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heads

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by stizkidz, Feb 10, 2005.

  1. stizkidz

    stizkidz 1/2 ton status

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    Most aftermarket heads in Jegs are close to $1000. Are there any decent heads that I can find in the junkyard that I can put on my 350? I'm looking for something that will give me some extra power without breaking the bank on aftermarket heads...
     
  2. sweetk30

    sweetk30 professional hooker Premium Member

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    96-up vortec heads 64cc chambers and 1.94 intake 1.5 exaust. need special intake for heads . but need to machine spring seats out for bigger valves. i would just buy the new heads and you get all new and just bolt on and go. much easyer to do.
     
  3. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    What is the end use? Just replacements on a stock engine, stock cam, etc?

    If you are running a carbed setup, and have no emissions inpsection, 350 Vortec heads are tough to beat, as long as you don't have any ideas for performance or fuel injection later on.

    As was mentioned, the springs are an issue that isn't easily worked around (well, it is, but more $$) the studs are press in, the castings are fairly thin, no provision to keep a carb warm/run EGR, the intake is specific enough that for injection setups they are very expensive depending on what you need want, and I'm sure there are a few other things I'm forgetting right now.

    L98 heads off of TPI Camaro's and Corvettes (although Corvettes are AL and higher compression) are probably second in line to the Vortecs in terms of stock as cast performance.
     
  4. pauly383

    pauly383 Daddy383 Staff Member Moderator

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    Lots of choices , Summit has pairs for 649.00 vortec 175 cc runners 67 cc chambers springs good to .520 lift or no vortec with 2.02's 165 cc runners 67 cc chambers good to .520 lift .

    Dart Iron Eagles in many configs are under 630.00

    World Products S/R torquer heads are under 540.00 bare , 759.00 assembled .

    Type 350 Chevy heads into google , and you can find hundreds of links to good prices .

    You can pay as little or as much as you want . But for what its worth , the vortec heads from Summit , and matching intake will make good power on a 350 , you don't need to spend a lot if you ain't racing :k5: :k5:
     
  5. beater_k20

    beater_k20 Banned

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    why would they be a bad choice for performance or EFI setups? they can be improved, however, bringing any more performance out of them is going to be a bit tougher than a pre/smog head. EFI setups are gravy, they make Vortec TPI bases, and TBI is just a 454 TBI adapter away, lots of aftermarket EFI systems use a Holley flange, square bore manifolds for this application.
     
  6. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Well, lets see. The cheapest TPI Vortec base is what, $350? For that kind of money I could have had AFR heads and used the stock TPI base.

    Yes, you can run a Vortec carb base with an adapter for TBI, and you still won't have EGR, if you need to pass emissions or don't need/want to burn a chip...more hassle. No heat crossover either, and with some people complaining of icing in some parts of the country, that would worry me somewhat depending on location.

    Any improvements needed for performance on the Vortecs means additional $$ that usually doesn't have to be spent with other heads, like AFR's, etc. Show me a *cheap* way to do springs that will handle .500" lift, or a smaller roller cam on stock Vortecs. Again you come back to buying heads that are already "modified" and cost additional over "stock" vortecs, or buying expensive beehive springs that don't require machining.
     
  7. muscle

    muscle 1/2 ton status

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    does the larger the cumbustion chamber mean more horsepower? I mean if you are building a motor from the summit catalog, would you stick with 64cc heads with hypergleuctic (sp?) 9.5/1 flat top pistons or go for larger chamber? does the larger combustion chamber mean you need higher compression pistons?
     
  8. pauly383

    pauly383 Daddy383 Staff Member Moderator

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    GM makes a tbi base for under 350.00 now that has egr provision , the downside is you have to plumb the exhaust gasses into it :k5: :k5:


    [​IMG][​IMG]
    [​IMG] 12496821 Vortec Manifold With TBI
    This aluminum small-block Vortec manifold was designed for maximum horsepower with throttle body fuel injection and EGR usage. The manifold will fit all Vortec design cylinder heads (P/N 12529093, 12558060, 12497186, and 12464298).

    Technical Notes: To use EGR, the gasses must be plumbed from the exhaust manifold into the intake manifold. Many exhaust manifolds have drilled and tapped holes that can be used to fabricate a tube. An example is the 1996 and later pickup truck with RPO L31 350 engine, which uses exhaust manifold P/N 12557828, EGR pipe P/N 10220275, and fitting P/N 12552329. That combination will fit this manifold for late model pickup trucks. Vacuum controlled EGR valve P/N 17052693 can be used on some models.
     
