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Kinda New Any Help?

Discussion in '1973-1991 K5 Blazer | Truck | Suburban' started by 58 apache, Aug 27, 2006.

  1. 58 apache

    58 apache 1/2 ton status

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    i have a 1958 apache front halfed with k5 4x4 running gear. 400 SBC mild build real th350, np208 10 bolt front and rear front discs rear drum power steering. all right here we go. i am in the process of making this a daily driver. a friend and i built it a few years back and he knew way more than me we skimped on some things and i want to make it the best i can now for a daily driver. mild off road use. the engine is a fresh build. tranny needs rebuilt but as i understand is a great tranny,pre 73 vaccuum only. should i go to 12 bolt? i plan on maby a 33 or 35 x12.5 tire size? what gear ratio? what brand? remember primary street and towing 4x4 to get unstuck and into rural areas. i want to upgrade to disk brakes in the rear is that a big deal? especially if i am getting a new rear. do i have to change anything? what about a 4 inch lift? kinda soft springs? we put 3 body to clear frame. is the 208 a good transfer case? can it be rebuilt seems to bee leaking.is it worth upgrading to a a 700r4? i will be driving it often, like everyday, i cant seem to get out of it!!!

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2006
  2. Muddytazz

    Muddytazz 1 ton status

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    Nice looking rig man and welcome.

    My opinion is, if your going to be pulling a 20 footer with a short wheelbased rig like that I'd upgrade to 3/4ton running gear. A 12bolt rear isn't much better than the 10bolt you have in the rear now, but it is better. I don't know much about the 700/208 as I've never owned either so I can't give my opinion on that.
     
  3. BowtieBlazer

    BowtieBlazer 1/2 ton status

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    before I suggest anything and my experience with classic vehicles my questions to you are:

    Have you ever had it up to 70mph or new hwy speeds? How does it handle?

    I know some vehicles I have lots of experience with never were ment to or needed to do 70mph as they got very squirrely and not comfortable at all to me. That being said, you can choose your drivetrain accordingly.

    I'd look into a 14FF mearly to get "free" gearing so to speak say 4.11's and the Full Floating axle shafts for peice of mind while towing such a load. The y are as cheap as or cheaper to upgrade than a 12 bolt. Might as well look at 35's as most only spec out to a true 33 anyway. And tranny wise if you are stuck on an auto i'd look into a beefed up 700r4 as you plan on DD anyway.
     
  4. 58 apache

    58 apache 1/2 ton status

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    thanks and i have had it doin 80 and no problems. dosent even shake. it was put together right. i would like to do the 700r4 is there alot involved in the changeover? where should i get one? money is no object reliability is. and the NP208? should i buy new front and rear 14's is there a diff in mounting these compaired to the 10's i want a soft spring 4" lift any suggestions? THANKS ALOT GUYS I FEEL LOST IM USED TO BUILDING BIKES AND I HATE FEELING LIKE A DUMBASS!!!!
     
  5. Muddytazz

    Muddytazz 1 ton status

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    3/4ton front and rear axles will bolt right in to your existing rig, with only a conversion u-joint. Front what I have read, the 208 is a really decent tcase. Its chain driven like the 203 with the 205 tcase being the best.
     
  6. 58 apache

    58 apache 1/2 ton status

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    another stupid question, what is ff or full floater? and are 3/4 ton axles hard to get? and will bolt up?
     
  7. Muddytazz

    Muddytazz 1 ton status

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    FF or Full Floating means that the axle shaft is held in place by 8 bolts on the outer edge of the bearing hub. Benefit is if you break an axle shaft you can still drive your rig home without the wheel falling off. Semi-floating axles (10bolts, 12bolts and 14sf's) are held in place by a "C" clip inside the diff. If you break an axle shaft on one of these, you'll have to replace the shaft before you can move again (or call for a tow). Show your local papers, www.craigslist.com and search your area, watch our for sale section. They are not hard to come by and bolt right in. Will need new u-bolts, 8 lug wheels and the rear axle will need a conversion u-joint for the axle yoke to driveshaft.
     
