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Just rebuilt the engine, but it won't start... ----UPDATE! IT STARTS!!!----

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by dawson444, Jan 4, 2004.

  1. dawson444

    dawson444 1/2 ton status

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    Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start... ----UPDATE! IT STARTS!!!----

    I just finished rebuilding my 350, the thing just won't start. I am messing with the distributor, turning it. It back fires sometimes, but just won't start, I have tried swtiching the wires around thinking that it was 180 deg out, but that didn't do it either. Please help! BTW- the 2 plugs for the injectors, does it matter which plug goes on which injector?

    It is an 88K5 w/ TBI. Thanks!
     
  2. big83chevy4x4

    big83chevy4x4 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    when i first fired my motor up it took awhile to finly stay running. it backfired quite a bit also it would fire on a couple cylinders then backfire and quit. you do have some one to help you right? i tryed to do it my selfbut it was imposible to turn the distributer then run back and crankit. just keep at it and it will start.

    oh yea you do have the right firing order right 18436572 /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif
     
  3. big83chevy4x4

    big83chevy4x4 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    oh i forgot you need to turn the distributer very slow while cranking to get it to fire /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif good luck
     
  4. 55Willy

    55Willy 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    my painless wiring kit claims " it doesn't matter which injector plug is on which injector."

    also are the valves too tight and not closing to get preasure??
     
  5. dawson444

    dawson444 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    I do have the firing order right. Last time I went through this, I just kept messing with it and finally got it. I guess I will just keep at it. It is just really starting to piss me off. Thanks!
     
  6. thor

    thor 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    Should'nt be that frustrating....
    1. check tdc again (verify the 180 thing) by pulling #1 plug and turning it until it blows your finger off the hole.(all timing chain sets don't actually put you at #1 if you are using their mark to go off finding #1)
     
  7. cybrfire

    cybrfire 1 ton status Vendor GMOTM Winner

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    Sounds like it is 180 out to me. An easy way to verify is move your plug wires around the distributor. Put your number 1 wire where number six is and go around from there. 1,8,4,3,6,5,7,2. If you are 180 out it will start up this way.
     
  8. rjfguitar

    rjfguitar 3/4 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    [ QUOTE ]
    Sounds like it is 180 out to me. An easy way to verify is move your plug wires around the distributor. Put your number 1 wire where number six is and go around from there. 1,8,4,3,6,5,7,2. If you are 180 out it will start up this way.

    [/ QUOTE ]I agree, it sounds 180 off, I did that to with my 406 and all it would do was just backfire terribly.
     
  9. gravdigr

    gravdigr 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    CRank the engine to TDC and pop off the dist cap and check where the rotor button is pointing. I bet ya a glazed doughnut that it isn't pointing at 1 or 6.
     
  10. Beast388

    Beast388 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    If it is backfiring, it is getting fuel and spark, so it sounds like it needs to be dead timed like the others have suggested. Make sure you don't overcrank it while trying to get it fired. You are wiping off the cam and engine lube and possibly risking engine damage by doing so. /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif
     
  11. Thumper

    Thumper 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    How did you preadjust your valves? If you followed the book, chances are they are too tight. If you do them like it says, the hyd lifters dont have any pressure in them, so when you tighten them till the pushrods wont turn, then crank the motor, the lifters get oil pressure and pump up... opening all the valves ... thats what happened to mine.
    Its worth a try to back all the valves off, then try to start it.
    Then adjust them again after the oil is pumped up in the lifters...

    Mike
     
  12. dawson444

    dawson444 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    Ok, this is really pissing me off. I have tried turning it 180 deg a couple of time, and slowly twisting it each way. I then started over with the wires. I got the #1 cylinder at 8 deg. BTDC, figured out where the rotor way, put the cap on, and connected the #1 wire there, then went around clockwise, and put the rest of them on in the firing order. That didn't work, so I switched them 180 deg. after shocking the crap out of my self, I twisted the cap both ways while turning it over, still won't start!!!!!

    As far as the valves, I did it the way my rebuild book said to do it. I got them where certain cylinders were rocking, it had a chart. I then tighted the nuts down until I could barely turn the push rods, then I turned them a 1/2 turn after that.

    I am going to go talk to my mechanic tomorrow. Please help me though!!!!
     
  13. fortcollinsram

    fortcollinsram 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    Okay let's work through this...

    First, readjust the valves...If you cranked them down until you could BARELY TURN the pushrod and then did a 1/2 turn ontop of that, they are WAY TOO tight...Put #1 at TDC and loosen the rocker nut until both arms are loose. then slowly tighten the nut while spinning the pushrod until you only feel a SLIGHT drag on the pushrod. This is ZERO-LASH. Then do a 1/2 to 3/4 turn ontop of that. The idea is to get the pluger in the lifter about 1/2way through its travel. Make sure you have the motor primed as the oil on the ends of the pushrods helps you feel the light ammount of drag at zero lash. Go through each cylinder ensuring it is at TDC and adjust the valves.

    Once the valves are adjusted, put #1 at TDC again and insall the dist. with the rotor point at or slightly before the #1 terminal on the cap. Then run the wires (1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2) and you should light 'er up. And i DOES NOT matter which injector connector is on on which connector.

    Chris
     
  14. dawson444

    dawson444 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    When re adjusting them like that, it seems to me that if I tighten it down until I feel a slight drag, and turn it up to 3/4 of a turn it will be close to as tight as I have it now, I could be wrong though. It also seems to me that even if the adjustment is off some, it would run, just run like crap, but again I could be wrong.