  9. beater_k20

    beater_k20 Banned

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    he said he was shopping the boneyard. $150 for a set of heads (ballpark), $150 for a Vortec carb intake, a couple bucks for a piece of 3/8" steel or aluminum to make your adapter. if $350 for a TPI intake is too rich for your blood, you need to find a new hobby. burnin a chip isnt necesary with a Vortec head swap. oddly enough, the Edelbrock Performer Vortec supports EGR use, either use a driver's side exhaust manifold from 96+ truck (the one you got the heads from? ) or have a bung welded into your headers, run a hose to it, and you're golden. icing is associated with open base intakes, like the Edelbrock Air Gap series. dont use an air gap, and you wont have these problems, and probably save yourself a few dollars in the process.
    this is where it gets easy... Crane or Comp Cams, cant remember which, offer a tool for like $30 that will allow you to cut your own valve guildes down, add a $40 (new GM) set of valve springs from a 93+ LT1, and .525" of lift suddenly isnt out of the question.
     
  10. 91GMCSuburban

    91GMCSuburban 1/2 ton status

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    You have a part number for this intake?
     
  11. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Guess it's just me...I wouldn't feel good throwing heads off of a wrecked vehicle onto a motor and *hope* that the springs aren't shot, the valves seat good, and so on.

    Add up the parts in my engine and come back and tell me that. And if $350 for a "stock" TPI base (when you already have another that comes with the TPI setup) that requires an EGR adapter kit, isn't expensive compared to a $150 carbed base, you are from a different planet.

    Guess you've never run EFI that didn't come with Vortecs have you? Or maybe you did, and just let the knock sensor handle the problem with way too much timing.

    Well lets see...the GM TPI EGR kit is $70 or so, I suspect TBI (or whatever) would be similar priced. And if you have figured out that manifolds suck for power, and want headers? Well, have fun with the external EGR setup. And a hose? What is exhaust gas temp? 500-1000*? I don't know anyone that would attempt to run plain hose in that setup, obviously GM didn't think it was a good idea or the metal hose wouldn't exist.

    I think there are a few people on this board that will disagree with you. No wait, there is a post where they just were talking about their carbs icing up, and they weren't running air-gap intakes. Neither was Ford when they ran coolant under their carbs.

    And this is why I said just for bolting onto a stock carbed engine with no emissions, they are fine. This is EXACTLY why these heads are a pain later on. You're talking about $70 just for better springs (almost doubling the price because of a tool you will use once) and once again, your time and effort tracking these down and doing the work on them. If you know you want performance later on, pony up and get better heads right off the bat. Don't forget that if you have good rocker arms already, you can't use them, since the Vortecs use rail rockers, so you are either stuck with the used ones on the heads, or new ones. Another item to change IMO when you swap heads, pushrods seem to go through used rockers fairly regularly.

    Don't know where I heard it but to misquote, if better heads for performance "is too rich for your blood, you need to find a new hobby."
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2005
  12. ss396

    ss396 Registered Member

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    Jeg's carries Edelbrock and Holley TBI manifolds, they are much cheaper then the GM intake.

    I went with the Holley, but that was a big mistake. For one, I had to buy an EGR re-locator housing because the TBI interfered with the EGR location. Had to build a new bracket to mount the MAP sensor.

    The Edelbrock's picture matched the stock original and the EGR mounting was further away from the TBI. The difference is that the Holley has 2" bores, where the Edlebrock has 1 11/16" bores.

    My setup works fine for now.
     
  13. 76SILVERADO

    76SILVERADO Registered Member

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  14. beater_k20

    beater_k20 Banned

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    the intake is the Edelbrock 7116, it was not the Performer however, it is the Performer RPM.
     
  15. beater_k20

    beater_k20 Banned

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  16. Jonny-K5

    Jonny-K5 1/2 ton status

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    personally i want to get the AFR torquer's for my 89'. they have a good rep, and are brandspankin new. i think 800 is a fair price for good set of heads. much prefer to get a ready to go setup that costs a little more than do a bunch of searching in boneyards for crappy factory used junk.

    i didnt know there was so much hassle w/ the holley TBI manifolds. good to know.
     
  17. beater_k20

    beater_k20 Banned

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    AFR doesnt make Torquers, World Products does.
     
  18. Jonny-K5

    Jonny-K5 1/2 ton status

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    whoops. for some reason i always get those two mixed up.
     

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