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National Spring & spring rates

Discussion in '1973-1991 K5 Blazer | Truck | Suburban' started by four_by_ken, Jun 9, 2001.

  1. four_by_ken

    four_by_ken 1/2 ton status

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    Has anyone got springs made up by National Spring?

    The spring rates they use are very low, great flex. Like 100 rear and under 200 front. I look at what is listed on this site for common suspension lifts, and no one compares. I guess that is why they are double the price. But, I am very much considering going with National Spring. 6 inch lift, some body and major fender trimming with 39.5 Boggers. Any ideas, thoughts, suggestions?

    I see a few are lower in spring rate on that chart than others, but I have also heard those companies springs go flat relatively fast. Which I do not want. Natioanl Spring says that will not happen with theirs, and I will still out flex most everyone I wheel with.

    I am also curious about the rating of BDS?

    Thanks
     
  2. CaptCrunch

    CaptCrunch 1/2 ton status

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    I rode in a Heap w/ nt'l springs and it seems to ride and flex like the rest of the lifts... If you want flex TC Ez's are by far the flexy-est IMO. I picked up a 6" BDS lift... it rides great and is getting flexer as I break it in... BDS is warrented against sag if it ever happens anyways... I specifically asked Glen at BDS about this. Plus the springs are huge... I need 2 ORD zero rates to even her out LOL! I'd say their 5.5" lift is more like 6.5". I'd definetly go TC EZ's for flex though.... BDS and Superlift superrides are good flexers and don't have the body roll like the EZ's do... skyjacker softrides are a touch stiffer.

    -Mikey
    1987 Chevy K5 Blazer- 350 TBI
    <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.geocities.com/milnerlives_2000/blazer.htm>http://www.geocities.com/milnerlives_2000/blazer.htm</A>
     
  3. four_by_ken

    four_by_ken 1/2 ton status

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    I find this very hard to believe. I know Superlift does not flex all that good. If you look at the spring rates, TC easy ride are in the upper 200s. Where as a set from National Spring is around 100 in the rear and just under 200 in the front. Depends on your specific vehicle.

    I have seen some BDS suspensions, on Jeeps, sag horribly. So, I am a little leary on BDS. TC EZ I have heard sags when used hard. Which I definately will be putting them under abuse. Skyjacker is also not all that flexy.

    Lastly, what the heck are ORD zero rates? Off Road Design I take it somethign or another. Personally I would like to stay away from ORD. I had very bad customer service from them one time. And when I deal only through mail, thats all I can depend on.
     
  4. solowookie

    solowookie 1/2 ton status

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    hey, sorry about some of your bad experiences w/ some of these products, but I gotta tell ya I don't think ANYBODY on this board has had problems with ORD... I've bought a LOT of stuff from them recently with no problems, and I know several other members have too...

    as far as the lifts, there are a LOT of people here running every kind of lift.

    [​IMG] <font color=blue> Jeff </font color=blue> [​IMG]
     
  5. xtreme_wlr

    xtreme_wlr 1/2 ton status

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    Well if you are willing to spend the money, then your best bet is to go with National Spring. They make awsome spring and they tailor them to your vehicle and the use it will be put too. You have to weigh your vehicle (front, rear and total) before they will make a set for you, just to give you an idea of the quality that they put out. National are by far the best out there. But, if like many of us, you are on a tight budget, then i would suggest the TC EZ riders from ORD. They really are a godd company and even tho I have never actually bought anything from them, I have talked to Stephen several times on the phone just picking his brain and he has always been very helpfull. Dont judge them off a one time experience.

    78 Chevy 1 ton Stepside RockCrawler
    468 BB, SM465, NP205
    D60 front, GM 14Bolt w/ Detroit
    <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.bowtiecrawler.com>http://www.bowtiecrawler.com</A>
     
  6. grumpy

    grumpy 1/2 ton status

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    First off, fill in your bio information. Second is that you won't find too many folks as willing to help out as Stephen Watson (or his Dad James) at ORD. If you are still sore then call them up and fix it.
    David
     
  7. four_by_ken

    four_by_ken 1/2 ton status

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    I highly doubt it was either of the people you mentioned in the last post. Was in a squeeze for a trail ride that was making 4 Wheeler magazine and someone I spoke to was not the least bit helpful, or even willing to try to help. It could have been expose in a magazine again for them. But anyways, very true... I drop all hard feelings and will give them another shot. Everyone cant be wrong right?

