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I Dont Want to go 1 ton!!?? (help)

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by GEORGIA GABE, Jun 16, 2005.

  1. GEORGIA GABE

    GEORGIA GABE 1/2 ton status

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    First off. Im sure this has already been asked. I have tried to search for information on the 12 bolt vs 14bff axles. Everything comes up b/c alot of people list what they are running. ( if there is a way I can search differently please let me know )
    I own an auto repair shop in atlanta and have no problem building a rear end. I just dont have alot of experiance with heavy duty offroading with a 12bolt. From everything that I have read on ck5, everyone is running 1 ton gear ect. If I really need to swap out to a 14bff axle then I will. I carry a spare axle shaft with me right now but I have open diffs front and rear. If I put a locker and swap gears out in the rear end will it really be a waste? are the aftermarket 12bolt axles not strong enough? Is there anyone out there that is running a 12 bolt d44 combo that is happy with it. right now it is also my daily driver so i really want to stay with the 12bolt ect. ( side note: I really like my wheels)

    ok I have said 12 bolt way too many times now. Thanks in advance for any information.

    gabe
     
  2. jekquistk5

    jekquistk5 Weld nekid Premium Member GMOTM Winner

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    Ask Paul383, At least I think thats his name, he swears by 12 bolts
     
  3. Pookster

    Pookster 1/2 ton status

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    You never said what size tires. or on what truck.

    The general consensus is that you can run anything you want- Breakage depends on too many factors. Some people run 10 bolts for years without problems, and others break them with normal driving. Same goes with 14Bff. A heavy right foot will break just about anything.

    If you dont want to go 1 ton, you can still go 3/4 ton, which some people also swear by. A 14Bsf is also plenty beefy, just not a FF.

    Even if labor is free, a locker for a 12b and a 14B (ff or SF) is marginally the same price. But here's what you dont get:

    Larger brakes- Much needed to stop some large tires.
    Full floating Axles- just a safety factor.
    larger bearings- Something's gotta support for 42" tires.

    You could spend the money to get a 12b rear disc conversion, if you can find it, a C - clip eliminator, but the bearings are still the same size.

    Only consideration is what kinda wheeling you want to do- if weight is a serious consideration..
     
  4. jmd4x4

    jmd4x4 1/2 ton status

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    Like pookster said it all bepends on what kind of driving you will be doing and what size tire you want to run. When you figure that part out then you can find out if the 12 bolt will hold up.

    later
    jmd
     
  5. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Everything depends on usage.

    10 bolts lasted myself no problem, until I started getting hard on them, on the street, and the gov-lock was the weak link.

    I've got a friend that uses solely 1/2 ton stuff to 4 wheel, (and has for many many years) typically 35"+ tires, and hasn't broken anything except a front D44, and then only because he jumped his K5 in a tough truck competition.

    If you like your 6 lug wheels, your "best" option for a stronger axle is a later 6 lug 14SF, if you do need the additional strength. Not as strong as the 14FF, but better ground clearance, less weight, and comes stock with 6 lugs in some applications.

    Open differential in any axle is going to increase how much abuse it takes, (thus, I'm sure in my case a 10 bolt open would have never broken) solely because the power has a "way out". You just won't be as capable wheeling.
     
  6. GEORGIA GABE

    GEORGIA GABE 1/2 ton status

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    sorry about the info. I thought it was coming up on my sig. 87 blazer 350( out of a 95 3/4 ton) throttle body injected. 700r4, 35 inch bfg m/t, d44 12bolt.

    as far as what kind of wheeling. I want to be able to do alot of the stuff at tellico. I have been up there when I still had 33s and little experiance. I have a heavy foot and there are plans to pull the engine and build a really strong (torque) motor.

    heres a pic of the rig
    [​IMG]
     
  7. Pookster

    Pookster 1/2 ton status

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    There's always a selectable locker. :)
     
  8. Bubba Ray Boudreaux

    Bubba Ray Boudreaux 1 ton status

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    Nope, that's just the Kool-Aid drinking cheapskates :D
     
  9. pauly383

    pauly383 Daddy383 Staff Member Moderator

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    I'm running a 12 bolt with a locker , 3.73 gears and 33" tires . I love it .

    I do carry a shaft , spiders , lockright springs/pins , gear oil , and some RTV .... just in case .

    Plenty strong to a certain point , that point is different for each of us .

    I will also be running a 12 bolt in my trail truck with 35's , 1350 yoke , and a locker . In my case I suspect I will break more front shafts and joints tha rears .

    If I had any REAL money I would get 2 Superior shafts , quality gearset , Real Detroit Locker , and disc brakes :D
     
  10. jmd4x4

    jmd4x4 1/2 ton status

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    Clean looking rig, with what you said about wheeling if you keep the 12 bolt open you might not have a problem. but if you put a locker in there you might start having brakage. But you want know for sure until you are out there playing.

    later
    jmd
     
  11. 81jimmyslt

    81jimmyslt 1/2 ton status

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    You said Tellico, heavy right foot, and if you plan on running bigger than 35" tires I would consider the 1 ton upgrade.

    There is a local k5 in town here that is running 44" boggers on stock drivetrain. I ran into him offroad and he says he doesn't even wheel it because it breaks all the time.


    Jesse
     
  12. shane74

    shane74 1/2 ton status

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    I have been running 38x12.50's for years w/out breakage and I'm hard on my D44/12B combo. I think the one saving grace for me is the fact that my diffs are open. Also, my 350 isn't putting out a lot of grunt, so that helps some too.

