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EPA citation. i think i found a loop hole

Discussion in '1969-1972 K5 Blazer | Truck | Suburban' started by arq, Apr 16, 2004.

  1. arq

    arq 1/2 ton status

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    I need help interpreting some of these. it's late and i am not sure if i am reading/understanding these correctly.

    H&S 44011 Certificate of Compliance Exceptions
    44011. (a) All motor vehicles powered by internal combustion
    engines that are registered within an area designated for program coverage shall be required biennially to obtain a certificate of compliance or noncompliance, except for all of the following:
    ...
    (3) (A) Prior to January 1, 2003, any motor vehicle manufactured prior to the 1974 model-year.
    (B) Beginning January 1, 2003, any motor vehicle that is 30 or more model-years old.
    ...

    I was given a citation that violates the following code
    H&S 44011.6 Heavy-Duty Diesel Vehicle Test Procedures
    (2) The state board may also specify visual or functional
    inspection procedures to determine the presence of tampering or defective emissions control systems in heavy-duty diesel or heavy-duty gasoline motor vehicles. <font color="red"> However, visual or functional inspection procedures for heavy-duty gasoline motor vehicles shall not be more stringent than those prescribed for heavy-duty gasoline motor vehicles subject to biennial inspection pursuant to Section 44013.</font>
    ...

    biennial inspection consists of visual aswell as a smog test /forums/images/graemlins/dunno.gif am i interpreting this correctly. should I be excempt from visuall inspection of my vehicle??
    (it's a rhetorical question)

    then there is
    H&amp;S 44015 Certificate of Compliance Testing
    44015. (a) A licensed smog check station shall not issue a
    certificate of compliance, except as authorized by this chapter, to any vehicle that meets the following criteria:
    (1) A vehicle that has been tampered with.
    ...

    which takes me back to 44011(3)a


    comments welcome,

    ARQ.

    PS:

    H&amp;S 44013 Maximum Emission Standards; Studies, Experiments, Level; Test Procedures (1 of 3; Operative)
    44013. (a)(1) The department, in cooperation with the state board, shall prescribe maximum emission standards to be applied in inspecting motor vehicles under this chapter.
    ...
     
  2. jeffro

    jeffro 1/2 ton status

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    I think it means that you are exempt from certification, but they'll still send you to the crusher of you're pulled over for polluting. /forums/images/graemlins/doah.gif

    I just noticed your other post. I guess they can randomly sodomize the state's subjects.
     
  3. Topdown

    Topdown 1/2 ton status

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    yeah... one more reason to stay the hell out of California. As if Arnold, earthquakes and terrible traffic werent enough. /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif

    I would much rather deal with the rain... /forums/images/graemlins/weld.gif
     
  4. shane74

    shane74 1/2 ton status

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    Well, here is a big question...is the origional smog sticker on the vehicle? My '74 has one on top of the grill/radiator support. REMOVE IT! Basically, that is the only proof that you ever had any equipment in the first place. Also, CA was one of the VERY few states that had emissions crap back then, so if the rig isn't an original CA rig, then chances are it didn't have any emissions gear when it came from the factory. They are f'n with you. According to the law, you are emissions exempt which means you do not need to have that equipment on your vehicle. Print out the laws, take them to court, plead not guilty. If they do it again, sue 'em in small claims court.
     
  5. BAJA_BLAZER

    BAJA_BLAZER 1/2 ton status Author

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    <font color="blue">Arq,

    Who, exactly, were you cited by (Name and Badge Number)?

    What agency (CHP, CARB, Cal. EPA, Fed. EPA) do they work for?

    What, exactly, were you cited for (Cal. Health and Safety Code, Cal. Penal Code, Cal. Vehicle Code, Fed. Codes) and Section Number(s).

    What does the citation tell you to do to remedy or contest the citation?

    How did they determine what equipment was originally on your vehicle?
    <font color="blue"> </font> </font>

    [ QUOTE ]
    I was given a citation that violates the following code H&amp;S 44011.6 Heavy-Duty Diesel Vehicle Test Procedures
    (2) The state board may also specify visual or functional
    inspection procedures to determine the presence of tampering or defective emissions control systems in heavy-duty diesel or heavy-duty gasoline motor vehicles. <font color="red"> However, visual or functional inspection procedures for heavy-duty gasoline motor vehicles shall not be more stringent than those prescribed for heavy-duty gasoline motor vehicles subject to biennial inspection pursuant to Section 44013.</font>

    [/ QUOTE ]

    <font color="blue">If you were cited for section 44011.6, it only relates to heavy-duty diesel or
    heavy-duty gasoline motor vehicles. This would not include your Blazer
    </font>
     
  6. arq

    arq 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Who, exactly, were you cited by (Name and Badge Number)?