    I am willing to spend more to get a lot more. And from what I understand National Spring gives you this. I spoke with a guy there and he was more than helpful in talking with me about what I want to do. 6 inch front and rear springs, with the fronts lengthened about 5 inches to get more travel.

    I would like to go the cheaper route, but cheap is the thing holding me back here. I have seen to many truck sag with a set of springs that have a low spring rate. That is what I am worred about wuth the EZ rides. I will have a 12,000lb winch up front with the 454. So, I figure I would have to go with the HD up front at least. I do not necessarily like the shackle flip personally, and would rather not get into that discussion right now.

    I am consdiering BDS, simply because of the warrenty, but I cant find spring rates anywhere for them. I also dont like how so many companies use the same rear springs for pickups, blazers and suburbans.

    I am also waiting for a quote back from Alcon, but probably wont get that until at least Monday.
     
  8. ken

    ken 1/2 ton status

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    I've got a set of 12" Nationals on my '77 Suburban. They are such a superior spring in every way to all other springs out there that there is no comparison. Great ride, lotsa flex, minimal body lean when cornering (without sway bar), etc. One thing, plan on longer shackles, even longer than ORD makes, because the Nationals flex SO well that the front spring's rear eye will contact the frame if you use stock or slightly longer than stock shackles. I got mine through Deaver Spring in Santa Ana, CA (Deaver is a National dealer) and they were $1100 for all 4 about 2 years ago. Worth every penny. As a side note, my wife's '90 Suburban has 6" Superlift springs on it (I think they're "Superrides" as the leafs are tapered, but I don't remember what I bought, its been 8 years ago), anyway, it rides like crap compared to my National sprung Suburban.

    ken
     
  9. Twiz

    Twiz 1/2 ton status

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    Just a FYI thing

    Calculating approximated leaf spring rates (from Chassis Engineering by Herb Adams)

    Leaf spring rate = ((W X N) / 12) X ((1000 X T) / L) to the 3rd power

    W= Width of leaves
    N= Number of leaves
    T= Thickness of 1 leave in inches
    L= Length of leaf in inches
    12= A constant for all leaf springs

    For example; W= 3", N= 5, T= .25", L= 60"

    ((3.0 X 5) / 12) X ((1000 X .25) / 60) to the 3rd

    1.25 X (4.17) to the 3rd

    Leaf Spring Rate = 90 lbs-in

    I used the formula to figure out my junk, and I think my math is as bad as my typing and spelling skills. I think the "to the 3rd power" thing screwd me up. But maybe it'll help someone else out.

    Twiztid
     
  10. four_by_ken

    four_by_ken 1/2 ton status

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    This is more of a response that I was expecting. Someone who has experience with them personally. Knowing how much more it will cost is kind of sticker shock. But, the reputation and individual attention to each vehicle, and witnessed performance have me leaning strongly towards them.

    Hey, its only money and thats what I am working for in the first place... to spend it!!!!

    Ken
    (not the big Suburban Ken, even though I do have a Suburban too)
     
  11. CaptCrunch

    CaptCrunch 1/2 ton status

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    Well obviously age and whatnot does play a part... but I have seen year old BDS suspensions w/ no sag yet and that is a hardcore rig. The Superrides (I think they are called...brainfarting) from Superlift flex pretty good in my opinion... there w/ BDS. The Skyjacker truck was an older rig then the others and was just a bit firmer then the BDS and Superlifts. The one EZ ride truck was brand new and flexed awsome... but lots of body roll too IMO. The National was also brand new and seemed about like the BDS and Superlift superrides or whatever, but maybe they take a while to break in. Overall I think it is a matter of opinion anyways. If you are gonna shell out that kinda bucks you might want to look into Alcon (sp?) springs... they are located in CO and I know Steve and Shawn have looked into them.

