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Is anyone else excited about "How To Build a 4-Link" in 4W&OR?

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by Greg72, Jun 3, 2003.

  1. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Is anyone else excited about \"How To Build a 4-Link\" in 4W&OR?

    Maybe it's just me, but I really enjoyed last month's article on the basics of multi-link design, and this month's issue they really got into some in-depth discussion.

    I know there will be SOME folks here for which this info is too "basic", but I'll bet the majority of folks will really learn something and maybe get excited enough to consider tackling a project like that???

    On a related note: It's cute that they suggest drawing all this stuff out on graph paper, but I think after about two iterations of designs that didn't work I'd be fed up with THAT system. Anyone know of a very "simplified" CAD-type program that could help with the early design work? I dunno...plug in the CG, and a few constraints....link positions and angles, and maybe have it calculate the IC, Roll Centers and maybe even show the predicted wheel travel arcs???? Am I asking for too much here??? /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

    I could probably build an Excel spreadsheet to do most of it, but it would probably take me longer than the graph-paper way!
     
  2. Seventy4Blazer

    Seventy4Blazer 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Is anyone else excited about \"How To Build a 4-Link\" in 4W&OR?

    yeah, i just finished reading the second part. wish they had shown on a front axle...
    i want to keep my springer setup.
    i need to get mine on the road for a while, then i will go back and link the front. and if i ave a trailer once the front is done ill also do 4 wheel steering and full hydraulic steering front and rear. but i got to get what is on my plate eaten first.
    Grant
     
  3. Don

    Don 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Is anyone else excited about \"How To Build a 4-Link\" in 4W&OR?

    I got the Mag. yesterday, and read the entire, 4 link section last night, I was kinda thinking about doing this, now that I can see what Their talking about, it doe'snt sound too much like rocket science. /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif
     
  4. arq

    arq 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Is anyone else excited about \"How To Build a 4-Link\" in 4W&OR?

    i thought it was a good intro. i'm learning myself but gotta start somewhere. i got hooked when i saw a blazer just glide through some nasty bumps, it was like a cadillac.

    ARQ.

    PS: so when are you going to finish that program, j/k /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
     
  5. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

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    Re: Is anyone else excited about \"How To Build a 4-Link\" in 4W&OR?

    I read the introduction and it made me mad cause I bought the magazine when I saw "4 link tech" or whatever on the cover. Have to go get the next issue I guess.
     
  6. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Re: Is anyone else excited about \"How To Build a 4-Link\" in 4W&OR?

    [ QUOTE ]

    PS: so when are you going to finish that program, j/k /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    [/ QUOTE ]


    ARQ,

    So far I'm through diagrams 1,2 & 3....I've got those parameters plugged into Excel with some simple Trig to calculate link lengths for angles from 5* to 10* (their stated minimum and maximum angles allowed). So far it's been pretty straightforward, but I think a few diagrams from now (like when they start showing roll axis and instant center) I'm gonna be screwed...... /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
     
  7. Triaged

    Triaged 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Is anyone else excited about \"How To Build a 4-Link\" in 4W&OR?

    Not looking forward to the 3d stuff??

    Just think about it like you are drawing it on graph paper and go from there...

    Man I love SolidWorks /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
     
  8. Pure Insanity

    Pure Insanity 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Is anyone else excited about \"How To Build a 4-Link\" in 4W&OR?

    Sorry not to HiJak your post, but if you have the new Petersens, how is the write up on the Florida ride Fred Williams went on? I was part of that ride. (I was Blazerless tho /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif)
     
  9. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Re: Is anyone else excited about \"How To Build a 4-Link\" in 4W&OR?

    Dan,

    I think what spooks me there is all the "imaginary lines" that become part of it. Excel is good at tabular data, but once you have to start showing graphical relationships between data points, it's going to fall on it's face! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

    I have to say that the Excel thing is already helping understand some very "basic" relationships. For example: If you try to connect the lower links to the axle centerline (on one end) and the exact bottom of the framerail (on the other end) the link seems to be longer than you'd want. Making a few simple concessions (adding a small 2" drop bracket off the frame for example) allows that lower link to get substantially shorter!! The same is true if you move the link on the axletube side up a couple of inches. Not earth-shattering stuff, but I'll bet it wouldn't be so obvious from the "graph paper sketching" method unless you were REALLY studying them hard.

