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Maybe the Ex-Commie has got a good idea.

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by chalet2506, Jan 8, 2007.

  1. chalet2506

    chalet2506 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070108/ap_on_re_us/california_health_care


    I'm not a big fan of government involvement in much of anything. But, I'm starting to think we need some sort of state sponsored healthcare plan.


    Maybe its because I'm getting a little older, or maybe it's cause I have kids now. But I've been thinking about this a lot lately. He's right, hospitals are legally obligated to treat people, we might as well figure out a way to pay for it. Even if you've got private insurance, your still paying extra premium to cover people that don't. We might as well all pay into the same program.

    I'm on my wife's insurance through the school district she works for. Deductible's and copays we pay suck. I carried an individual policy on us for a while(I'm self employed). It was expensive, and sucked on top of that.

    I don't have the answer, but I think that a state system would be better than the current cluster going on in healthcare today.
    .
     
  2. gjk5

    gjk5 3/4 ton status

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    I think a state sponsored system would be great for middle/upper middle income folks who can't afford or won't pay the outrageous price if ins. Poor folks already get their health care for free, so no change for them.

    But then again; state sponsored ANYTHING comes with it's own set of huge problems.
     
  3. chalet2506

    chalet2506 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    I think it'd help small business. It'd be a lot easier to attract good people if I could offer up healthcare that was the same as large companies offer.

    If poor folks are working, and their employer had to kick in a percentage of their wages, they'd be paying.
     
  4. newyorkin

    newyorkin 1 ton status

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    I have mixed feelings on that. It's a good idea on the surface, but it would probably change the healthcare industry a lot.
    Who decides how much each person is required to pay? If I make $100k a year and you make $30k a year, and we both have to pay $4000 a year, but I go to the doctor once a year, and you go 12 x a year...why should I be forced to pay $4000 for my annual checkup, while you only have to pay $4000 for your brain surgury, lasic vision correction, kids tonsilectomy, wife's botox treatments? At least with insurance and private healthcare, I can decide to drop coverage and pay cash (or credit card) for my once a year visit.
    But if you make it tiered by income, then again, why am I paying $10,000 for my checkup, while you pay $1500 a year for everything else?
    It is kind of a communist concept.

    But on the other hand, people who are terminally ill and can't work (legitimately) should not be thrown on the street and forced to fend for themselves and try to come up with the cash to buy the best treatment.

    When my daughter was born, we had really bad health insurance. We were moved along like an assembly line in the hospital.
    When my son was born, we were a little further along in life and had great insurance, and we had something almost like a luxury suite for his birth...

    I should probably read the article before commenting...
     
  5. 89GMCSuburban

    89GMCSuburban 1/2 ton status

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    Mitt Romney had a pretty good idea for health care for MA....and yes, he was the REPUBLICAN governor of Ted Kennedy and Kerry's backyard. Check it out if you get a chance.
     
  6. chalet2506

    chalet2506 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    I don't like commies, but there's certain things a government needs to provide if your going to keep a country in order. roads and bridges, military, education system,etc. And, (I'm starting to believe) a proper health care system.
     
  7. newyorkin

    newyorkin 1 ton status

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    It's like everything else, tehre's good and bad with it. Will it affect the quality of healthcare? Will it severely burden the treasury, etc?
     
  8. gjk5

    gjk5 3/4 ton status

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    I just read the whole article and I think it's BS for the state to REQUIRE me as a small business owner to provide health care. If I don't provide it and a prospective employee needs it, move on and find another employer.
     
  9. chalet2506

    chalet2506 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    There'd be some details to work out. That's why we let the lobbyists pay the legislators big bucks. Right?:wink1:
     
  10. Bubba Ray Boudreaux

    Bubba Ray Boudreaux 1 ton status

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    Maybe our Canadian friends would like to comment on this topic. I still remember the enlightening conversation I had with Rene a few years ago about it:haha:
     
  11. chalet2506

    chalet2506 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    I am a small business owner, and I think it'd be a good idea, as long as every other business is required as well. Big and small. Kind of like your FICA, SS, and unemployment taxes.
     
  12. pauly383

    pauly383 Daddy383 Staff Member Moderator

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    Too much government is bad government , period . I don't think our forefathers meant us to get where we are now .

    Personally I could do without another social program designed to keep you voting for your handout handing politicians ( regardless of party ) .
     
  13. gjk5

    gjk5 3/4 ton status

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    Sure, as long as I can lower their wages to make up for it.


    Sorry, not trying to be a smartass, but I already pay my employees fairly and above the norm for the area, enough for them to live well and me to make a profit. Should I be forced to live on less in order to provide them with insurance?
     
  14. 73k5blazer

    73k5blazer Unplug the matrix cable from the back of your head Premium Member

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    WHAT???? He's human? I saw him get hit many times with bullets and a fuel truck he was driving turned over and burned, and he walked right out.

    How is he laid up with a broekn leg?
     