    [/ QUOTE ]
    D. Leary I didn't get the badge numer.

    [ QUOTE ]
    What agency (CHP, CARB, Cal. EPA, Fed. EPA) do they work for?

    [/ QUOTE ]
    it was CHP and EPA, Cali EPA issued the citation.

    [ QUOTE ]
    What, exactly, were you cited for (Cal. Health and Safety Code, Cal. Penal Code, Cal. Vehicle Code, Fed. Codes) and Section Number(s).

    [/ QUOTE ]
    H&amp;S code 44011.6 et. seq. Tampered Emission Control System
    Cali Code of Reg Title 13, 2180 et. seq.

    [ QUOTE ]
    What does the citation tell you to do to remedy or contest the citation?

    [/ QUOTE ]
    tells me to put all fact smog equipment on or contest it
    provide a hearing, H&amp;S Code sec 44011.6(m) and
    Cali Code of Reg Title 13, sec 60075.1

    [ QUOTE ]
    How did they determine what equipment was originally on your vehicle?

    [/ QUOTE ]
    The books, there's some copy of pages follow the link to
    First Gen Emissions Album. Any smog shop should have this information.

    [ QUOTE ]
    If you were cited for section 44011.6, it only relates to heavy-duty diesel or
    heavy-duty gasoline motor vehicles. This would not include your Blazer

    [/ QUOTE ]
    I did notice that my blazer weighs 5850-lbs from factory /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif The section states all over 6001-lbs fall under the HDVI program.

    I am going to contest it. I have a few points starting with the DMV website that states that 30yr and older vehicles do not require smog certificate for any resons. I just want to get my documents strait. it just makes me mad to go through all this caca /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif well if it can help anyone else here it's worth it.

    ARQ.
     
  7. jmeador74

    jmeador74 1/2 ton status

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    ARQ,
    Let me say first off... I'm sorry I haven't written on here for a while guys...
    from what I have been reading in the regs it seems you are right and have a valid case... I have been reading California VC 4000.1 and it pretty much reitterates H&amp;S 44011.

    But you are going to get sick and pretty much everyone else on here from California will to when I tell you California just a passed a bill on April 12, 2004 ammending H&amp;S 44011 in part. Its bill No. 2683 if you want to search for it and read it on your own I will put the address below. Basically it repeals the 30 year rule and changes the year models of what can be inspected from 1974 to 1976. And then you'd have to read the rest of the fine print to find out what else is involved. Also somewhere else I was reading that some areas like Sacramento (Major Metro Areas)and other places have increased testing sort of like what you went through.

    http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/pub/bill/asm/

    Hope some of this helps

    James
     
  8. K5MONSTERCHEV

    K5MONSTERCHEV 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Well, here is a big question...is the origional smog sticker on the vehicle? My '74 has one on top of the grill/radiator support. REMOVE IT! Basically, that is the only proof that you ever had any equipment in the first place. Also, CA was one of the VERY few states that had emissions crap back then, so if the rig isn't an original CA rig, then chances are it didn't have any emissions gear when it came from the factory. They are f'n with you. According to the law, you are emissions exempt which means you do not need to have that equipment on your vehicle. Print out the laws, take them to court, plead not guilty. If they do it again, sue 'em in small claims court.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    That wouldnt be the brightest idea. Its required to have one, so if you dont, you just going to have to go to the referee and get a new BAR label.
     
  9. Eric M.

    Eric M. 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Basically it repeals the 30 year rule and changes the year models of what can be inspected from 1974 to 1976.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    If I'm reading this right, that is good news. So now the cut off date for vehicles needing to be smogged is 1976, not 1974.

    Can you post a more direct link to that bill? The directory you linked has 1000s of bills.

    From what I understand, it is illigal to alter, modify or remove any factory smog equipment from any vehicle. You are just not required to be inspected / tested if your vehicle is past the cut off date.

    My buddy who is a cop says unless you've got a blower sticking out of the hood, there isn't a CHP in the state that would know what smog equipment every car did or didn't have from the factory, he wants to know what you did to piss the cop off!

    What is the fix for this? If you replace the equipment, who is going to inspect it? Is it a fix it ticket that requires a cop to sign it off? You can't take it to a smog station, they have no way of testing a vehicle that old. Do you go to court and say you did it and let the judge look at it (like he's gonna know).

    Before you go head on and tackle this in court (contrary to what the laws say, the judge is going to side with the cop unless you have solid evidence), you might try and see what is required to remedy this and try and find an easier way out.

