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Loyalty to a friend, or do the right thing?

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by newyorkin, Dec 7, 2005.

?

Loyalty to friends or "Right"?

  1. I would keep quiet and ignore it, stay loyal to the friend in the face of it

    5 vote(s)
    21.7%
  2. I would turn my back on him/turn him in to the relevant authority.

    7 vote(s)
    30.4%
  3. I am naked, none of my friends like that, but they are still loyal to me.

    11 vote(s)
    47.8%
  1. newyorkin

    newyorkin 1 ton status

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    Suppose you have a friend, say he/she's a co-worker, and you know they're doing something wrong. Whether it violates a company policy or not is a unclear, but it's clear that what they're doing is far from "right" or the right thing. You would even consider it morally wrong.

    This individual also knows the activity is wrong and tries to "hide" it, but knows that you're not stupid and know about it.

    Do you support (or turn a blind eye to) his activity out of loyalty, even thought you know he's doing something wrong?

    Or do you go ahead and turn him in, or turn your back on the friendship?
     
  2. mikey_d05

    mikey_d05 1 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    Circumstances and conditions man. There are a million variables in your situation that we know nothing about.
     
  3. newyorkin

    newyorkin 1 ton status

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    To expand on this, say you have a friend, and you're both in an argument with another group.
    Your friend begins to come up with things that you totally disagree with. Do you continue the argument with the other group and support your friend, or do you recluse yourself from it, or do you start disagreeing with him?

    This isn't really applicable to the poll, though, I just kinda came up with it now.
     
  4. mikey_d05

    mikey_d05 1 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    Recluse yourself from it. Otherwise if you sign onto your friend's scheme or whatever you'll soon be sucked into an argument that you don't like or believe in. The farther along it goes the more difficult it will be to get out.

    Just my .02 anyways.
     
  5. newyorkin

    newyorkin 1 ton status

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    I'm not particularly in a situation, I just imagined there was potential for one.

    Come up with your own situation, the standard can be applied to many situations.

    Say your manager, who is a great friend also, appointed a family member to a position, and you know it was purely a favor, the person is barely qualified for the position. It's not a position youwanted either, it's lower than you.

    Or say you have a married friend in another department who is sleeping with a manager.

    I'm asking about a standard, basically, do you overlook right for the sake of sparing a friend some misery, or do you adhere to right for the sake of the right thing. That's the gist of it.
     
  6. randy88k5

    randy88k5 1/2 ton status

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    I would let him know that you know, and tell him you think its wrong and wouldnt do it, but you are a stand up guy and wont be a rat. I wouldnt turn any of my friends in. If circumstances are serious, I would plead ignorance if questioned.

    Just what I would do...
     
  7. hunterguy86

    hunterguy86 1/2 ton status

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    It really depends on the circumstances here. If the friend is doing something that can harm he/she then I would turn that person in for their own safety. If they can harm you or others defenatly turn them in. They will be mad for a while but they should come around and see that you protected them. Its kinda like takin the keys from a drunk driver.

    As far as arguments go, if you dont agree then get out and try to take no side. If your opinion is needed evaluate both sides as much as possible before you commit to anything.

    All this said I voted naked just cause it sounds fun.
     
  8. mikey_d05

    mikey_d05 1 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    :haha: :haha: :haha:

    I thought this was an issue that you were struggling with and trying to figure out the right thing to do.

    Generally if the offense is petty enough, I look the other way. If it is so large that my conscience won't let me ignore it, I offer said friend an ultimatum. If that doesn't work, I hate to be a little girl about it but I'll go to someone higher than myself. Calling it ratting or doing the right thing, I really don't care either way.
     
  9. Can Can

    Can Can Pusher Man Staff Member Super Moderator

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    If his actions can affect your job by reason of guilt by association, turn him in. If he's ripping the company off, turn him in. If he's got his dink in a secretary, or he's just causing trouble for someone else, mind your own business. He'll hang himself eventually.

    I would boil it down to this: If he is breaking the law or breaching company policy, he need to be turned in, ESPECIALLY if you know about it. If you don't you become a co-conspirator, whether you like it or not. If he's doing something that is basically immoral, but not against the law, tell him to smarten up and leave it at that. If you have noticed the behavior, chances are other have as well.

    One thing I would make sure to do is DOCUMENT EVERYTHING, just in case you somehow get dragged into the mire.
     
