Dismiss Notice

Welcome To CK5!

Registering is free and easy! Hope to see you on the forums soon.

Score a FREE t-shirt and membership sticker when you sign up for a Premium Membership and choose the recurring plan.

Different crossover setup....**PIC**

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by 88K5Jimmy, Sep 8, 2003.

  1. 88K5Jimmy

    88K5Jimmy 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2001
    Posts:
    1,323
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Tulsa OK
    Does this type of crossover actually work?

    [​IMG]
     
  2. mudhog

    mudhog THEGAME Staff Member Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2000
    Posts:
    17,899
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    portland oregon
    Re: Different crossover? PIC

    no pic /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif
     
  3. Thumper

    Thumper 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2000
    Posts:
    1,582
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Alberta Canada
    Re: Different crossover? PIC

    Well, thats almost what I just finished building. I used the stock tie rod, flipped it end for end... this gave me a very convenient hole in the rod right where the steering stab used to be. I reamed the hole in the tie rod big enough for a tie rod end, used another tie rod to crossover, bent it to shape, welded it where I needed to, and am currently working on the steering arm end of things.
    I had made a new steering armand welded it to the shaft on the box, but the welder didnt penetrate the shaft at all so it wasnt strong enough. Now I am getting a 2wd box to swap the sector shaft into mine, and figuring what arm will fit on it. I cant find any solid answers on which steering arm to find (other than the superlift one that I cant afford). I heard that a F150 arm will fit but I cant confirm that.
    I dont have any pics yet, but as soon as it passes its first test, the pics will be up.

    Later
    Mike
     
  4. purple76pearl

    purple76pearl 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2003
    Posts:
    450
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    missouri
    Re: Different crossover? PIC

    well i dont know if it works, but seems like it would save ya a lil money, i like the idea of it for sure
     
  5. 88K5Jimmy

    88K5Jimmy 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2001
    Posts:
    1,323
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Tulsa OK
    Re: Different crossover? PIC

    [ QUOTE ]
    I dont have any pics yet, but as soon as it passes its first test, the pics will be up.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I would like to see pics of your setup. I got to wondering why something like this wouldn't work. Some Heeps have their draglink attached to the tierod, so it got me wondering. However, would this be good on a daily driver? /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
     
  6. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

    Joined:
    May 30, 2001
    Posts:
    17,669
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    IL, USA
    Re: Different crossover? PIC

    My friend has a Scout that has all Chevy drivetrain that he made that is almost completely tube and never sees the road. It still had the Scout steering box so he took the steering arm off the Chevy and welded it to the top of the tie rod on the passenger side. He used the Scout tie rod and hooked it to it. Hillbilly as hell, but it works on a truck that never sees the road.
     
  7. Thumper

    Thumper 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2000
    Posts:
    1,582
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Alberta Canada
    Re: Different crossover? PIC

    Well, I did get it around the block for a few test runs before the weld let go on the test rock in the yard, and the differences were noticeable. I was able to center the wheels and ended up with a bit more travel in both directions than I had stock. I actually figured things out mathematically to get max deflection in both directions. I do get a bit of bumpsteer, but its not much at all. I dont have a steering stab on it yet, I have to make a mount bracket for the tie rod.
    Other than that, it seems very safe because its all tie rod ends. I just need to get the steering box and pitman arm figured out.
    Then the test out!

    Mike
     
  8. BadDog

    BadDog SOL Staff Member Super Moderator Author

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2001
    Posts:
    7,777
    Likes Received:
    11
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Sure it will work. It's called a "T" link and is not uncommon at all. There are also "Y" link which is similar. I don't care for either though since it puts side loads on the links.
     
  9. 88K5Jimmy

    88K5Jimmy 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2001
    Posts:
    1,323
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Tulsa OK
    BadDog

    What about on a daily driver that sees 95% on road and 5% offroad. Would something like this be worth trying?
     
  10. BadDog

    BadDog SOL Staff Member Super Moderator Author

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2001
    Posts:
    7,777
    Likes Received:
    11
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    It should be fine as long as you don't have big tires and a locker with significant offroad usage (which it seems you do not). Just IMO it is not ideal. If you put too much steering pressure on the tie rod, the drag link will try to bend it. Depending on how bad the bind, how strong the tie rod, and how strong the PS, you could bend the tie rod badly...
     
  11. ben427

    ben427 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2002
    Posts:
    1,123
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Waverley, Nova Scotia
    Thats Bill's rig. That setup worked well for him until the steering box puked a month or so ago, now hes going full hydro/hysteer with dual rate coil overs all around. I never really saw it work in person, but my buddy Greg went wheeling with him a couple times and was really impressed with how well that simple crossover worked. Oh yeah, its also welded in the front with drive flanges, so it was abused pretty well and stood up.
     
  12. Thumper

    Thumper 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2000
    Posts:
    1,582
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Alberta Canada
    [ QUOTE ]
    really impressed with how well that simple
    crossover worked.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    Now thats what I like to hear! Especially after that link was posted about all the scary steering photos. I get so fed up at the attitude that you have to spend the big $$ to get the mods done to be able to wheel. It is possible to do lots of these mods a low buck way without compromising safety or wheelability.
    I would post pictures of my setup, but my membership recently expired and I dont think I can... actually I will try to get them onto webshots tonite.
    However I still need to find a pitman arm that will fit onto the 2wd sector shaft.

