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Failed emissions (passed the second time around)

Discussion in '1982-Present GM Diesel' started by tRustyK5, Sep 22, 2003.

  1. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    3 nice opacity spikes which put me over. One spike for each pathetic shift on the dyno. Local shop here figures if my truck had a slushbox it would have passed with flying colors.

    Jeez, it couldn't have been because the 'tech' was shifting at 1800 rpm or less on a loaded dyno...then mashing it to the floor from 900 rpm. /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif

    Gonna chuck my 35's on, already added a full bottle of the Stanadyne fuel additive. Hopefully it'll be nearly impossible to bog on the dyno with the little tires.

    Fags

    It passed today. On my 35's (true diameter ~33") bottle of standyne conditioner in the tank, and I turned my air cleaner into an open element/forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif Dang is it loud when you give it a bit of throttle! Puts a Q-jet to shame /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

    It passed with 'average numbers', max was 24% opacity prolly right at one of the shift points.

    Anyways, it'll barely do 50 mph on the little tires (no overdrive and 4.56's) I'm quite happy to have the 40's back on so at least I can keep up with traffic again. /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif

    Rene
     
  2. azblazor

    azblazor 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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  3. BlueBlazer

    BlueBlazer 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Failed emissions

    I wouldnt add too much Stanadyne treatment. The reason I say this is because I am pretty sure you can actually raise the cetane rating of your fuel so high that they fuel will light off before it has a chance to mix with the air in the combustion chamber causing black smoke. Maybe someone else can confirm or deny this. Also, you could advance the timing a bit temporarily to help clean up smoke.
     
  4. imiceman44

    imiceman44 1 ton status

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    Re: Failed emissions

    [ QUOTE ]
    I wouldnt add too much Stanadyne treatment. The reason I say this is because I am pretty sure you can actually raise the cetane rating of your fuel so high that they fuel will light off before it has a chance to mix with the air in the combustion chamber causing black smoke. Maybe someone else can confirm or deny this. Also, you could advance the timing a bit temporarily to help clean up smoke.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Ask me /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif I doubled the dose and I was shooting flames through my exhaust.
    Always go by the recomended amount.
    I talked to Diesel Mechanic after that happened, and he told me I was lucky I only doubled it, some people put more and the whole exhaust would explode.
     
  5. u2slow

    u2slow 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Failed emissions

    I just picked up a new bottle of "juice" at my local IH dealership /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif (Co-Van International is open Sundays /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif )

    Parts guy said not to exceed what the bottle says either... and if you're running good fuel (i.e. no water) you don't even need that much.

    Sounds like it migh be time for some truck plates and 5001kg /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
     
  6. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    Re: Failed emissions

    OK fella's the whole damn bottle is already in the tank...prolly 70 litres of diesel in there with it. I guess it'd be wise to fill it right up at this point to dilute as much as I can?

    Kevin, I plan on upping my GVW but the problem is they will not allow me to do that unless I pass aircare first. You can't up the GVW without a previous pass.

    I'm gonna scan the graph for you guys. The test is 140 seconds long and they eventually do a WOT acceleration to 57 mph.

    I have 3 spikes in opacity on the graph. The first spike I beleive was the 1-2 shift at about 20 mph, the second was the 2-3 shift which appears to be at about 35 mph...I think the third spike was when she slowed it down a bit and then hammered the throttle for the WOT pull to 57 mph.

    I really didn't think they'd dyno test anything on 40's /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif

    My plan so far is to top up the tank, swap my 35's on (true diameter ~ 33") and see if I can bump the pump timing up a bit more.

    Currently the timing is set about 1/8" past the mark and it does run real nice there. I'm going to see if I can get the air cleaner lid flipped upside down as well. I have a spare I can butcher if necessary /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    <sigh>

    Rene
     
  7. BlueBlazer

    BlueBlazer 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Failed emissions

    If its already advanced that much, more wont do you much good. I think youre on the right track putting the smaller tires on. There is nothing in your air system is causing any sort of restriction is there?
     
  8. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    Re: Failed emissions

    New air filter, port matched intake...all I can do is flip the air cleaner lid so it'll draw air from a larger area than the little snorkle.

    [​IMG]

    On the graph you can see the spikes. It's hard to read the little numbers to the left but about the middle of the spikes is the limit. Max allowable is 30% opacity, the worst spike hit 58%. I spent some time analyzing the graph versus the speed vs. time graph below and she shifted into third gear at 14.3 mph and stuffed it to the floor for about 10 seconds...let off a bit and then hammered down again at about 14 mph (second spike)then at 28 mph she shifted into 4th and hammered down for the WOT pull to 57 mph.

    In an automatic truck it would have been unable to lug half as bad as that and the readings wouldn't have spiked like they did. At both shifts it dropped to under 1000 rpm under load. Something nobody in their right mind would ever do.

