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Did the homemade shackle flip today. PICS

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by MOABDADC22, Sep 9, 2003.

  1. MOABDADC22

    MOABDADC22 1/2 ton status

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    Well, I thought I had to work today, but then I realized I am an idiot. Soooooo I had a few extra hours to kill. Good thing too, because it took about two hours per side with a cut off wheel. I only used two 1/16" X 3" wheels in the process.

    I got a few pointers from you guys here and decided to leave the hangars on the K5. Here are a few pics.


    Before: [​IMG]

    Rear wheel well before: [​IMG]

    Hole I cut (I did square up the hole after this pic) [​IMG]

    After: [​IMG]

    Exactly 4" of lift: [​IMG]
     
  2. rick88blaze

    rick88blaze 1/2 ton status

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    /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif look awesome!!/forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     
  3. BurbLover

    BurbLover 1/2 ton status

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    I will apologize now if this seems to be hijacking!! I'd like to say that what you did looks really great!!

    Other than the obvious cost benefit, does anyone know of any pros/cons to this versus the standard shackle reversal kit? Specifically, has anyone ever had one of these homemade kits fail under usage? Thanks.
     
  4. mudhog

    mudhog THEGAME Staff Member Super Moderator

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    looking good /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif ill be doing the same thing soon /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     
  5. TrcksR4ME

    TrcksR4ME 1/2 ton status

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    There is risk when doing this, but I have done it and it has worked great with no problems. In theory it weakens the hanger, but it depends how much you cut (I cut only as much as needed) and the hanger is made from thick metal. I think there is a write up here at the site Here

    Don't forget guys (and gals) that there is lots of useful info off the main page of this site /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif Tech Articles
     
  6. leadfoot067

    leadfoot067 1/2 ton status

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    i did this to mine also....like 4 years ago....when i installed greasable spring bushings a few months ago i noticed the hangars are no longer strait /forums/images/graemlins/1zhelp.gif....but ive wheeled mine hard,and towed a camping trailer and a car trailer with it several times /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif..im sure its been over loaded a few times.....i would venture to say if you dont tow much than they should be fine /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     
  7. mudhog

    mudhog THEGAME Staff Member Super Moderator

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    put a truss or 2 on it pm rene(trustyk5) he can give you pics of his that will strengthen it back up /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     
  8. SkulzNBonz

    SkulzNBonz 1/2 ton status

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    Had mine like that for almost two years, and have wheeled the piss out of it with no ill effects.

    John
     
  9. wrathORC

    wrathORC 1/2 ton status

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    It _might_ bend. I've seen them bend on rusty trucks in the great white north when you cut a hole in them. However, that looks like pretty virgin metal. That support piece on the backside is very much needed. 2wds didn't get that from what I can tell.

    Some people run a piece of metal between the hangers but my spare tire is located there.

    This is what I did:
    http://www.wrath.com/projects/vehicles/images/84k10/liftandaxles/rightrearshackle.JPG

    It's a front hanger off my 77C20 HD 2wd. It's also bolted to the Reese hitch.
     
  10. gravdigr

    gravdigr 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    It _might_ bend. I've seen them bend on rusty trucks in the great white north when you cut a hole in them. However, that looks like pretty virgin metal. That support piece on the backside is very much needed. 2wds didn't get that from what I can tell.

    Some people run a piece of metal between the hangers but my spare tire is located there.

    This is what I did:
    http://www.wrath.com/projects/vehicles/images/84k10/liftandaxles/rightrearshackle.JPG

    It's a front hanger off my 77C20 HD 2wd. It's also bolted to the Reese hitch.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    That's exactly what I did as well.
     
  11. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    I gussetted mine. Pretty simple to do...

    [​IMG]

    Rene
     
  12. BorregoK5

    BorregoK5 1/2 ton status

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    Thats exactly how I first shackle flipped my Blazer. Still have the holes under my brackets /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

    Rene has it right, its smart to brace the hanger afterward as he has done to prevent shifting of the outer edge.
     
  13. BadBowtie1

    BadBowtie1 1/2 ton status

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    About how much lift did it give you?
     
  14. wrathORC

    wrathORC 1/2 ton status

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    My elite math skills says 40 1/4" - 36" = 4 1/4".
     