    I've never had a problem w/ ORD... so I can't say anything but good things about them. Check out the products page for info and a write up on the 1" zero rates.

    -Mikey
    1987 Chevy K5 Blazer- 350 TBI
    <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.geocities.com/milnerlives_2000/blazer.htm>http://www.geocities.com/milnerlives_2000/blazer.htm</A>
     
  12. four_by_ken

    four_by_ken 1/2 ton status

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    I did check out there page. I must be brain dead, because I cant find anything on the catalog page, no products page there. Just a 1 inch body lift.

    I already have a 2 inch body lift.
     
  13. Donovan

    Donovan 1/2 ton status

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    Ken you can take a look at my site for some ideas on springs. http://www.rustbucket.coloradok5.com
    Bigger is Better
     
  14. 4xmac

    4xmac Registered Member

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    Ken, go with National springs. I have there 6'' springs F/R. I bought them back in Feb. for about 1400.00 bucks. They have no compitition, they are hands down the best and I have had several brands.

    MAC
     
  15. 90blzr

    90blzr 1/2 ton status

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    Just to give you an idea, I talked to Ken ( I think) at Alcan Spring about 4 months ago and he gave me a quote of 250ea. for 8" springs. They said that there is nothing wrong with National and they are great springs, but they offer the same thing at not so high of a price, real nice guy too.
     
  16. TheGeneral

    TheGeneral 1/2 ton status

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    Just had to chime in on ORD's behalf. Steve Watson is a hell of a guy and so are those that work with him. When I started lookin at buildin my K5 and didn't know about this site, they helped me a lot and didn't treat me like a idiot for not knowing things they knew. ORD is as good as it gets, just like this site.

    If you ain't hurt, you ain't playin' hard enough.

    The General
     
  17. Mudstud

    Mudstud 1/2 ton status

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    Set the truck up with coils!

    Stuck is a state of mind!

    Mudstud
    76K5 sb400/350/203parttime/3.73-D44/GM12 locked
     
  18. Emmettology 101

    Emmettology 101 3/4 ton status

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    hell, i get really good Flex out of my Superlift Superrides and I have had the HD's also and they flex decent for HD springs.
    Superlift also warranties ther springs for life against sag....

    Also you have to find out how everyone measures their springs, spring rates. When I first called around to all the companies, most said that there are two different methods and that you cant compare two different spring rates if they are tested two different ways!

    <font color=green>MIKE</font color=green> - "Hukd on fawnics,werkd fer me!"
    <A target="_blank" HREF=http://emmett.coloradok5.com>http://emmett.coloradok5.com</A>
     
  19. four_by_ken

    four_by_ken 1/2 ton status

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    I cant doubt you, becuase I have seen Superlift spring flex pretty good myself. I am just looking at all the work that goes into the NAtional Springs. And the huge price differance. I have never seen National up close. All I hear is how excellent a ride and flex they are. Wish I knew someone in MI with them. I am not really concerned with spring rates. Because the other half of it is the load rating of the spring also. That is what concerns me about all the lifts out there. Just about all of them make the same rear springs for a Blazer as for a pick up. My previous vehicles had custom spring packs by me. I dont feel like fooling around to get the spring pack what I want again. That is why I am considering NAtional. It is just a lot of money. But, it sounds worth it.

    I would also like to put the longer front spring in, but no one else seems to sell these besides National.

    I sent a request in to Alcan, but havnt gotten anything back from them. Sounds like they may be a little cheaper. But, until a little while ago I had never heard of them.

    There was a full convertible Blazer in the '98 TTC, I think. That is about how I am looking to set up my suspension.

    Thanks for all the input everyone!!

    Ken
     
  20. kpanza

    kpanza 1/2 ton status

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    I will chime in for the Superlift Superrides - they flex real nice on my rig! I am sure that soem of the SoCal guys can vouch for that... just my .02 cents. But I'll tell you that if I had a lot more than .02 cents, I would definitely get the Nationals, they just can't be beat if you have the money to pay for them! But I just thought I'd throw my opinion in about the Superlifts...
     

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