  15. gjk5

    gjk5 3/4 ton status

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    Range accident with a Westinghouse Model M-18A2 LA3PG Light Anti-Personnel Phased Plasma Gun.
     
  16. chalet2506

    chalet2506 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    No, you don't abosrb the cost. You pass the cost along to the customer. That's why everyone has to buy in. Otherwise, you try to buy in for your people, and the fly by night operation down the road doesn't and they're lowballin your business.

    What it boils down to is this, healthcare shouldn't be something that people have to make a "should I buy it or not" decision about. I've got guys that work for me because they're old with health issues, and nobody else will hire them. I don't offer insurance. They're pretty much screwed when something happens. And there's more like them out there every day.

    BTW, your not a smartass.
     
  17. gjk5

    gjk5 3/4 ton status

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    Well, while I see your logic as a business owner as a consumer I would also say "WTF, now I have to pay more so that these jokers can have insurance?"


    Ultimately I don't think it's the government's job to mandate health insurance, but I do think it's their job to clean up the medical and health insurance professions. It's all a huge scam, and if it wasn't I could afford ins or pay cash as I do not but not resent it.


    The Dr.'s, Hospitals and Insurance companies are the ones making loads of loot out of the whole deal (I hate hearing about how selfless they are and how Dr.'s "serve the greater good"). We recently had our second child and both of them have been an eye-opening experience to the world of "Health Care Providers". As soon as the local "Not for Profit"/"Charity" hospital found out we owned a home and made a decent living, there were no discounts available. But if we made below the poverty level, well then they would pick up the cost or defray most of it. (On subsidies from the gov't paid by OUR tax dollars)

    We called back and pretended to be someone else and asked for an estimate (BTW, they WILL NOT give you an actual estimate, just a very rough range, I can lose my license for refusing to give a client an estimate) turns out that what they would bill insurance is roughly 60% higher than what they will take cash. Wonder why our insurance rates are so high?


    It's all just a friggin scam.


    rant off.
     
  18. 4by4bygod

    4by4bygod 1/2 ton status

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    Having state sponsored health care just means higher taxes to pay for it, waiting lists, the gov't deciding what operations you do or don't need, and more gov't laws mandating healthy living and eating choices to keep costs down..

    Tom
     
  19. diesel4me

    diesel4me 1 ton status Premium Member

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    I like it...but it has its drawbacks..

    I'd be dead if not for our state sponsored medical program most likely,so I cant say its a bad thing..cancer would have gotten me,had the state not paid for my operation to remove it..

    I worked for 20+ years,had Blue Cross/Blue Shield at 2 places,but since I was young and healthy,I hardly used the benifits I was entitled too--only a few dental visits and eyeglasses,and minor injuries..as I aged,my health got poorer,as do most people--and it was then I was working in a store that didn't want to offer its employees health insurance--I asked about it,and they said "talk to us after you've been here 90 days..

    I waited 18 months ,then spoke up again--they just about threw the paperwork at me,said "here's what we have to offer--like it or lump it"..I found I'd have nearly 70 bucks a week taken out of my 297 dollar take home pay!!..I said "F" that,I'll put the money in the bank,and hope I never get sick!.:doah:

    Then I learned our state health program "Mass Health" will pay almost all medical expenses if you earn less than 13,000 bucks a year,and only a bit less as you income climbs it to the limit where your no longer eligible..so after I quit my job a year later,I was actually better off than I was when I was working,as far as having health insurance, and not having to pay for any co-payments,etc..

    I can get most prescriptions for 2 dollars,less if its heart medication or some other pills--just the other day I paid 1 dollar for Naproxen pills that would have cost 39 bucks ,had I no health insurance!..

    I will say though,that the level of "care" you get at the doctor or hospital is very noticably less than if I'd announced I had Blue Cross--they roll out the red carpet and rush you right in when you utter the magic words"Blue Cross"--but tell them your a pauper on Mass Health,they tell you to have a seat--and you'll spend the better part of a day getting simple X rays or other tests that take only minutes to perform..just went thru this again today at my doctors office.

    Hardly anyone there in the waiting room,but as soon as I get there,I need to fill out two pages of info--they are "updating" everyones records--mine hadn't changed,but I still had to waste a half hour filling them out..:mad:

    Then I end up waiting in the examination room for another 30 minutes--the doctor spent a grand total of 5 minutes with me,and looked in his computer screen more than he did with me!..I felt he did nothing!..and get this--if I was to "not show up"--he gets a 50 dollar "no show" fee!..must be nice to get paid for NOT working!..:mad: :mad: ..this is why our health costs are so high--GREED!!...
     
  20. 3 on the tree

    3 on the tree 1/2 ton status

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    I CANNOT afford health insurance, period. I tore up my rotator cuff early this summer. $190 just for a doc to look at it for less than 10 minutes! No X-Rays, or anything like that. Of course, if I had insurance, the doc would send me for MRI scan at 2 grand a visit.:mad:

    I wonder why the government has NEVER investigated the medical profession for price gouging, or fixing prices.????????????????
     

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