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ORD/Atlas II Doubler ?

Discussion in 'OffRoad Design' started by zakk, Feb 20, 2003.

  1. zakk

    zakk 1/2 ton status

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    Project PITA over on the PBB mentions that you machined a ORD doubler for the Atlas II.

    What are your opinions on that mod and was it difficult? more importantly, is it worth it?

    Because I am on a crawl ratio kick (because mine sucks) here are some possibilities:

    700R 203/Atlas 4.3 5.13 gears = 271:1 crawl
    Th350 203/Atlas 4.3 5.13 gears = 223:1 crawl
    700R 203 with 3:1 gears/Atlas 4.3 w/ 5.13 gears = 405:1
    SM465 203 with 3:1 gears/Atlas 4.3 w/ 5.13 gears = 433:1

    wow /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif
     
  2. Shaggy

    Shaggy 3/4 ton status

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    <font color="green"> Zakk, I know you know this, but crawl ratio isn't about going as low as possible, it's about having the proper selections for your combo... I think that a regular doubler with 3:1 gearing in the 203 would be a perfect setup for just about anything. Do you really think you're going to need to go lower than the 150:1 it would give you when mated to a TH350? (that's what you have, right?) I think that 400:1 in a V8 rig is so low as to be unusable, but I could be wrong...

    That's my plan when I finally do the doubler, but I want to mate it to an NV4500. Should be able to get to around 170:1 on double low, 57:1 or 86:1 on single low depending on which case is used for the low. /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif</font>
     
  3. zakk

    zakk 1/2 ton status

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    i know, but its fun to run the numbers and see what is possible.

    With a ORD/Atlas doubler, the possiblities are insane, IMHO.

    Assuming the TH350, The ORD/Atlas Doubler/5.13 gears, 40" tires:

    You could have as little as 51:1 (203 in Low, Atlas in "High") which would be good for the sand, light trails, mud and things like that.

    You could have 111:1 (203 in Hi, Atlas in low) for crawling (but this is still not the ideal 1 in per RPM)

    OR you could get REALLY low for doing the Hammerz, Upper Helldorado, Etc. 203 in Low, Atlas in Low = 223:1 granted that kind of gearing is better suited for a Toyota or something, but its pretty damn low.

    I agree with the idea of the Th350/203 w/ 3:1/205/5.13's as the ideal set up for me. It gives me the ideal set up. I am just interested in the ORD/Atlas doubler as an idea.
     
  4. Stephen

    Stephen 1/2 ton status Moderator Vendor

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    With an auto and V8, if you leave the torque converter out of it and just use the gear ratios, I think you're pretty well off with about 2" per motor rev. The 1"/rev. seems to work pretty well in a manual and all we're doing is multiplying the 2:1 for the T/C somewhere else but it does make is seem bit easier.

    The 203/Atlas setup worked out well, it's the first of 2 we've done so far. Scott did it mainly for the 2:1 gear to start with and didn't really intend to use the full 8.6:1 low very much but I guess it's fun to play with sometimes. It's not a difficult kit, it is a bit different than our standard stuff so price would be a little higher but overall it's pretty easy.

    Personally, with an auto, I think if you have gears to give you somewhere near 2"/rev in low gear and 1" in a middle gear, you're pretty much set. You can go a little lower and not hurt anything with the lowest gear but 2"/rev seems to work well. You can definitely get by with a higher gear but I have a buddy that runs about 2.5"/rev and is looking for a little lower gear. I know that 4"/rev in the lowest gear is pretty difficult to deal with in big rocks.

    Obviously (maybe not so obvious) with a smaller motor, bigger cam, heavier vehicle, etc the guidelines can change a bit but overall in a somewhat heavy truck with a V8 these numbers work.

    I'm interested to see how the atlas handles the torque increase, they're pretty strong but that might be pushing it in some situations.
     
