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Motor rebuilding questions..advice for the damned

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by supersize75, Jan 25, 2004.

  1. supersize75

    supersize75 1/2 ton status

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    well we all know the story so no need for pictures /forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

    I now have got 2 good 350's, 2 bad 454's and 1 blown 350 sitting in the driveway infront of the truck, ya I look redneck right now /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

    soo tommarow the 454 is comming out and the 350 is getting thrown in so I can rebuild the 454 and do it right.

    I want a mild 454, not to loppy of a cam but enough to make the thing get up and go!

    so where do I start?

    the block will need work I think, either a spun bearing or??

    so what do I start with? I have heard about getting a motor magnafluxed and sonic checked, I plan on a comp exstream 4x4 cam, steel crank or getting mine cut and polished.

    also I think a rev limmiter would help my motors last alot longer, I learned big blocks dont like 5000 rpm at all. /forums/images/graemlins/ignore.gif

    who sells rev limiters? I already have an msd dist I just went through today and rebuilt, does the 6A kit have a rev limmiter?

    any other build advice is very welcome, I want to build this thing! and since I am throwing in a motor in "it ran when I last drove it" shape I need to do this in the next month or so.

    thanks for any advice /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif

    Help me do this right /forums/images/graemlins/1zhelp.gif

    p.s. A 205 t-case with the croos member and a front drive shaft still attached is one heavy s.o.b.!! /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif
     
  2. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

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    6A = no rev limiter

    6AL = rev limiter

    You can also add the rev limiter to your current system by itself if desired.

    I personally would rebuild the motor as cheap as possible. Hone it, clean it up, and rings/bearings/gaskets. Throw a new cam in it, break it in, and call it done.

    You're just going to trash it anyway. No sense in spending money. I wouldn't spend more then $400-500 on the whole thing.
     
  3. bablazer73

    bablazer73 1/2 ton status

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    Ok, first thing. what year is the 454. do you know what heads? are you planning on staying with whatever heads are on it? No matter what, the block should be cleaned and fluxed. do you know why the bearing spun? oil problem? rod end? over rev? Comp cams 4x4' extreme are good cams. Cast crank is fine, but a steel would be stronger. I run cast cranks.
    Rev limiters are great. the std 6 box doesn't have rev limiter, but you can add 1 on. The 6al has one built in. You can buy chips for whatever rpm you want. I have a 5600 pill in mine.

    I would have the engine balanced. An often overlooked and important step! I would also consider a better harmonic balancer. Harmonics, the silent killer!

    Who is going to assemble it?

    and yes [ QUOTE ]
    A 205 t-case with the croos member and a front drive shaft still attached is one heavy s.o.b.!!


    [/ QUOTE ]
    It's even heavier with the "crossmember" still on it. croos member??
    /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif
     
  4. supersize75

    supersize75 1/2 ton status

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    Tim, could I do that for under 600 bucks?

    cam I looked at was 100 bucks from summit

    lifters I have a rollers and are bran new, about 3 minutes on them so I hope I can use um, also I have heard bad thing about hydro lifters /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif true/false?

    I immagin I could hone the motor? I think my dad has something for that.

    I assume the rev limmiter is exsternal for the add on one?

    the whole thing kind of sucks though I was really wanting to get the doubler done first, well you guys are right about the constant breaking taking away from upgrades /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

    I like the budget idea alot, but I want this to move, maby a 3 way valve job and keep the big money in exsternal parts that could be used on another motor /forums/images/graemlins/deal.gif
     
  5. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

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    Did you actually spin a bearing? If so, which one(s)?
     
  6. mountainexplorer

    mountainexplorer 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    p.s. A 205 t-case with the croos member and a front drive shaft still attached is one heavy s.o.b.!!

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Remember to lift with your back, and not with your legs. Wait a minute, thats not right. Oh yeah... thats why my back is the way it is. /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

    You gonna install the 205 manually with no jack? /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
     
  7. mountainexplorer

    mountainexplorer 1/2 ton status

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    What is the history on the motor then? year/vehicle it was out of etc...
     