  10. ak bandit

    ak bandit 1/2 ton status

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    Canmore gave some good advice. If it were me, I would first confront the person. But if this person is doing something wrong and he/she knows that other people know about it, he/she is not very bright. As much as it sucks, anything that violates company policy should be reported. Even if it is a friend. If they are violating company policy and you know about it and say nothing, it's jeopordizing YOUR job as well as theirs. Sorry, but no friend is worth that. My family comes first.
     
  11. cbbr

    cbbr 1 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    I was with you right up to this. If I were in that type of situation, I would not document anything, or allow anything to exists that could tie me to it. Plausible deniability.

    Some people (me) fall under ethical rules that will cause me to lose my license if caught failing to report bad stuff. Because of that, I stay away, far away from anything that is against the rules. Breaking the law (think DUI) can cause a license suspension.

    No license = No paycheck.
     
  12. Leper

    Leper 1/2 ton status

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    If it is really a friend, tell him straight up how you feel. Let him make the decision to break the friendship or stop doing what he is doing.

    We need more info than you are providing.
    Is he surfing porn?....Tell him to stop or be fired.... Dipping in the married cashier? Mind your own business..... Stealing money/goods? Report him ASAP.... Is what he is doing any of your business?....Mind your own business...... Did he hire someone unqualified for the position.....Hell 90% of the people I work with are not qualified for the position, or were hired as buddies..... Is he doing drugs/alcohol at work.....Fire the jackass.
    MY .02
     
  13. 4by4bygod

    4by4bygod 1/2 ton status

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    Make sure there's no way your "friend" can take you down with him, that's the most important thing. then I would get a new friend. you owe no loyalty to one who is dishonorable, and aren't obligated to deal with him any more than you have to.

    I've always been a " turn a blind eye " type of guy when it comes to shifty co - workers, as I never wanted to deal with the drama and retaliation that goes with the teritory. At the foundry I worked at, I knew who was dealing coke on the loading dock, who was stealing tools, and who was stealing castings to sell on the scrap market.. they all got popped eventually.

    I could have done the "right thing", I suppose, but I didn't need my truck torched either. I just avoided the scumbags, stayed friendly with everyone, and did my job.

    If other people know of the goings - on, chances are the boss does too, and what was true on the playground holds true today.. nobody likes a snitch, and you might become a target of not only this guy, but those who like him.

    turn a blind eye, not out of loyalty, but for self preservation.

    Tom
     
  14. Can Can

    Can Can Pusher Man Staff Member Super Moderator

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    cbbr:

    I guess I should have clarified my position on the documenting thing. I wasn't referring to stuff that was criminal/against company policy. I was actually talking about any conversation you had with the guy about anything- in the event he tries to involve you in the crap, you will have a well-recorded history showing that you were not involved with any of his shady dealings, and had no idea it was going on.

    Does that make it clearer?
     
  15. 84k5

    84k5 1/2 ton status

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    Somebody in your office looking at porn?:whistle: :wink1: :doah:
     
  16. Z3PR

    Z3PR Banned

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    I would confront your friend, tell him/her what you know, and tell them you won't tell on them, but if the boss confronts you, that you won't lie for them either.
     
  17. newyorkin

    newyorkin 1 ton status

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    I'm not in a particular situation, so I'm not looking for advice. I'm just wondering what the general consensus is.

    One of the elements of the fictional situation would be that the friend knows you're aware of his activity and he's trying to maintain it on the down-low, so talking to him about it is not really a valid option. Talking might as well be reprimanding.
     
  18. Resurrection_Joe

    Resurrection_Joe 1 ton status

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    Friends don't let friend be ****ups
     
  19. boggerless

    boggerless 1 ton status Premium Member

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    stick to your gut instincs RATCH.i you feel its wrong stop,and tell your friend how you feel.it'll work out. and you keep your integity.:laugh:
     
  20. 3 on the tree

    3 on the tree 1/2 ton status

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    If this person really is a friend, then you can talk to them about the situation. Anybody who knowingly compromises your personal integrity is NOT a friend! By not addressingthe situatio, you are leaving yourself open to blackmail,among other things. To me its kinda like seeing your dog doing something its not supposed to do. If you let it slide, then the behavior escalates, till you have no choice but to drop the hammer. Don't let it get that far.
     

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