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MIG welding the spiders on a 14bolt?

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by jjlaughner, Jun 18, 2004.

  1. jjlaughner

    jjlaughner 3/4 ton status

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    What do you think?
    I'm using argon and .030 wire on my 85amp welder. I can get some decent welds that hold. My stick welder is only a 70amp and it uses 1/16" rod.

    If I have someone else weld it what rod should be used?

    I'm thinking of jethro locking it if that matters /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
     
  2. BowtieRed

    BowtieRed 1/2 ton status Author

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    if jethro does it, i think he can figure it out . . . he's slightly good at welding. . . slightly
     
  3. Zeus33rd

    Zeus33rd Smarter than you GMOTM Winner

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    Don't use rod of any kind. You'll spend hours cleaning all the slag and $hit outta there. Your welder should be fine. Here's a post describing how I do it..
    Clicky
     
  4. cybrfire

    cybrfire 1 ton status Vendor GMOTM Winner

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    I did what you did and then cut some small peices of bar stock to fill the voids between spiders and side gears and welded them in solid as well. Over kill maybe.
     
  5. BlueBlazer

    BlueBlazer 1/2 ton status

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    I dont think 85 amps is gonna do it, especially using solid wire. Maybe with flux core youll get good penetration. My spiders were welded with a co-workers 250 amp Mig on my old K5 and the welds held up fine. I dont think I would trust my 135 to do the job. Just my opinion, I am not a welder by trade so I may be wrong.
     
  6. darkshadow

    darkshadow 1 ton status

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    the steel of the gears is so hard that they would shater around the welds and even so the welds are just there to wedge the gears from turning so even if you use a crappy welder turn up the heat as much as you can and go to town i dont think you can do it wrong. I would make sure you tack the gears in place befor you remove them, so that they will alline.
     
  7. GORRILLA

    GORRILLA 1/2 ton status

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    Not sure, but I think you have to preheat the carrier to 400 degrees to get a good weld. I used a rod burner with rod called chemtool, really strange stuff, it grinds with a neon orange color, but is rated at like? really high psi.
    Can't remember... /forums/images/graemlins/doah.gif
    And, since the 14 bolt can be found in alot of places, under just about every 3/4 ton and 1 ton, forget the spiders, weld the side gears. you can get 3 or 4 passes
    mine hasn't failed yet.
    As for the slag, i covered mine with rags, lots of em.
    I also heard if you'll coat the ring gear with soot from acetylene that the slag won't stick.
     
  8. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

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    actually the method of just welding "wedges" as done in the tech article is deemed a crappy way of doing it around here. Causes wear and play in the gears, and no matter what the tech article says this is not an alright thing. Welding the gears together is the only way to go.
     
  9. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

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    I personally don't think I'd attempt it with either of those welders. Neither are going to provide enough heat to make a good weld.

    I've stick welded 14 bolts before with good results, but if I was intending to use it on the street I'd probably MIG weld it.

    I think a 220v MIG is going to be necessary here though. I've never used a 135, but a 90 or 125 amp welder won't weld all that thick of stuff and in my opinion isn't going to be enough to fuse the gears.
     
  10. jjlaughner

    jjlaughner 3/4 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Don't use rod of any kind. You'll spend hours cleaning all the slag and $hit outta there. Your welder should be fine. Here's a post describing how I do it..
    Clicky

    [/ QUOTE ]


    I've got full page prints of those pictures in the garage for when I get ready to do it /forums/images/graemlins/waytogo.gif
    I was worried about the slag from rods, thats why I want to use the mig (plus I'm alot better behind a mig)

    1/4" to 3/16"
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    3/16" to 3/16"
    [​IMG]

    I like the idea of welding in small rods between the gears then welding over them also /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
     
  11. jjlaughner

    jjlaughner 3/4 ton status

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    I've drilled the ends of cracks in exhaust manifolds and heated it up with the torch and welded the crap out of it with the mig and its still on the truck 25K miles later and no noticable problems yet. So heating does work on that stuff. I wonder if it would help on the spider gears?
     
  12. jjlaughner

    jjlaughner 3/4 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    I did what you did and then cut some small peices of bar stock to fill the voids between spiders and side gears and welded them in solid as well.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I like that idea


    [ QUOTE ]
    Over kill maybe.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Have you seen my floor replacements /forums/images/graemlins/deal.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/waytogo.gif
     
  13. Zeus33rd

    Zeus33rd Smarter than you GMOTM Winner

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    There is no need for preheating anything. No need to over think this...hehe, alot of you are. If he can do 3/16 to 1/4 with his machine, he'll do just fine. Just max it out and take it slow as to not hit the machines duty cycle limit. If done the way I showed in the link above, with 24 seperate welds holding it together, it's not gonna go anywhere. I've done so many of these I could almost do it blindfolded....almost. /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif
     
  14. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    Use a bigger welder. I'd say a 175 amp MIG machine minimum.

    Rene
     
  15. jjlaughner

    jjlaughner 3/4 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Use a bigger welder. I'd say a 175 amp MIG machine minimum.

    Rene

    [/ QUOTE ]

    /forums/images/graemlins/dunno.gif Dont have one... the 85 is it, we are limited to 110v in the garage till the shop is built /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
     
  16. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

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    Take it somewhere else. That isn't enough heat to melt the gears.
     
  17. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    It's not enough Jeremy...no way to sugar coat the truth. You'll have to take it to someone with a bigger welder if you want it to hold up.

    Sorry...

    Rene
     
  18. jjlaughner

    jjlaughner 3/4 ton status

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