  8. jekbrown

    jekbrown I am CK5 Premium Member GMOTM Winner Author

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    for your use, I'd recommend a sf14b rear end. 6 lug wheels will work with it... decent clearance... and stronger than a 10 or 12 bolt rear end. You can disk-brake them to. BWP has a kit to do it.

    For springs, I'd recommend BDS. They have a "no BS" lifetime warranty. They can be had pretty inexpensively also. Try JDsoffroad (google it)... these are probably the best riding of the inexpensive springs. If you want to $pend more, you can always get a custom set from Deaver or Alcan. If I was you, I'd just use BDS and $ave your ca$h for other aspects of the project (like rebuilding that trranny!).

    that is a very good lookin' truck you have there... I'm diggin it!

    j
     
  9. 58 apache

    58 apache 1/2 ton status

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    thinking about a bowtie overdrive 700r4 stage2, np 205 dana 44 front and a 60 rear. can i use or adapt for 6 lug wheels? any opinions? anyone know where i can get a new or gov spec 205 what about the danas?enyone heard of boyce equipment? internet site. dana 44 gov spec in crate 1400$ dana 60 410"s gov spec 1800. good price?
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2006
  10. jekbrown

    jekbrown I am CK5 Premium Member GMOTM Winner Author

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    a 700R4 would work if you need OD... if you don't, I'd toss a th400 in there. Cores are cheap, and a rebuild is cheaper than almost any other tranny.

    Dunno about D60 rear axles... there were offered in so many trucks that at least some of them have to be 6 lug... right? lol! thats the cool thing about the sf14b. Not really in high demand, good 'n' strong and pretty much bolt in. Well... for newer chevies they are bolt in... dunno about a 58. lol!

    As far as rebuilt cases, you could get one from NW Fabworks (they are a vendor here and top-notch in every way)... prolly be a lot cheaper than Boyce. Another alternative would be to just get a cheap craigslist np205, buy the $150 (shipped) rebuild kit on ebay and have a local shop rebuild it for you. Shipping really is expensive these days... don't even want to think about the cost of shipping a 205 across the country. yikes!

    j
     
  11. BKinzey

    BKinzey 1/2 ton status

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    That is one purrrrrty truck!:bow::bow::bow::bow:

    The 14BFF is the way to go, since you are on the East coast look on eBay. There is a guy selling new mil-surp with a Detroit Locker & disc conversions for $750.

    A built 700R4 is also an nice choice. If you got the $$$ check out an Overdrive/Underdrive by Gear Vendors. There is a second company as well but thier name escapes me.....

    The 208 will probably do just fine for you but if you want what the rock crawlers drool over go with the 205. Make sure you read up on it though as there are a lot of options and you'll want whats best for you.
     
  12. 58 apache

    58 apache 1/2 ton status

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    ok i figured out the 14ff but what is a 14bff? if i put the 14 in the rear what do i put upfront? is upgrading to a 205 simple? what options are there for the 205 and how do i know what i want?will only be mild off roading but i want to build a bullet proof rig that i can drive everyday with no worries ! thanks for all of the imput
     
  13. Goose

    Goose 1/2 ton status

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    14ff and 14bff is same thing. (14 bolt full floating)
    The 14ff takes an 8 lug wheel which means you want an 8 lug wheel up front also. That typically means a Dana44HD (a 3/4 ton Dana44) or a Dana 60 (one ton).
    Dana 60 is alot stronger than the Dana44HD, but they go for around $1000.
    The Dana44HD is basically the Dana44 with 8 lug hubs and I think a couple other upgrades, so not much stronger than the 1/2 ton (D44)
     
  14. Goose

    Goose 1/2 ton status

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    The NP205 (new process 205) is the all gear drive transfer case used in 1 ton vehicles. The NP208 (new process 208) is chain driven. It's also used in 1 tons and was put in the military 1 1/4 ton trucks behind a diesel and TH400.
    The NP208 has a lower low range. The NP205 has a pto port and upgrades include twin stick. (Look at the reviews on the home page of this site)
     
  15. Goose

    Goose 1/2 ton status

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    The different transfer cases take different adapters from the transmission. They also require different drive shaft lengths.