  5. blk87K5

    blk87K5 1/2 ton status

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    Aw come on Stephen, we have had this debate before. We all know that the Atlas is better than the Doubler. /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif
     
  6. zakk

    zakk 1/2 ton status

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    well, they are price point competitors. Atlas II's cost about $2100, what is a complete bolt-in Doubler? $2200?
     
  7. blk87K5

    blk87K5 1/2 ton status

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    To answer your question sort of, it depends on what low range you get and if you get the 32 spline front upgrade. Periodically they run the t-case on sale and include the front upgrade for free, but not often.

    I wasn't trying to compare the two t-cases. They are meant for two totally different applications. That topic has been a long standing debate between Watson and I, and I was just looking to give him a hard time. Not trying to stir debate, just have a little fun with him.
     
  8. FRIZZLEFRY

    FRIZZLEFRY 1/2 ton status

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    If you hunt down the t cases for the doubler yourself you will come in way under $2200.

    I will have under $1300 into mine with the cases.I will be getting the doubler kit,input conversion for the 205,and the shifters /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

    I guess ya gotta have patience if yer gonna look for the cases though.I had been been lookin for the right deal on a 205 for 2 years. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
     
  9. zakk

    zakk 1/2 ton status

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    I know 10-spline 205's are fairly easy to come by, that and I already have a 203 in my rig, so it sounds like all i need to do is get a 205 on the cheap.
     
  10. Stephen

    Stephen 1/2 ton status Moderator Vendor

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    the cheap 10 spline 205 is a good way to go, add the $1110 in parts and kit and you're ready to go.

    Atlas schmatlas.......
    They are a good case, just not torque rated as high as a 205 and they are very much a $2000 option, bare min. for a Doubler is the kit alone at $740.00 and it goes up from there.
     
  11. blk87K5

    blk87K5 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Atlas schmatlas.......
    They are a good case, just not torque rated as high as a 205 and they are very much a $2000 option, bare min. for a Doubler is the kit alone at $740.00 and it goes up from there.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Not doubting your figures, but is there somewhere that lists the torque ratings for an Atlas. I have never seen the figures on paper for one, NP 205 either for that matter. I could call AA, but their phone techs are not the smartest ever. I would rather have printed figures.
     
  12. Stephen

    Stephen 1/2 ton status Moderator Vendor

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    I'm having a hard time finding exact numbers that are rated the same. I've heard "skid torque" ratings but they were way lower than what advance gave me at one point so I don't think they compare. Seems like I heard 900 ft-lbs for the atlas and 1100 for the 205 from somewhere but that's pretty fuzzy and obviously they can both handle WAY more torque than that.

    I'd say set the cluster gears next to each other and measure the teeth, that'll give you a good idea. I've seen a pic of the D300, atlas and 205 from an old sport ute mag that I think came from JB conversions and there is a pretty big difference in size.

    That might be a good project for you brian, pull your atlas and I'll send you a 205 cluster gear and you can figure it out....I know you have some spare time on your hands /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif
     
  13. S-30

    S-30 Registered Member

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    has anyone had much experince with the klune V. i just order one and was if anyone has had trouble with one yet.
     
  14. Stephen

    Stephen 1/2 ton status Moderator Vendor

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    I know of one local that's had a problem with one but don't know anything past that. The 2.72 ratio version should be pretty stout.
     
  15. blk87K5

    blk87K5 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    I know of one local that's had a problem with one but don't know anything past that. The 2.72 ratio version should be pretty stout.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Many people are running around with 90% of the 2.72 ratio Klune-V and don't know it, so I would say that it is farily stout. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
     
  16. blk87K5

    blk87K5 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    That might be a good project for you brian, pull your atlas and I'll send you a 205 cluster gear and you can figure it out....I know you have some spare time on your hands /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Senior Design for Materials Engineering? I think so. If I had some spare time, you know I would. If I do decide to take it apart, I will post up some specs. Won't be for a while though.
     
  17. supergper

    supergper Registered Member

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    If you care here is a comparison pic of the Atlas vc. D300 gear...
    [​IMG]
     

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