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DBLAZER Can you help me out? BAD ASS SYSTEM PLANS!!!!!!

Discussion in 'Audio' started by 82Jimmy, Mar 29, 2001.

  1. 82Jimmy

    82Jimmy 1/2 ton status

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    Alright, I know! I have put this off TOO long! I want a pimp ass system, I was thinking 4 12's. I don't know really what is the beset for the price, so could you help me out there? hehe
    Also I had a "local dumbass" tell me that amps don't make a big enough difference to choose a pyramid over a PPI ....is he right or wrong?



    ..........and one time at band camp.........
     
  2. DBLAZER

    DBLAZER 1/2 ton status

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    Oh my lord PLEEEEEAAAAASSSSEEEE dont listen to him. If you really want to ask me some questions, give me a call at my shop during the day. (972) 721-9605. Or just ask me some specific questions, Ill do what I can!!!!! You can also check out our web site, it is just going up so it is barely working[​IMG] Let me know I'll do what I can!

    [​IMG]
    http://autotronixcaraudio.com
     
  3. Hathaway

    Hathaway 1/2 ton status

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    The local guy is a dumbass. Amps do make a difference. I'd put a 25x2 rockford against a 200x2 pyramid any day of the week.

    Look into ESX and Lunar for amps in my opinion. ESX have tons of power and a pretty low price. And Lunar are damn sexy [​IMG]

    Dan, '86 K5, 5.0L v8, NP208, TH700R4, open 10bolts front and rear, 3.43gearing, K&N filter, 31x10.50R15 Trailhandlers
     
  4. 82Jimmy

    82Jimmy 1/2 ton status

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    Whoa that big of a difference? I'm goin to look up Lunar amps right now, and for specific questions (sorry :) )
    1. Alright, PPI? Good or Bad? Expensive amps but pretty good prices on there flat piston subs.
    2. Head unit? I know your an "eclipse" man hehe but they look kinda outdated in my opinion.....is there something special about them?
    3. Um......okay how should I go abouts making a "ported or bandpass" box for 4 12"s? Or should i just stay sealed?

    DBLAZERS DA BOMB


    ..........and one time at band camp.........
     
  5. Hathaway

    Hathaway 1/2 ton status

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    www.lunaramps.com or www.ampmanaudio.com

    The owner guy from Lunar used to work for Rockford (I like rockford, own two RF's actually, but I've since decided I can get equal/better amps over the net from more obscure companies for less). ESX are just plain beasts from all accounts I've read. Under 300 bucks for their 800x1 at 4ohm amp. Beats the pants off the price for an RF 800a2....

    As for questions(I know they are directed at DB but I can't help myself [​IMG])

    1)PPI good. A bit pricey but you get what you pay for. And PPI is damn good. Helped set some new SPL records a few years back in Alma Gates "BEAST" Ford Bronco (ewwww ford)

    2) I personally don't like eclipse. Around here alot of people I've talked to dealt with them skipping. I like Pioneer myself. Lower prices, higher performance if ya ask me. Stay away from sony like the plague (unless its a C90 which I doubt you'll want for the price)

    3) Don't do bandpass if ya ask me. They turn out to be "one note wonders" most of the time. A good ported box should do ya. Just build it to the specs of the sub you decide on. You can go sealed if you want. SQ may be a tad better with sealed. But low tune a ported box and it'll get louder than the sealed and still have good SQ



    Dan, '86 K5, 5.0L v8, NP208, TH700R4, open 10bolts front and rear, 3.43gearing, K&N filter, 31x10.50R15 Trailhandlers
     
  6. Emmettology 101

    Emmettology 101 3/4 ton status

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    Is Xtant still around? Some of the top dogs left PPI to start Xtant..(I htink that show it was spelled.. Did they survive?

    Mike [​IMG]
    See <font color=green>EMMETT</font color=green> -&gt; <A target="_blank" HREF=http://emmett.coloradok5.com>http://emmett.coloradok5.com</A>

    "He who uses a winch...... Is tired of yankin!"
     
  7. Scooter

    Scooter 1/2 ton status

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    Xtant is listed in the CA&E directory. They've also got a website at <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.xtant.com>http://www.xtant.com</A>. Their stuff looks pretty good too, decent specs and prices!

    <font color=blue> Duct tape the small stuff down. </font color=blue>
    Scot in KC, MO.
    Black 87 Chevy K5
     
  8. Hathaway

    Hathaway 1/2 ton status

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    Xtant just did a major redo of alot of their products. Going for a new look. They've always been the kind of "high brow" audio stuff. Still are. Great lookin chrome amps. And now they've got Hexagon subs(stupid ass kicker and their squares started a trend).