    I will find the time to talk with the manager at the emissions place and bring up my concerns with the test procedure. I firmly believe that there should be some procedural parity so that the transmission a vehicle comes with is not a factor in judging it's emissions. The truck didn't fail as much as it was failed by technique on the dyno. That should never be an issue.


    Rene
     
  9. BlueBlazer

    BlueBlazer 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Failed emissions

    Yea, that test does not even come close to simulating real life driving conditions. I mean, who shifts into 4th at 28 mph and then stomps on it? Is this the same procedure they use with autos? Sounds really unfair to me. Most likely not your trucks fault.
     
  10. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    Re: Failed emissions

    They probably do it exactly the same with an auto equipped truck...except the auto would drop down a gear or two on it's own eliminating the lugging. Real world I let her spin til just before the gov kicks in and then shift/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif This would be on a steep hill of course...for normal driving I'm pretty boring.

    I think they could get a firm idea of the opacity on a standard truck by running it on the loaded dyno in third gear (1500-1800 rpm) and then WOT til it hits the gov. If you get excessive smoke doing that then there is likely a valid problem with the truck.

    Rene
     
  11. u2slow

    u2slow 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Failed emissions

    Rene, do you still have the option to drive your truck for the test? You used to be able to.... /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
     
  12. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    Re: Failed emissions

    Not that I'm aware of Kevin. I will get there as the place opens and speak to the manager about the test. I'd like to recomend shift points but need to know the exact details, speeds etc first. Based on the test that was just done she could have run the entire first half of the test in 2nd gear. It's quite happy doing 14-18 mph in second. as soon as she needed to do the pull up to 57 mph she should have shifted to third at about 22 mph and 4th at about 45. That's a decent 3000 rpm shift point which would drop down to 1500 or so in the next gear.

    I'm wondering if they use winter grade fuel down in the lower mainland ind if that'd make a difference? My last fill up was in late April when the truck got parked...

    Rene
     
  13. azblazor

    azblazor 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    Re: Failed emissions

    Did you look into biodiesel?
     
  14. rugger03

    rugger03 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Failed emissions

    Interested in hearing the outcome. Hope it went well.
     
  15. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    Re: Failed emissions

    I'll be re testing on Saturday morning. I'll be sure to update either way.

    Rene
     
  16. Tybee

    Tybee 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Failed emissions

    Good luck! /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     
  17. azblazor

    azblazor 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    Re: Failed emissions

    Did Steve put an "ignore poster button" in here somewhere? Rene you're hurting my feelings /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif - /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif Put a load of biodiesel in there - it will run better and cleaner /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
     
  18. big pappa b

    big pappa b 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Failed emissions

    [ QUOTE ]
    3 nice opacity spikes which put me over. One spike for each pathetic shift on the dyno. Local shop here figures if my truck had a slushbox it would have passed with flying colors.

    Jeez, it couldn't have been because the 'tech' was shifting at 1800 rpm or less on a loaded dyno...then mashing it to the floor from 900 rpm. /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif

    Gonna chuck my 35's on, <font color="red"> already added a full bottle of the Stanadyne fuel additive. </font> Hopefully it'll be nearly impossible to bog on the dyno with the little tires.

    Fags

    Rene

    [/ QUOTE ]
     
  19. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    Re: Failed emissions

    Sorry Mark, I haven't had a lot of extra time lately and although i meant to respond to your suggestion I never got around to it.

    Firstly I have not looked into availabilty here. Secondly the truck doesn't actually run 'dirty'...it was made to run dirty. Every part of the fuel system is either new or rebuilt, the timing is where it needs to be and the truck when driven normally doesn't emit any black smoke at all. On a steep grade it will smoke some black, but it's not a heavy smoke.

    Thirdly and probably most relevant is that the truck remains without insurance until I can get it through emissions testing. With nearly a full tank of regular diesel in it I would either have to drive 400+ miles before being able to fill up with biodiesel or drain the tank. I don't have the time, inclination, or patience for the first and the second option is also not very palatable.

    I may try biodiesel one day...but it won't be in the near future.

    Did I mention I'm supposed to leave for Moab in 6 days? Time is a major factor...

    Rene
     
  20. azblazor

    azblazor 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    Re: Failed emissions

    Sorry I wasn't trying to give you a hard time. (well maybe a little bit) It's just that I am learning about biodiesel and SVO and I think it has some advantages. It would make any diesel emissions "cleaner" due to the way it burns, less soot, etc.

    I was hoping to actually meet you at MOAB this year but my 85 y.o. mom just broke her femur and had major surgery last night. SO we will not make MOAB this year.

    Anyway good luck with the preparations, you will really enjoy Moab.

    PS - If you can't pass emissions with the other methods I would really try the biodiesel if you can get some...maybe drain and fill or even a partial drain and fill...best O luck!!!
     

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