    One option for parts would be to watch out for a 73-87 3/4 or 1 ton chevy to source the axles, drive shafts, wheels, and maybe transfer case and tranny.

    Oh yeah....
    nice truck.
     
  16. 58 apache

    58 apache 1/2 ton status

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    thanks. i appreciate all the help! iv learned from building choppers that it is much cheaper to have a build plan and do it right the first time. every one on here has been real helpful to this NEWBIE!! so i think the ultimate set up for double duty is a built 700r4 a 205 14FF rear and a dana 60 front?
     
  17. K5er4Life

    K5er4Life 1/2 ton status

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    sounds like your on the right track. IMO the best thing about a front 60 for a daily driver isnt necessarily the strength as you wont need it on a mostly street truck with 35"s but the best thing is the larger brakes. The calipers on the front 60 are huge and will be nice to stop that truck in a hurry. I like the 700 idea, with 35" I would run 4.56 gears. 700's dont take alot of abuse before they heat up and die so with a nice gear ratio it will have an easy life and with overdrive you wont be screamin on the highway. As for the 205 it can be done with realitive ease but the 700 is a 27 spline output and most 205 have a 32 spline input, there has been a thread or two on here about adapting a 205 to a 700. Or you really could just go with a 208, theres aboslutely nothing wrong with them for a daily driver. They have a nice low range and are strong cases, the weak point is the fact that the actual case is aluminum and the guys running rock dont like them for that reason, they can crack if hit hard enough. Were as the 205 has a nice cast iron case thats a rock crusher. But once again IMO a 208 would fine for a daily driver/dirt road driver. You cant go wrong with a bowtie overdrives 700, they make awesome trannys and if setup properly with the right gears will be a great trans for that truck. I like your idea with the 14ff and dana 60, but you really could just run a dana 44 front if money is a huge issue which it sounded like its not in this build. I would love to have a truck like yours with a similar drivetrain 700/208 14ff and a 60 front. Topped off with a tuned port 350....mmmm.....sexy. That would be a very reliable setup to drive and get decent mileage.

    Nice truck too by the way. Keep us posted with what you do to it.
     
  18. 58 apache

    58 apache 1/2 ton status

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    it has a 208 now. can it be rebuilt? it is leaking a little but works ok. is the 700 a good choice if it heats up? i will be running the best cooler that is made. 4.56 gears? i dont understand the concept fully i guess i mean i think that refers to the rpm of the engine in relation to the rpm of the axle. is there a formula like hp+tire size+weight=something? or is it more preferance
     
  19. ryoken

    ryoken Puppy Fabricator Premium Member GMOTM Winner

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  20. BowtieBlazer

    BowtieBlazer 1/2 ton status

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    The axle prices are great if you have little or no time and lots of money.

    Np205 isn't a complete necessity and the 208 you currently have can be rebuilt but you need to keep in mind spline counts and match them up.

    Older sm465's are 10spline outputs
    Th400 output 32 splines
    84 and newer SM465 and NV4500 are 32 spline output as well
    TH350 and 700r4's are 27 spline outputs

    NP208's come with a 27 and 32 spline inputs depending what trans they came behind

    Np205's came with 27, 10, and 32 spint inputs (the ten spline inputs are refered to as figure 8 style 32 spline are usually a circle 6 pattern)

    Anything can be coupled with factory or AA(Advanced adapter) Kits

    I think a NP208 should serve you well for your app.
     

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