    Post up what you find and see if any of us can help you out - like a buddy in the auto repair business that will give you a reciept saying he put the smog equip. back on or a 4x4 friendly cop that will sign a fix-it ticket.

    Good Luck,

    And do tell us what caused this whole ticket in the first place, my friend (the cop) is sure you had to do something to have the guy screw with you like that ... I told him I doubt it, all cops are just buttheads, then I ran like hell!

    Eric M.
     
  10. bigyellowjimmy

    bigyellowjimmy 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    he wants to know what you did to piss the cop off!


    [/ QUOTE ]

    If I remember right he said he was just driving down the road minding his own business and was waived into an EPA roadside checkpoint. Lame huh?
     
  11. Eric M.

    Eric M. 1/2 ton status

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    Can someone post a link to his description of how he got pulled over?

    Thanks,

    Eric M.
     
  12. bigyellowjimmy

    bigyellowjimmy 1/2 ton status

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    web page

    Hope this works, never done it before.....

    EDIT....it works just click on it /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     
  13. K5MONSTERCHEV

    K5MONSTERCHEV 1/2 ton status

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    its 1975 and older.
     
  14. arq

    arq 1/2 ton status

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    Eric M.

    I didn't piss anyone off. The EPA is after 474 counties around the USA. they(counties) failed to meet the minimum air pollution standards and setup check points in distinct parts of the country.

    My county, Imperial was one of the affected. (IMO)Since we are so close to the border, people drive cars registerd in mexico(but have valid CA license). It's basicly an easy target since most of the cars registered in mexico do not meet CA emission standards.

    I was just going down the wrong road at the wrong time, EPA pulled me into the inspection point and cited me. The DMV website does state that 30yr and older vehicles do not require any type of smog certification(that's when smog pump, tubes, and other sh!t hit the fan). I didn't know it was illegal until I dug into the smog laws.

    Also, reading the codes under which i was given a citation. It states that the program is for vehicles over 6001-lbs my blazer weighs 5850-lbs. /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif

    I've been tring to contact someone at EPA/ARB and can't really get any strait answers. I just get bounced around from one organization to another... I'll give up that route and just snail mail them. certified of course /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    I did get the minimum emission requirements for my vehicle and do have most of the parts ready to put in. Those that I am missing I have purchaced and have reciepts (very important).

    I'll keep you guys posted, it's just a matter of waiting now.

    ARQ.
     
  15. Eric M.

    Eric M. 1/2 ton status

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    I think that 6001# is GVW, not actaul weight of the vehicle. You can find what your vehicles GVW is by decoding the VIN#. I had a go around with a guy at a smog shop. He didn't know the smog requirements were less restrictive as you go up in GVW. My 1 ton dually didn't pass and after making him read his smog manual and bringing my truck shop manual to his shop to decode the VIN, he ran the test again as 10,000 # GVW and it passed. I don't remember seeing any trucks that were under the 6001 GVW rating. The officer may have been quoting smog requirements for cars, not light duty trucks. My 89 manual shows 1/2 tons between 7000# and 8000# GVW, I can't imagine you're much less than that. Plus, if your truck empty is 5800#, you've gotta have a higher GVW rating for payload. Ask if someone here can decode the VIN for your year truck. I think Randy can decode anything ... he'll tell you what brand of cigarettes the guy installing the seatbelts smoked!
    If he was wrong about the GVW, maybe you could show that at the hearing and have the case dismissed. Or, at least the smog requirements may be less than what you were told.

    I'm wondering if anyone would be able to tell if your heads are not stock? If the officer didn't notice, do you think a smog shop would? Same with your intake, as long as it has any connections for smog equipment, would anyone be able to tell? You might try first, the worst they can say is try again.

    This is scary ... so much for the 570 ci with an 8-71 blower I was thinking about!!

    Good Luck,

    Eric M.
     
  16. jmeador74

    jmeador74 1/2 ton status

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  17. Triaged

    Triaged 1/2 ton status

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    I wonder what would have happend if you never opened your hood /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif

    I bet they had no way to get "probibal cause" to search your truck...you could have asked to see the search warrent /forums/images/graemlins/deal.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
     
  18. Eric M.

    Eric M. 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    I wonder what would have happend if you never opened your hood /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif

    I bet they had no way to get "probibal cause" to search your truck...you could have asked to see the search warrent /forums/images/graemlins/deal.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I was thinking the same thing ... who's gonna try? I'll post bail /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif

    Eric M.
     
  19. unick

    unick 1/2 ton status

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    if they ever mess with me ill try it.

    nick
     

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