    Im sure something like SolidWorks is another "order of magnitude" better in terms of helping with those revelations and "light bulb in your head" ideas..... Oh, well. Maybe I'll take the Excel thing as far as practical and then just build some mock-ups at 1/3 scale or something to help with the 3D visualization???


    PI,

    The Florida Swamp Run was 3 paragraphs and 6 photos (most of them rather dark) on two pages. I'm not sure if that's what you were expecting.....looked like a gooey, messy time! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
     
  10. Don

    Don 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Is anyone else excited about \"How To Build a 4-Link\" in 4W&OR?

    Do You mean, the "Gator Ride"? Have'nt read it yet, but it looked interesting. Only 44's will get You away from the Gator's! /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif
     
  11. zakk

    zakk 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Is anyone else excited about \"How To Build a 4-Link\" in 4W&OR?

    it has recieved mixed reviews on the PBB. It is a good learning tool, and that seems to be the idea. It's not good, from what i read, to use only this magazine to build a 4 link
     
  12. Pure Insanity

    Pure Insanity 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Is anyone else excited about \"How To Build a 4-Link\" in 4W&OR?

    [ QUOTE ]
    PI,

    The Florida Swamp Run was 3 paragraphs and 6 photos (most of them rather dark) on two pages. I'm not sure if that's what you were expecting.....looked like a gooey, messy time! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

    [/ QUOTE ]YER KIDDIN! He took over a dozen rolls of film, we were on the trails for like 6 hrs and thats all? GEEZ! Thats a disappointment. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

    But at least we had fun and Chris got last months cover!

    Thanx for the info...Ill leave your post alone now.
     
  13. BorregoK5

    BorregoK5 1/2 ton status

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  14. Triaged

    Triaged 1/2 ton status

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  15. Triaged

    Triaged 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Is anyone else excited about \"How To Build a 4-Link\" in 4W&OR?

    A scale moddle is really the way to go. There is no better way to see what things like making the lower links shorter than the top will do.

    Some 3/8" wooden dowel w/ some eye-screws on the ends, a few 2x4's, and some screws can go a long way.

    You could even mock it up full size on your truck in much the same way...it is knowing what you are looking for that is the hard part (and why the people that do it right get payed the big bucks).
     
  16. Mudzer

    Mudzer 1/2 ton status Author

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    Re: Is anyone else excited about \"How To Build a 4-Link\" in 4W&OR?

    I think they have a good issue all around - Coil Over info, 4 Link, Air Bag info...

    Greg, If you need someone to help with drawing your suspension in CAD, I would be glad to help. If I find a freeware CAD Package, I will let you know. You might try www.cadalog.com



    Good stuff. /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     
  17. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Re: Is anyone else excited about \"How To Build a 4-Link\" in 4W&OR?

    [ QUOTE ]
    I haven't played with the Performance Trends 4 link yet (I just downloaded it).

    I have played with SusProg
    http://www.bevenyoung.com.au/win95.htm


    [/ QUOTE ]


    Well I just spent a little time downloading and messing with Performance Trends 4 Link..... maximum vehicle weight allowed is 3200 Lbs (Yeah right!) and it's a little strange seeing the suspension modelled using a Camaro sillouette, especially with 38" tires!!! /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif

    It has this annoying message about resetting my values "back to Camaro specs", but I'm not sure yet if it it throwing away my values or just posting annoying messages.....
     
  18. BorregoK5

    BorregoK5 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Is anyone else excited about \"How To Build a 4-Link\" in 4W&OR?

    I had to unlock mine with a crack to really start adding values and comparing. This is more focussed on drag racing but it allows you to set the wheelbase, tire size and weight distribution along with the link lengths and their relation to each other. With some creative manipulation of the actual weight (equally reduced overall) this helps to provide Instant Center Length, Instant Center Height and Anti Squat percentage and dynamic changes to where the links are located. Still, having a 3d representation like solidWorks or Lightwave helps a lot for articulation mapping.
     

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