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Rear springs in front?

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by PsychoticDeadGuy, May 11, 2005.

  1. PsychoticDeadGuy

    PsychoticDeadGuy 1/2 ton status

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    I read the write up on how to do this but I was wondering if the lift that was gained with stock rear springs in the front was a 4-5 inch lift over stock or was it 4-5 inch lift over the 4" lift that was already installed on his K5. Can anyone help me out?
     
  2. nvrenuf

    nvrenuf NONE shall pass! Premium Member

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    Using rear springs on the front nets you 4"~5" over the springs rated height.

    stock = 4"~5" lift
    4" lift = ~8" lift
    etc...
     
  3. jmd4x4

    jmd4x4 1/2 ton status

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    Moving the stock rear springs up front will give you 4 to 5 in's of lift, if you have rear 4in lift springs and put those up front then you should get 8 to 9 in's of lift.
    hope that helps

    later
    jmd
     
  4. jekbrown

    jekbrown I am CK5 Premium Member GMOTM Winner Author

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    i wrote the writeup... you get 4-5" total lift above stock. I got 4-4.5" on mine, which was less than I had pre-swap because I had 4" springs + a zero rate previously. Less lift is a good thing, with the axle moved forward a few inches and some more fender trimming the tires will stay off my fenders well enough.

    if you have any other questions about the writeup, drop me a pm, thanks!

    j
     
  5. muddybuddy

    muddybuddy 3/4 ton status

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    what kind of modifications have to be done in order to fit the rear springs in the front?
     
  6. YZEATER

    YZEATER 1/2 ton status

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  7. wildcatkit52

    wildcatkit52 Registered Member

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  8. nvrenuf

    nvrenuf NONE shall pass! Premium Member

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    Nice avatar :whistle:
     
  9. wildcatkit52

    wildcatkit52 Registered Member

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    Hey I'm new and it looked like something cool until I find my own "style"... LOL! :D
     
  10. PsychoticDeadGuy

    PsychoticDeadGuy 1/2 ton status

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    So what were the problems with the spring swap? Driveshaft lengths, pinon angle, shocks, etc.? Also, how far down did you put the new shackle?
     
  11. jekbrown

    jekbrown I am CK5 Premium Member GMOTM Winner Author

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    if you read all the way to the end of the writeup, you'll notice that its not done yet. parts I and II are posted... part III (which includes answers to all of the above questions) is not because I haven't got all that stuff done yet. The quick scoop is:

    driveshaft: yes, it will have to be long, cause with 52s you get mad droop. I have a HAD shaft with a 1410 at the pinion, and lots of slip... but it has always been a little short (thats what happens when you call HAD with an order and guess the right length, lol!) so I'm going to send it back to Jesse to get it adjusted. If you run a stock shaft, you'll have to get something with more slip/splines.

    brakelines: I got a new set from Crown Perf. They are forkin bling. Kevlar/stainless and 36" long with super tough single piece ends. These things are a work of art and should have no probs with the extra droop. I am also rigging up a clamp/spring that will keep the brake lines up/out of the way at all times.

    shocks are BBCS-15s from poly performance and will be mounted on custom 1.75" x 0.120 wall DOM shock towers.

    bumpstops: factory ones relocated... nothing bling here.

    limiting straps: not sure what brand I am going to use, but I do plan on having two tabs for them to mount to so they can be used for either limiting straps or for keeping the suspension at ride height to make it easier to jack the front end up to work on it.

    I moved the shackle mount forward, but it really didn't change much with respect to being higher/lower on the frame. If anything its a fraction of an inch higher.

    j
     
  12. Blue85

    Blue85 Troll Premium Member

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    I read your writeup and it's good. Nice job. I have a couple of questions, though:

    1) Why does the shackle mount have to move? In your pictures it almost looked like the original position would have given an angle closer to stock. Is the concern that the shackle would invert?

    2) Why do you have to move the axle, rework the steering, lengthen the driveshaft, etc? Can't this swap be done without moving the axle? Couldn't a zero-rate or a new hole in the spring pack and/or spring perch put the axle pretty close to the stock location?
     
  13. PsychoticDeadGuy

    PsychoticDeadGuy 1/2 ton status

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    I meant the shackle that moves, in the rear of the axle, did you move that? If so, how far down? And will the limiting straps be nessasary?
     
  14. jekbrown

    jekbrown I am CK5 Premium Member GMOTM Winner Author

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    with the shackle mount in the stock location, the shackles would be pretty close to vertical at normal ride height. This isn't a good thing. Think about how a shackle pivots/works as a suspension droops... it rotates about the upper bolt and the spring eye end moves forward/lower. This allows for a lot of droop. The other half of the equation is how far the spring will arch to allow droop. If you have a shackle that is straight up and down, as the suspension droops it hardly rotates at all, so the spring is left to do all the work. 52s are flexy springs, and I imagine (never tried it) that you'd get more droop than stock even with a crappy shackle angle... but with 52s and a shackle that "leans back" you'll get more. I haven't finished working out all the details on mine yet but I do know that I can compress the spring until its flat and the shackle/spring eye won't hit the frame. Thats what ya want.

    Because the springs are longer, if you mount them the way I did, your front axle is relocated. To most people building trail rigs, this is a good thing. By mounting the springs differently (ie moving the rear shackle hanger back) you could probably run 52s with no axle relocation at all. I wanted those 2", because I'm trying to clear 42s with 4.5" of lift + 1" of body lift + narrowing/cutting fenders. If you didn't want to relocate them, you could do it, you'd just have to relocate the hangers differently than I did. Also, whatever you do, don't redrill your spring packs to relocate an axle. Its just not a good idea, especially with an old used spring. Zero rates and offset-drilled perches are fine tho. I have used both. The latter is what I use on my rig now... its cheaper.

    Steering doesn't really need to be "reworked" if you have x-over... I need to change my drag link length just a bit (like an inch) because the rockstomper one I have can't be shortened any more than it already is by adjusting the drag link ends. My tie rod needs to be shortened too, but thats because I am using WFO concepts steering arms, not cause of the swap.

    driveshaft, as I mentioned, was always a little bit short for my app... I was trying to get my rig ready for BB one year, I didn't have everything put together so I had to guesstimate how long a shaft I'd need. I was short by a few inches... then I moved my front axle 3" forward (1" offset drilled perches + 52 swap)... and added mad droop. End result is that I need it lengthened some. It'd be fine for driving around on the street, but I'm pretty sure I can get it to come apart when I flex it.

    anyway, thanks for posting the questions... helps complete my write-up. :)

    j
     
  15. callmewaylon

    callmewaylon Registered Member

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    I'm wondering if I relocated my rear shackle mount (like you did on the 52 swap) and went to some longer shackles with my BDS springs if my ride would improve because of the better shackle angle??
     

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