    You CAN build a pretty strong 12B, but even a alloy shafted, cryo'd 12B will barely be as strong as a 14SF. There are things you can do to beef it up, but you will need to add up the cost of what it will take vs. the cost of swapping in a heavier duty rear end.
     
  13. dhcomp

    dhcomp 3/4 ton status Premium Member

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    I think you are really limiting yourself keeping your diff's open at a place like telico.

    THis right here should be your deciding factors. Heavy right foot + torquy motor + 35's + possible locker in the future = broken 12 bolt stuff.

    I would reccomend that you go with a 14 sf if you really want to keep your wheels. the SF should be plenty strong if you are going to stick to 35's
     
  14. gravdigr

    gravdigr 1/2 ton status

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    Not all 3/4 ton axles are SF. AFAIK the SF came on vans and burbs. But if you use a 3/4 ton truck as a donor you'll more than likely get a FF axle. And as was said you can throw $500 at a 12 bolt and maybe get the strength of a stock 14BFF which can be had for around $100. I just went 3/4 ton with an open front, gov lock rear until I can afford a cucv 1 ton drivetrain with 4.56s and a detroit.
     
  15. TrcksR4ME

    TrcksR4ME 1/2 ton status

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    Whats your reason not to go with a 14 bff? Just that you want to keep your current rims? You can get adapters to go 8-lug to 6-lug, many people around here have gone that route.

    When you start talking heavy duty 4 wheeling, and the money it would take to build a 12 bolt versus running a stock 14 bolt, it just doesn't make sense...to me. You can generally pick up a 14 bff for $150, detroit locker for ~$400, disk brake conversion is bolt on for ~$150-200, and your pretty much done.
     
  16. Bhintz

    Bhintz 1/2 ton status

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    I was in your boat 3 years ago and trust me you want the 14bff the locker is about 150-200 cheaper, and much much easier to install, and are you looking to get a 12 bolt b/c they didnt come in your year k5 so youd have to swap one in which would be flat dumb b/c theres no difference between the 10 and 12 bolt, I ran a 10 bolt up front (which are stronger than rear 10 or 12bolts) and broke everything in it once or twice w/ just 35s up at tellico, and especially if you have a heavy right foot you are going to snap it in half, and is a great piece mind knowing you dont have to worry about breaking it, for ex. right now Im running 40s and bring spare shafts and u-joints for my dana 60 but nothing for the 14bff b/c it not going to break unless something freak happens, and were is your shop at???
     
  17. pvfjr

    pvfjr 1/2 ton status

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    Well I thrashed my 44/12b for 3 years in the rocks with 36's. I consider myself lucky, and to tell you the truch, I was worried about the 44 a lot more that I was with the 12b. I felt the same as you for a long time, but I'm tired of being open diff, and I don't want to put lockers in 1/2 ton gear. Not only will that be investing money in something I should replace, but it will probably make them break. So, I'm finally taking the plunge. :D
     
  18. jekbrown

    jekbrown I am CK5 Premium Member GMOTM Winner Author

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    if you plan on torque and lots of heavy right foot action, you might as well go ff14b in the rear at least. They are as bomb proof as you can get for such a cheap axle. 3/4 ton is fine for most uses... and the good thing about it is that you always have that ff14b rear to fall back on if the front grenades. If a 10/12b rear end explodes... you're in real trouble and its gonna be a pita to deal with. A ff14b is stronger, probably won't break... and even if it did you could always remove the rear drive shaft and front-wheel drive it to civilization. Any axle who's tire/wheel literally leaves the vehicle when a shaft breaks is not the kinda thing you want to have offroad.

    j
     
  19. CHEVY 4WD

    CHEVY 4WD 1/2 ton status

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    You CAN build a 12bolt but its not really worth the money if your really going to stay that way just collect 12bolt parts and complete rear ends the last one I got I got with a 10bolt front both open both need brakes with 3.08 for $20(wanted to give them to me but I gave him $20 anyways because he knows my dad pretty well) anyways I dont think you will have a super big problems with axles but rather then the carrier. I wanted to say 6Lug too so I had my hubs turned down and bought adapters I love the 14Bolt because its STRONG and I play around on the street too(I love dry road donuts :grin: ) and never have to worry about it AT ALL. But I have freinds that say half ton but they just dont play so hard sometimes and when somthing breaks you know why...
     
  20. rick88blaze

    rick88blaze 1/2 ton status

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    I'm running a D44 and an Auburn locked 12 bolt with chrome moly shafts in the 12 bolt and 4.56's and 33's right now. So far I am loving it. It does great off road (plenty of torque in lo and hi) and on the highway. I do plan on upgrading to 35's next year sometime. I was really hard on it Memorial Day Weekend and didn't break anything. 2 other K5's broke front shafts at the u-joints, one was a D44 and the other was a 10 bolt, but they were both running 35's and had rusted joints in their front axles.

    Oh yeah, I've got an '88 K5 with the 700R4 and a stock 350tbi.

    and yes I wanted to go with a ff14 when I bought my D44 and 12 bolt, but I couldn't beat the price on them and I was in a time and money crunch. I got my D44 and 12 bolt for $400 and they only had about 6000 miles on the rebuilds with the new gears and Auburn posi.

    Rick
     

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