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removing bed and tubing rear, create front heavy problem?

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by sled_dog, Nov 12, 2003.

  1. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

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    Ok I was thinking about what I want to do to the K5 in the not too distant future and one thing that stuck out is remove all the sheetmetal behind my half cab(about a foot behind the doors) and tube the rear to a narrower lighter form. Only issue I forsee is would this create a problem with the front being too heavy vs the rear? Maybe reducing traction and in an extreme downhill cause a roll forward(endo) issue?
     
  2. BadDog

    BadDog SOL Staff Member Super Moderator Author

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    That can be a problem. However, it can be addressed in part by strategic relocation of various parts. I use a K5 tank to get the gas at the very back, and I make sure it's full on every trip (weight is only one reason of course). I also moved my battery(s) to the rear. My tools and cooler go as far back as possible. And I removed as much weight as possible from the front. So basically:

    1) Relocate as much of the stuff you *need* (especially small heavy stuff) from front to rear as you can.

    2) Remove everything you don't need from the front.

    Heavy bumpers for instance could be replaced with pre-runner type bumpers or do like I did and eliminate the bumper all together in favor of a beefy front cross member just forward of the core support. Better approach angles and stops frame horn twist due to spring mounting. Use a "mount" hitch and store it in the rear. These kind of things add up...
     
  3. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    As much as it "seems" that removing sheetmetal is going to "add lightness".... vast expanses of tubing will probably add a surprising about of weight back to it.
     
  4. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

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    Alright I am relocating my battery, plan was in the interior but maybe back on the frame would be better. Long way from the starter to there though. Along with this I would bob the rear(go 4 link) and not run a back bumper most likely(beefy xmember in frame). I would actually be working on getting a 90 degree or almost departure angle. And eventually I would tube the front end but I don't have the heart to do that at the moment(even though the bedsides are perfect too).
     
  5. jjlaughner

    jjlaughner 3/4 ton status

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    how about one of these tanks

    Its a fuel tank/tool box 60gal capacity empty is 135 lbs probley double that half full. If I go full convertable I thought about looking into these a little more. This is 54" wide might fit well right infront of the rear axle. Add a hi-jack, 36" plus spare behind that over the rear axle and that should help add some weight back /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif

    OH, no tubing here, mini-flatbed
     
  6. BadDog

    BadDog SOL Staff Member Super Moderator Author

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    My battery is just forward of the tank inside the frame. I ran "00" copper stranded to the CUCV firewall distribution block.

    Greg makes a good point. Depends on how far your going with the cutting, and what you have (or will have) up front. A healthy family cage and avoiding excessive weight up front (no Ranch-Hand bumpers) alone may leave you where you want to be. For me it was an issue to address, but that’s based on what I started with and where I wanted to take it…
     
  7. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

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    twice that full? haha, fuel weighs 7lbs per gallon. 60 x 7 = 420 just in fuel. I have access to a good scale system I think I will take use of. Weigh all 4 corners after metal removal and see how unbalanced it is and work on reducing front weight to equal it out and maybe add a little back weight. And it will be a 39 IROK in the back not a 36 /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
     
  8. BadDog

    BadDog SOL Staff Member Super Moderator Author

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    /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif That sounds like the right plan to me...
     
  9. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

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    yeah its nice to have a racing family, I know I can steal my cousin's four corner scales system for his dirt modified.
     
  10. ducttape114

    ducttape114 1/2 ton status

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    my rear tires dont really do anything. they just spin, in the sand they dont even really dig, just spin on top of the sand. i have a pretty heavy motor though. and i have almost no weight on the rear, just a 40 gal tank and a cute litte tool box, maybe 20 lbs. i am planing on moving lots of weight to the rear soon to even it out. radiator, batterys, and so on.

    so if you dont mind my highjacking, id like to ask a similer question.

    suppose my ass end is so light its useless, so i pull a bunch of weight off the front. the ratio would be better but would it make the rear hook up any better?
     
  11. jekbrown

    jekbrown I am CK5 Premium Member GMOTM Winner Author

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    40 gallon tank full of gas = 280 lbs
    spare 39.5" TSL = 125 lbs
    huge optima yellow top = 60 lbs
    tool boxes full of tools = 50 lbs
    co2 bottle + accessories = 20 lbs

    thats 535 pounds right there... add in all the tube ya got, your trick suspension junk, maybe a radiator etc and its gonna end up weighing more than the azz end of a short box pickup. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

    if all else fails, email whiteknight and ask 'em if its been a problem. they have a big block and a tubed rear end...

    j
     
  12. liv24wheel

    liv24wheel Registered Member

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    anyone have any good picks or link to other threads that detail the tubing end of this project?
     
  13. DEMON44

    DEMON44 Low-Tech Redneck

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    heres mine....just cause I like spamming my trucks tube work [​IMG]



    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  14. liv24wheel

    liv24wheel Registered Member

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    That is sweet! I like how you setup the propane tank incorporated into the bed! Are you going to enclose the bed so you can just throw stuff back there or no?

    Anyone have any pics of a K5 setup?
     
  15. DEMON44

    DEMON44 Low-Tech Redneck

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    yes I'm going to add mesh to the 3 sides to finish the enclosure. And I don't think theres going to be any problem with weight distribution. The cage on the back of mine is pretty heavy, well 3 guys can lift it not easy but 3 guys did it. I man-handled the original 8' box off by myself with no real problems.
     
  16. liv24wheel

    liv24wheel Registered Member

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    That will be sick. What kind of tube did you use?
     
  17. DEMON44

    DEMON44 Low-Tech Redneck

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    the base frame is square stock. main runs are actually heavy pipe, 2" xxl wall, most the rest is 1.5". the x brace at the very front is slightly smaller, can't recall exact size.
     
  18. liv24wheel

    liv24wheel Registered Member

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    is it DOM or CREW?

    I think I have decided some major body mods will be my winter project this year.
     
  19. DEMON44

    DEMON44 Low-Tech Redneck

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    I don't know if its drawn over mandrel or cold rolled electronically welded. It was originally built for a truck identical to mine, only with rockwells and 52" michelins. So 2" sched 160 was used for the main runs for strength. That truck was parted out shortly after. So I got my hands on it.

    I'm not going to get into the tube Vs. pipe debate. If you've ever picked up a length of 2" sched 160 you know you'll have a very hard time hurting it. That being said if I were to do a full cage or exo I would use a good tube.
     
  20. supersize75k5

    supersize75k5 OrganDonorRacing.com

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    yes...


    I had an issue big time, played with my breaks for quite some time, tried all kinds of crap, I had originally placed my tank in the center since I ditched the back seat, however adding a 38 inch spare far back, a full set of tools a beefy speaker box with a couple 12's helped a bit, bare bones though witha big block and nothing out back it was nuts :)

    the new rig is a 4 seater so I will have some heffers to even out the big block:)
     

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