  8. bablazer73

    bablazer73 1/2 ton status

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    Don't waste your money on 3 face valve jobs. If you are going to "budget" rebuild, then that would be a waste of your money. I personally am not a big fan of "short cuts" They usually end up hurting you later. I live by the overbuild is better than underbuild. I understand money is hard to come by, but better to spend once than twice.
    If the motor has spun a bearing, I would be a little more careful on the rebuild. It has already been stressed. are you replacing the rod that spun??

    What have you heard about hydrolics being bad?? I am running hyd rollors in my 454.
     
  9. mudjunkie 82

    mudjunkie 82 1 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    What Damage is done to the block? Did it spin a main bearing? Is this a 2 bolt or 4 bolt main? The reason I ask is sometimes it is cheaper to find another block than to repair the one you have. Hydrulic lifters are fine .cast crank is fine. as far as honing goes leave that to the machine shop. As far as a budget goes 600.00 might be a little thin. if you spun a main bearing and it did a lot of damage the block might have to be line bored. also the crankshaft Journel might have to be welded and turned.The best thing to do is pull the motor and see what damage is done.
     
  10. HarryH3

    HarryH3 1 ton status Author

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    [ QUOTE ]
    cam I looked at was 100 bucks from summit

    lifters I have a rollers and are bran new,

    [/ QUOTE ]
    Am I deciphering this correctly? /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif Do you have roller lifters? If so, then the $100 cam won't work. You must run a roller cam with roller lifters. The contact patch between the cam and roller is so small with a roller lifter that it creates huge pressure on the cam. A cam designed for use with flat tappet lifters will self destruct when used with roller lifters. Roller cams are made of a much harder material and prices start at closer to $300. /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif
     
  11. wheelieking71

    wheelieking71 Registered Member

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    hey shawn, the most important thing you are gonna need to have done is get the block cleaned. you can do this yourself, just buy a block cleaning brush kit, and dont miss any oil passages. if you do, all your hard work will be trashed. but you will get much better results if you have it done professionally. if you do all the assy. and disassy. work the machining processes really arent that expensive. they do add up though so only get done what needs to be done. if you spun a main bearing i would reccomend that you start looking for another block. the machine shop will have to surface grind all the main caps. then re-index and bore and hone the main journals. that is usually followed by resurfaceing the deck surfaces to insure they are square with the new main bore. alot of work for what essentially adds up to a weaker bottom end. the first thing you need to do though is tear that puppy down. pay attention to everything you see. i personally think you have a cam problem, but you wont know till its apart.
     
  12. supersize75

    supersize75 1/2 ton status

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    thank guys!

    I am agreeing with the other block idea, I don't know if it has a spun bearing, I do know that the truck had been bogging, when I fired it up after putting in new lifters only one side got oil, then a rod knocking sound was there and it got worse so I shut it down, oil psi was at 25-30 at cold start up.

    I just tore into the other 454 block I got last week it had a slight knocking sound but I got it for dirt cheap, I at least want the heads and accessories so it was worth it, plus came with 2 serpintine pullys I will need /forums/images/graemlins/deal.gif But it looks like I will wind up buying another block, I just found one for 250.00, but at that price it could be more trouble than its worth /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

    what do 454 crate motors go for? I think 3000 or even 3500 is a great price for a BB /forums/images/graemlins/ears.gif with a warrenty /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
     
  13. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

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    $4500 for a crate.
     
  14. fortcollinsram

    fortcollinsram 1/2 ton status

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    Do it right the first time...I would get the block cleaned, magnafluxed, sonic test the walls. Bore/finish hone it, deck it, align bore it. You will have a fresh STRAIGHT block that will last a LONG time if the machine owrk is done right and it is assembled right... You don't HAVE to align bore it but if you span a main, you MUST do it.Get the rods resized regaurdless.Some decent hypereutectic pistons, file-fit rings, bearings to fit the correct undersize on crank if applicatble... I would clean up the heads too. a 3-agnle valve job is only like $125 around hear and you can reast assured that the valves will seal like a mofo and will have NEW seats and guides and seals. If you wanna wrap the pee outta the motor, throw in a set a valve springs that are matched for the cam you get.

    DO IT RIGHT THE FIRST TIME... of course a good strong motor is all dependent on the ability of the guy doing the machine work...

    Chris
     

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