  15. BorregoK5

    BorregoK5 1/2 ton status

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    The axle is mounted at 26" on a 52" spring (exactly the mid point) and you moved one end of the spring down 8" (a 4" shackle center to center of the bolt holes rotated 180 degrees). The most you could get mathematically with an 8" change at one end of the spring would be 4" at the center of the spring without lengthening the shackle. But, since the spring is traveling on the arc of the front eye (the one not relocated), and your measuring lift relative to the ground, your resulting vehicle lift will decrease as the spring rotates past parallel with the ground. So you can only lose lift from your mathmatical maximum, not gain any more. The good thing is that the stock spring is a little above parallel to the ground in the back before the flip and a little below parallel after the flip so your going to get as close to the maximum of 4" as possible, considering the geometry. Since you have to shim the pinion back down, you gain back that missing 1/8" right there. As for vehicle overall lift, if you were sitting low with a set of true 4" blocks (not 3 1/2" rancho tapered lift blocks) then you will sit low with a 4" flip. If you have the Rancho ones then you'll gain a bit and might be happier! /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     
  16. kennyw

    kennyw N9PHW Premium Member

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    How did your driveline angles end up? I am thinking of doing a cheap 4" lift on my truck with stock 52" springs on the front (move front spring perches) and a shackle flip on the rear...
     
  17. wrathORC

    wrathORC 1/2 ton status

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  18. wrathORC

    wrathORC 1/2 ton status

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    You're entirely correct in your reasoning.

    However, you forget that half ton trucks have the obnoxiously long front hangers. They did this so they could maintain ride height by changing front hangers on 3/4 ton and 1 ton trucks so they could run different axle tube diameters and spring pack thicknesses.

    My springs, after the shackle flip, are almost level (line going through the spring eye centers). The rear spring eye sits 1" further from the bed bottom than the front spring eye. So, using your reasoning it is entirely possible to gain more than 4".

    Next is shackle usage. Some people move their rear hanger to better control the spring-bent-backwards syndrome. Some people move it forward so it is nearly impossible to bend it backwards. Some people leave it neutral (maximum lift). Some people move it rearwards to make it easier for maximum wheelwell stuffing.
     
  19. BorregoK5

    BorregoK5 1/2 ton status

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    I think you and I agree for the most part, except on acheiving more lift from the flip alone. I just hosted a rather lengthy discussion on this topic recently so I happen to have some of the diagrams left over. The spring is a fixed length from eye to eye following the leaf so regardless of hanger location or shackle angle you can calculate your maximums. Hanger location and shackle angle can however reduce from the maximum. The only way to gain more lift in a shackle flip configuration than half of the rear eyes total relocation is to move your axle to the outside (or rear in this case) of the centerline of the spring. Take this image as an example:

    [​IMG]

    Distance A and distance B are both augmented by 4 units yet the effective change on the Y axis dramaticly less on A. The perimeter shown as Z could reperesent your shackles full rotation. Deviating from 90 degrees perpendicular to the spring would result in less change to the Y axis, never more. As long as the axle is dead center of the spring, you have a fixed maxiumum of half the outer edge change from a shackle flip alone.

    Shackle angle is a whole different discussion - I cut and pasted this from my tech for all those interested:

    [​IMG]
    Technical Title:Customizing Your Shackle Angle
    Category: Suspension
    Quick Eplaination:
    When swapping on longer springs or moving spring hangers it is important to calculate the desired lift into the shakcle angle.

    Detailed Description:
    The loaded length of a spring and small tollereances here and there in the real world can add up to a loss. Take a look at the top right image, each grid line equals 1". Value X equals the distance from the shackle hanger mount, value Y equals the resulting height. The blue curve reperesents the 8" shackle arc of travel. If we start with X as 8", the the shackle would sit horizontal or zero degrees. Take 1" from X at this point and the 8" shackle arc of travel will pull Y to +4" (height) and a near 30 degrees of shackle angle as shown in RED above. Taking yet another inch from X yeilds half of the initial result as shown in purple due to the shackle arc.


    Final Result:
    Springs are generally measured from eye to eye under load. But changing the load could in effect result in a loss of arch and effectively lengthen the spring. You can see from the chart above how 1" gain could take you from a 30 degree shackle angle to zero and a loss of 4" in height. I would suggest measuring the spring eye to eye under the amount of weight you intend to put on it, then measure the true length of the spring, along the spring (not horitontally eye to eye). Set your shackle angle to be 1" less then Horizontal with the springs TRUE flattened length so as never to over extend, and adjust the rear hanger height to give you your desired lift at the loaded length and resulting angle.
     
  20. wrathORC

    wrathORC 1/2 ton status

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    OK, I admit, I haven't read the whole thing yet. I will, I promise.

    But from what I see, you have forgotten that the centerline of the axleshaft is several inches away from the leaf with eyes on it. This is especially true in a case where the front of the spring is pointed down from the factory. The centerline of the axleshaft is actually behind the point where the spring pack bolt goes through the top leaf.

    When you keep the front spring eye fixed and rotate the back down the centerline of the axle actually is directly underneath the center of the spring (the spring pack bolt hole).

    I mean, when I think about it I remember the fact that my front spring eye was 7" lower than my rear spring eye and it is easy for me to imagine. Because not only am I moving the rear spring eye 8" down but I am also moving my axle directly under the spring. Add to that shackle position and it seems completely possible for a person to gain 4.25".
     

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