    Dan, '86 K5, 5.0L v8, NP208, TH700R4, open 10bolts front and rear, 3.43gearing, K&N filter, 31x10.50R15 Trailhandlers
     
  9. DBLAZER

    DBLAZER 1/2 ton status

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  10. '73 K5

    '73 K5 1/2 ton status

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    How can you not like Eclipse? Thats the first time I've heard of anyone having skipping problems with one. Maybe it didn't have a backstrap on it or it was dirty? Besides that, they are just really high quality and have great numbers to prove it. High lineout voltage, high signal to noise ratio, etc. Eclipse just pays attention to the small details to make a great head unit.

    '73 K5
    Chevy good...Ford bad
     
  11. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    I'll chime in with a personal experience with Eclipse. I bought the Eclipse 5303 as part of a comprehensive installation in my other car. The deck worked fine for about a year, but now it has constant skipping problems. It seems to be temperature related. When the car (and deck) are cold it skips very easily. As I continue to drive and the car (and electronics in the deck) get warmer...it skips less. I was a little surprised to find that Eclipse doesn't have a read-ahead buffer (skip protection).

    I am now considering switching over to the Sony CDX-C90.....it's a nice deck, it even has a digital output for an outboard D/A converter....nice, but $1200 for CD transport? OUCH. Gotta spend some more time soul-searching on that one.

    -Greg72
     
  12. '73 K5

    '73 K5 1/2 ton status

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    What about Alpine?

    '73 K5
    Chevy good...Ford bad
     
  13. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Again just my personal opinion, but Alpine is not what they once were....

    Back in the early 90's everyone wanted the Alpine 7909 deck...it was THE one to have for sound quality, and it was a nice simple-looking machine. Somewhere along the line it seems like Alpine decided to "cash in" on their name recognition and produce a lot more "mainstream" stuff and really seemed to move away from the "competition quality" stuff. If you look at what's HOT on the competition circuit these days I don't think you'll see Alpine there....(it's been a few years since I really followed IASCA or those groups so I may be mistaken here)

    The right way to build a system is to start with a deck that can provide the highest amount of undistorted output voltage, and low source impedence. It allows you to run the entire signal chain at high S/N ratios, and avoid a lot of induced noise problems...increases the dynamic range (headroom) too! You will find that you won't have to set the "input sensitivity" or "gain" on the amplifiers as high either....that's helps to avoid a bunch of noise related issues.

    If you can find a deck you like with +4V to +5V (or more) output voltage, you are on your way to better, cleaner, and LOUDER sound. There really aren't that many decks that do.... so you will find your list of choices gets narrowed down pretty fast! [​IMG]

    Good Luck and happy hunting!

    -Greg72
     
  14. Scooter

    Scooter 1/2 ton status

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    I've got an Alpine 7839. I love it. I've had it for about 3 years and had it in my 86 4Runner before I got brave enough to cut the dash of my Blazer. The only time it has skipped on me was when I jumped a set of rail road tracks. But the remote control might make you a bit lazy.

    <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.customcarsoundinc.com/CDA-7839.htm>http://www.customcarsoundinc.com/CDA-7839.htm</A>


    <font color=blue> Duct tape the small stuff down. </font color=blue>
    Scot in KC, MO.
    Black 87 Chevy K5
     
  15. CaptCrunch

    CaptCrunch 1/2 ton status

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    Just wonder what kinda head unit fits the bill? What brand? model? Not that I'll be changing mine soon, but personally I hate just about every head unit out there... I'm not into paying 800 or 1000 bucks for some unit that has a visual like a tv.

    [​IMG]
    1987 Chevy K5 Blazer- 350 TBI
     
  16. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    CaptCrunch,

    I hear ya.....what I wouldn't do for a deck that could be hidden under a seat with a SMALL display for track information, etc. I'd like to hide that in the ashtray, or maybe build it into one of the sunvisors. FINALLY, how about a volume KNOB! Not a couple of puny buttons that I'll never find in the dark or while I'm trying to watch the road....just a nice round knob that can be turned.....right for louder, left for quieter???

    Then I could leave my classic K5 dashboard alone....there is just something weird about a vintage dashboard with a glowing LED display in the middle of it!

    I found a modular Clarion unit...but it's got unnecessary (to me) DVD capability and it's like $1200 bucks! OUCH.

    Sorry for the rant...[​IMG]

    -Greg72
     
  17. Hathaway

    Hathaway 1/2 ton status

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    I'll admit that I WAS an Eclipse fan not too long ago. Before I got the 4x4 bug I had a Honda and was on my way to building a 4000+ system in it and Eclipse had several products on the to buy list. But after listening to a few of their High Voltage decks, and a having a friend buy an Eclipse and having it skip all the time I decided against it. Numbers to me don't mean a whole hell of a lot. Numbers can be very misleading so saying that they have good specs isn't saying that its a great product. To me how the product ACTUALLY SOUNDS is alot better than how it should sound going by the numbers.

    I like Alpine. Its a bit over priced in my opinion. The output voltage seems a bit low even on their higher end decks. I like the volume knob on some of the decks. I DON'T like that most of their decks only have 2 pairs of preamp outputs. If your running 3 amps it gets to be a pain in the butt having to use splitters/etc. I'd buy an alpine. Their low end decks are pretty impressive. And lately I've been finding I can get just as good of performance out of a less expensive less "feature packed" deck as I can get out of the 600+ decks.