    Later
    Mike
     
  13. therobzilla

    therobzilla 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    May 15, 2001
    Posts:
    1,307
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Gilbert, AZ
    I use this setup somewhat on my rig. I have a 1st Gen and the frame/steering box locations are somewhat diffrent. I have 1.5 DOM .220 wall tubing with 3/4 Hemi joints on my setup. I used a custom spring pack in the front of my rig, and this required me to lift the high steer arms over my spring pack to clearance the tie rod. I could not get the geometry to work out correctly and have the drag link and the tie rod to connect at the steering arm. So after many, and I mean many hours of working on the front end, I ended up welding a mounting point to the tie rod and mounting the drag link to the tie rod. But remember, I have 1.5 .220 wall tubing on my tie rod, and drag link.

    Results: I can finally get lock to lock on my steering, and I dont have the tie rod hitting the spring packs anymore, but my steering ratios is not what it use to be. I use to have 3.5 turns lock to lock, now I have 2.75 turns lock to lock. It's like driving a race car on the pavement. On the trail it's not too bad. Still not what I expected it to be, but it works.

    My opinions:
    1. Do not use Heim Joints, stick with stock or 1 ton steering tie rod ends. Heim Joints are expensive and a pain in the a$$ to work with, not as much misalignment.

    2. Make sure that the pitman arm that you are using does not bind the tie rod when you do high steer, the longer the pitman arm, the more chance of binding during monster flex.

    3. Make sure when your rig is flexed, the draglink does not hit your harmonic balancer when stuffed.

    4. Readjust your bumpstops to the correct heights.

    5. Don't use Heim Joints. (Did I alread say that)

    6. Make sure you get lock to lock not just when it's on jack stands, make sure you get it when it's on the ground under load.

    7. Don't loose any more steering ratio than you have to, the more you loose harder it is on the steering system.

    8. Run a Power Steering cooler....

    9. Make sure the steering arm you purchase have adjustable holes in it. This helps effect the lock to lock ratio, and the correct alignment.

    10. Don't use Heim Joints... I think I said this, just making sure.

    Good luck.

    REMEMBER, It's totally diffrent for 1st Gen Guys, the 2nd Gen setups are diffrent, but the concept is the same.
     
  14. ChevyCaGal

    ChevyCaGal 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2000
    Posts:
    8,158
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Sacramento, CA USA
    Re: Different crossover? PIC

    [ QUOTE ]
    Hillbilly as hell, but it works on a truck that never sees the road.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    You think if it had a bit more tweeking done to it it could be made road worthy? I am not going to be making my truck a DD, but I will be using a lot once I can put crossover in it. Something like this would be cool to try if it worked for a great price. Can you get some info from your friend on what he used and did, or is it basically like what Thumper was saying?
     
  15. Thumper

    Thumper 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2000
    Posts:
    1,582
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Alberta Canada
    Here is a shot of the front end finally. Its not the best but its something. I will get some more shots when the rest is working right.

    Later
    Mike
    web shots
     
  16. 88K5Jimmy

    88K5Jimmy 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2001
    Posts:
    1,323
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Tulsa OK
    I think you need to log out of webshots so we can see it

    Thanks
    Ross
     
  17. Thumper

    Thumper 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2000
    Posts:
    1,582
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Alberta Canada
    Whoops...
    /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
    Try this one:
    web page

    Mike
     
  18. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2001
    Posts:
    15,680
    Likes Received:
    1,391
    Location:
    642 Days to BB2018
    [ QUOTE ]

    Does this type of crossover actually work?

    [​IMG]

    [/ QUOTE ]


    Not that I'm trying to prevent you from dumping a TON of money into your truck....but this post, and your other one about converting the entire front suspension to coilovers have me wondering why you are planning all these expensive mods just to make it drive better on the street?????

    You've got a stiff set of front springs....you already KNOW that. Why not try the cheap solution, get some better (softer) springs and see what happens? Then, if you still have bumpsteer, you can start playing around with dropped pitman arms and raised steering arms and "s-shaped" draglinks..... some combination of those will cure almost all your bumpsteer.

    6" of lift is not an excessive amount. There are plenty of people who make that work nicely on the street using conventional GM designs (slightly tweaked). It sounds like you are planning WAY to far beyond where you need to, for solving a simple "ride quality" issue. /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
     
  19. 88K5Jimmy

    88K5Jimmy 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2001
    Posts:
    1,323
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Tulsa OK
    [ QUOTE ]
    converting the entire front suspension to coilovers

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Well I actually wanted to convert to just coils, not coilovers. I definitely don't see the need for that amount of money to be dropped into something that is daily driven. I think that would be overkill.

    [ QUOTE ]
    Why not try the cheap solution, get some better (softer) springs and see what happens?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I've thought on that one too. I have figured in that if I wanted to do coils in the front, I would NEED to have crossover. That cost alone on a 10b/D44 is really pricey. That's when I saw this pic it got me wondering if something like this actually worked. Getting crossover would be the hump I would have to get over if I wanted to coil the front, for more than one reason. However, if this crossover setup appears and does infact work, the crossover issue is knocked out. The rest would be to just fab and research the stuff needed to go coils. I've also thought about another set of springs or custom springs with a better spring rate but depending on the cost of custom leaf springs, converting the front to coils might not be much more than that and you are almost guaranteed a better ride with coils (it's all in the spring rates from what I understand).

    [ QUOTE ]
    6" of lift is not an excessive amount. There are plenty of people who make that work nicely on the street using conventional GM designs (slightly tweaked).

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Yup, I'm just trying to find a happy medium, leaves or coils, with the possibly of something most people don't see (coiled front).

    Basically, I just want to keep my options open. I'm not throwing out the idea of a different leaf spring pack, just weighing my options. I still need to play around with my current spring pack, that's what fall break is for /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif

    Thanks for your concern and help. It's given me numerous other ideas as well.
     
  20. 88K5Jimmy

    88K5Jimmy 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2001
    Posts:
    1,323
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Tulsa OK
    Thumper

    When you get some more pics, post them up. You got my ears perkin.
     

Share This Page