revolver. And according to Remington a .45ACP has more power than the .357mag at 50feet.

    I'd feel comfortable with the .45acp as a backup. Just fill it with some heavy grain +P rounds.
     
  6. gjk5

    gjk5 3/4 ton status

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    Black bears only brother, no grizzlies here. If that still stands for black bears, I'll consider still getting the .357. Was just hoping to kill two birds with one stone.



    I've been stuck with full size 9MM for years, should I expect a major recoil difference in the 3.25" 40 or 45?

    I've shot plenty of .357s so I know what to expect there, plus that 4" ported barrel will take some of the bite (while making it bark more) out of it.
     
  7. OrangeCrushK10

    OrangeCrushK10 1/2 ton status

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    The 9mm is like a bb gun compared to a .40 or .45
     
  8. VikingWarlord

    VikingWarlord 1/2 ton status

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    I have a Sig p220 45acp. It actually kicks LESS than the .40 S&W 411 my wife had. I asked around and a gunsmith told me it is partially the multi strand recoil spring in the Sig. Don't know why that would do it, but I sure like the balistics of the 45 at close range. Just med to far range sucks.
    I also believe it is WAY important the gun is comfortable to your hand. Caliber is of little help with an awkward fit in a stressed situation, bullet has to get there to make any difference. Just my $.02
     
  9. gjk5

    gjk5 3/4 ton status

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    kinda figured that, my pt92 has no recoil essentially.
     
  10. gjk5

    gjk5 3/4 ton status

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    that was my first criteria, that's why i can never buy a gun off the web, i have to hold it first and get the feel of it. I checked out the springfield xd and taurus millenium pro and both felt really natural. the kimber ultra carry was the best feeling gun i ever held, but i don't want to drop $900.


    i know i'll get flamed for this but glocks just don't feel right in my hand, it's not that i think they're bad guns, i just don't like the feel of them.
     
  11. longbedder

    longbedder 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    I'd choose a big revolver for bear self defense. Think .44 magnum or something similar. You can get these in compact form. Or maybe a .454 Casull, which you could also use to shoot .45 Colt ammo.

    If you must have an auto, consider a 10mm. It's ballistics are very similar to a .357 magnum.
     
  12. 3 on the tree

    3 on the tree 1/2 ton status

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    If you are really concerned bout bears, forget the pistol. Carry a couple of scratch and light flares in your back pocket. Haven't met a critter yet that liked the bright light and noise they make.
    If I wanted something light to carry in bear country, it would be 12 gauge "express" double barrel, loaded with slugs.:eek1:
     
  13. Resurrection_Joe

    Resurrection_Joe 1 ton status

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    .45-70 Marlin?
     
  14. surpip

    surpip 1 ton status

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    i got jess the pt140, .40s&w she loves it, not to bad on recoil at all, i just diddent like the stiff trigger
    my xd had a much nicer trigger pull, so far it is the smothest DA i have shot
     
  15. pauly383

    pauly383 Daddy383 Staff Member Moderator

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    Backcountry gun with no guesswork CLICKY
     
  16. gjk5

    gjk5 3/4 ton status

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    I've got this:

    [​IMG]



    but with a pistol grip, I think that would work if I wanted to lug that monster around.
     
  17. gjk5

    gjk5 3/4 ton status

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    wouldn't mind having one but still; a little bulky.
     
  18. gjk5

    gjk5 3/4 ton status

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    [​IMG]





    now that's kick ass right there. but still, $1,400
     
  19. odoa3

    odoa3 1/2 ton status

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    I recently picked up a Pt-145 and was very surprised how little it recoiled. I figured it would be a major handful being so small and light, but it is very easy to shoot. I am not super happy with the accuracy though. I guess it will be fine for close up self-defense, but at any distance forget about it.

    AS for bear protection, there was a guy up here last year that was charged by a black bear while out walking the dog and dropped it with a .45. I am not super comfortable with anything less than a .44 or a 12 guage, but we have to deal with brown as well as black bears up here. For a backcountry gun I would go with a wheel gun any day. Less chance of jams, twigs and grass jamming it up, ect. I prefere the simplicity of revolvers for carrying in the woods.
     
  20. jekbrown

    jekbrown I am CK5 Premium Member GMOTM Winner Author

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    my dad has a .444 Marlin lever action. Hell of a brush/bear gun. Ain't no black bear alive that can suck up a good load from a 444 at close range (ie self defense from bears, not 100+m shots).

    As far as self defense from people, caliber is 0.01% of the equation and bullet placement is the other 99.99%. A 25 ACP that hits has more stopping power than a .500 S&W that doesn't. Get the largest caliber you can control under rapid fire conditions (because when the chiat hits the fan, you'll be blasting away, most likely) and go with that. If its 40 fine, if its 45, thats fine too. Personally, I think 10mm kicks the shot out of either. ;) To bad it isn't more widely used. Personally, I can shoot pretty damn good so 9mm works for me. Allows me to practice a lot more, ammo being dirt cheap and all...

    j
     

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