    Like I said I am open to suggestions, so I am sure I will try this tomorrow. Thanks for the help!
     
  15. big83chevy4x4

    big83chevy4x4 3/4 ton status

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    you can hear it building compression right? had to put head gasket on my sisters car with a 3.1 and the book said to tighten the rocker nuts to 18 ft lbs (WTF /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif) and it didn't even sound like it was cranking over just a fast buzz. did it the convention way and started up. but anyway, my dad always told me the motor needs 3 thing to run and if it dont run you missing one....
    Compression: check valves to see if you did it right
    Fuel: you are getting fuel right
    Spark: need to set timing correctly

    heres what i did on my motor.
    get #1 to TDC
    make mark where rotor is pointing, put cap on
    put #1 wire on nearest..... thing /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
    put rest of the wires on in correct order clockwise
    crank engine over while turning distributer over and spraying starter fluid in carb.

    you did set the cam timing correctly, right?
     
  16. fortcollinsram

    fortcollinsram 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    Well, if you tightented the nut until you COULDN'T spin the pushrod anymore, then that means teh lifter plunger was FULLY collapsed and then you did another 1/2 turn ontop of it. This means that the valves will never even come lose to seating once the lifters "pump up" with oil and the plunger expands...This could resuld it lots of crazy stuff life back fireing b/c the air/fuel mixture would be forced out of an intake valve that would normally be closed on the compression stroke. Just some food for thought... /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
     
  17. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    [ QUOTE ]
    When re adjusting them like that, it seems to me that if I tighten it down until I feel a slight drag, and turn it up to 3/4 of a turn it will be close to as tight as I have it now, I could be wrong though.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    The lifter plunger (think thats correct term) has "movement" built into it. (a spring under the pushrod seat) As was mentioned, when oil starts to flow (cranking) the lifter will "pump up" forcing the pushrod "up" which can only result in the valve(s) opening. Relative to valvetrain geometry, the movement you "took up" by tightening the rockers that much is probably huge.

    The correct procedure is to do the slightest drag trick, then approx. 1/2 turn more. From magazine testing on a dyno, as I recall, more or less than 1/2 turn didn't hurt nor help.
     
  18. lukebaby1

    lukebaby1 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    To set valve lash on a small block chevy. First you need to turn crankshaft while watching the number one cylinder rocker arm located in line with the number one cylinder exhaust port valve. As soon as you see it start pushing the exhaust valve down (opening) stop there. Now you can be assured the intake valve lifter is on the flat lobe of the cam before the intake stroke. This is the point where you adjust the lash in the intake valve lifter pushrod assembly to zero (by spinning well lubricated pushrod till resistance is felt), then add 1/2 turn preload. Next move to next cylinder in firing order and repeat all of the above. Use a good hand pump oil can with some synthetic 10-30w to get the whole assemblies (rocker arm, pushrod, top of lifter) good and wet with oil. Take your time if you go to far then just keep rotating crank back to where you messed up and try again. Remember to do all the intake valves in the first cycle, then the exhaust the same way. (intake valve starts to open, Stop adjust exhaust). By doing a nice even valve lash setting your cam bearings will love you. and the cam will spin unrestricted once good oil pressure is established. Good Luck! /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
     
  19. slider

    slider 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    For easy and clean valve adjustment proceedure go to, http://www.centuryperformance.com/valveadjustment.asp
    Read it over a time or two and adjust the valves the quick way as they show. I use this every time I adjust valves and have never had a problem. Hope this helps Slider /forums/images/graemlins/truck.gif
     
  20. Longhorn4x4

    Longhorn4x4 Registered Member

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    Re: Just rebuilt the engine, but it won\'t start, please help!

    To adjust the valves:

    Adjust the intake valve when the exhaust valve for that cylinder just STARTS to open (when adjusting valves, always rotate the engine clockwise facing the harmonic balancer). Starting with the rocker nut
    backed off all the way, tighten the nut until there is a
    SLIGHT drag on the pushrod as you spin it with your fingertips. The lifter cup should still be up against the retainer snap ring, but just barely. Now tighten the nut another 1/4 to 1/2 turn. Rotate the engine until the intake valve is ALMOST CLOSED, and repeat the above adjustment procedure on the exhaust rocker.

    I always prime my lifters with oil from a squirt can.

    To set the timing.

    Turn the engine over until compression blows your finger off of the spark plug hole on the number one cylinder. This should happen BEFORE the timing mark reaches 0 on the timing tab. Line the timing mark up with about 16-20 degrees BEFORE TOP DEAD CENTER (about 16-20 degrees advance). Now install the distributor and align the rotor tip with the post on the cap for the number one cylinder. Put the rest of the wires and ignition system together. Put a spark plug in the end of the wire for the number one cylinder, and lay it where the body will ground. Turn the key on in the ignition switch, and rotate the distributor until the spark plug fires. Now rotate the distributor clockwise about 45 degrees, and then rotate it counter clockwise until it fires the plug and stop. Tighten the hold down bolt on the distributor snug so you can adjust the timimng after the engine starts.

    You will have to rotate the distributor rather sharply for a late model (electronic not point type) distribotor to spark.

    I use the above procedures everyday at work, so they work for me without fail.

    Hope this helps.
     

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