    The Sony C90 is very popular in IASCA. I haven't had the chance to hear one (bit too high priced to have one in any sound rooms around here) but I did own a CDX-m600 and was VERY dissatisfied with it. Skipped, introduced alot of noise into the system that wasn't their with my old pioneer. The ABP(active black pannel) was a good WOW factor but got annoying. The colors were ugly (red/blue/silver) and the remote was used maybe once a month. It did have 3 pre amp outs though and HP/LP filters. The sub volume sadly didn't do much though.

    Greg72, if your serious about keeping your k5 looking original, find the most competent installer you can. Some good installers can install the CD case under the seat and mount the face plate up in the visor or an arm rest or something. It takes some work but it can be, and often is done. If I ever get the money to build a nice street rod I'll be learning how to move the face plate on the deck [​IMG]

    As far as whats popular on IASCA right now. I see alot of Sony C90's. Eclipse does have some decks in there. Alpine does too. But another thing I've been seeing alot of is the factory CD player's with some modifications. www.damnloud.com is a good example. The guy had an Integra with a factory CD player, changed it to a digital output and used an Orion 30+ band digital EQ. Factory appearance counts for points on the IASCA ciruit so I think thats a reason why so many people are leaving the decks alone now. Of course you get the guys with whole custom built PC's running their CD/DVD/MP3 systems, but those guys are weird [​IMG]


    Dan, '86 K5, 5.0L v8, NP208, TH700R4, open 10bolts front and rear, 3.43gearing, K&N filter, 31x10.50R15 Trailhandlers
     
  18. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    BigBrownK5,

    I agree completely about finding a good installer. In fact, I have a GREAT one! It's always fun to hang out at his shop...there's always interesting cars there...

    Here's a partial list of stuff I've seen there:

    911 Turbo S - Black
    911 Turbo S - Red
    Ferrari 355 F1 (paddle shifter)
    Ferrari 355 Spyder
    -------------------
    All those were sent to his shop by Noel Lee (President of Monster Cable)...man that guy has some amazing cars!

    Ferrari F-50
    Ferrrari 550


    He does some amazing tricks with installs....my personal favorite is when he incorporates the displays for a CD player or changer or radar detector INSIDE the rear view mirror!!! It looks normal, but when you power up the car, the display shows right through.....man that is SO amazing.

    Downside? Well yeah, last I checked he was at a shop rate of $85/hour.....probably higher now. He loves doing really custom, slick stuff and he has a client list that can afford to let him "play around" with ideas. He had a really cool custom subwoofer idea for me....but the fabrication was estimated at around 40 hours ($3400!!!)

    Sometimes I really wish I was a jillion-aire so I could just turn him loose on one of my vehicles. [​IMG]


    -Greg72
     
  19. '73 K5

    '73 K5 1/2 ton status

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    Greg72, you can kind of say the same thing about Rockford stuff as you said about Alpine. Ever since they appeared in places like Worst Buy and Circuit Shitty, they have really had to knock it down a few notches to make things affordable. BUT, if you get the Power series RF stuff and the higher end Alpine decks, its still really good stuff. I think people see the cheaper stuff at stores and just assume the whole product line is crap when it really isn't so. But yea I'm still holding onto quite a bit of the past "heydays" from both companies. I have an old 7800 pullout, a 4volt 7930, and my baby: one of the 30th anniversary 7909's from a few years ago...I haven't even taken it out of the box yet. In my daily driver right now I have a Clarion Pro Audio 9175 deck with a EQ/DSP processor which also bumps it up to 4 volt preout. For Rockford I have a 200ix, 40ix, 125.2, 200a4, 800a2. And a bunch of other stuff I really don't need.

    '73 K5
    Chevy good...Ford bad
     
  20. KingSmoth

    KingSmoth Registered Member

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    Last year's Eclipse HU's had widely known skipping problems. A lot of people were turned from them due to that. However, from what I've been told on Termpro, if you take the deck back to your dealer you will get a replacement unit direct from Eclipse. The problem has apparently been fixed in the new models.
    My friend has last years 5441i HU; I don't really like the looks of it, but it is a pretty nice HU. However, I'm a Pioneer man. I use a Pioneer Premier DEX-P98R(top of the line next to the P1R back in 98), and before that I ran a Pioneer DEH-P2000 for over a year. I have never had a single skip with either of them. I will probably never switch from them(probably won't switch from the P98R, not even for an XM HU).
    When it comes down to what box for your subs, what are you looking for? SQ or SPL? With a ported setup you will have higher SPL, but it will take more room(not that there isn't plenty of it). Sealed will generally have better SQ, although ported can be built for it, depending upon tuning frequency, blah blah blah. My recommendation would be to call DBlazer, and ignore your local shop guy.
     

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