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repairing broken off exh manifold stud.....

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by R72K5, May 12, 2005.

  1. R72K5

    R72K5 Banned

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    well damn, a stud broke off exh manifold pass side ram horn in the 71....

    whats its gonna take to fix this ?

    what bit do i need ?

    black one ?
    silver one?
    gold one ?

    which bits are for what ?

    how ami gonna rethread this without costing a bunch ? i have no thead cutting tools at all

    what do i need ?
    i could have it fixed but would be about 40 bucks to have fixed, im not spending any 40 bucks to fix this, i know wher ei can pick up a pair of ram horns real nice studs and all for 20 bucks pair but id liek to fix this one if i can..
    somehow,.,.




    thanks
     
  2. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    How much is left sticking out?

    Absolute best, cheapest, fastest, easiest method (IMO) is using an oxy-acetylene torch to heat up the surrounding metal and turn it out. No re-tapping, no re-drilling.

    Only works if you have the torch and some of the stud still sticking out, but if you've got both of those, you won't fail in removing it.
     
  3. diesel4me

    diesel4me 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Do It!

    All you need is a drill,a bit,and a tap...it might be easier to drill if you remove it from the engine and use a drill press,but I've done many under the truck--just harder to drill straight when chips are falling in your eyes..a "ram horn" manifold might HAVE to come off,since the studs are right above the crossmember,you probably wont be able to get the drill in there,no room!...

    Even if you buy a new drill bit and tap,its less than 10 bucks at home depot or lowes...but don't spend 40 bucks to fix it!--you can buy new manifolds now for about 50-60 dollars at many salvage yards that carry a line of new manifolds,radiators,leaf springs,etc....you could just use a nut and bolt instead of tapping it if its too difficult or costly,unless its a blind hole...or one of those "clamp a stud" dewhickies that clamp on like a "C" clamp--then you dont have to drill at all....they cost 10-15 bucks,but I think its a cheesy way to avoid fixing it right..

    :crazy:
     
  4. R72K5

    R72K5 Banned

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    none is sticking out the damn stud broke clean flush off,,.

    :(

    where am i gonna find the right bit and tap in a small farming community, we have napa and o reillys and a couple small farm supply stores and a couple big truck repair shops

    thats it

    what bit do i need ? how do i know if the bit is going to drill through solid steel or not ? should i use slor or high RPM ? oil or no oil ?
    should i use the big drill press ? if so then how do i align the hole with the bit/chuck ?


    and what tap do i need ??
    dont i need a tool that will hold and turn it ? or does it go in a drill too?

    pics ?

    i know nothing about drilling and tapping, at all, not a clue, totally losted, no clue what to do or how


    the manifolds i am yanking out of the truck since the heads are removed, knowing my damn luck any more these days there wil be another busted one,,,



    thanks
     
  5. garlicbreath

    garlicbreath 1/2 ton status

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    I would pull the manifolds, take one that has a good stud in it still to Napa, they can get the right drill and tap for you. I usually start out with a small drill bit to make a pilot hole for the other one, and always use cutting oil (wd40 will work) when drilling steel, it makes the bits last WAY longer. Put the manifold in a vise or clamp it to a table, then center punch the stud in the center, drill out the pilot hole, keeping the hole as centered as possible. Then use the other drill to drill out most of the bolt. You should be able to use a small pin punch and a hammer to bend one side in and peel out what is left, then run the tap through the hole to clean up the threads, and make sure you always use oil on a tap. If you mess up the threads, go back to napa and buy a Heli-coil kit, they should be able to set you up with the right size. It comes with a drill bit, special tap, and small metal inserts that have threads inside. You screw them into the hole you just drilled and tapped and then screw a new stud into the insert. Hope this helps.
     
  6. R72K5

    R72K5 Banned

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    ok sounds good, i know i can do it myself its just a matter of picking the bit i need ?

    what kind of bit ? what color ? which are steel bits ? what tip on them ?
    thjeres gold and black and silver ones, i have no clue what bits are for what..


    keeping it straight aligned is the next problem/trick

    any tips ?

    what size pilot bit should i use for a 3/8" bolt drill out ?
    what size after that for final of i want to try and peel it out ?
    would torch heat help in removing shell of bolt, wouldnt it weaken the shell alot and make it easy to peel out of the hole ?



    i also need to drill and fix a thermostat housing bolt hole in a 71 camaro iron spreadbore intake soon, bolt busted clean off in that too,

    so i can use the intake on the 71 truck, so it can be 4bbl Q jet

    its either that or the intake has to go into scrap pile.. hmm.


    thanks
     
  7. R72K5

    R72K5 Banned

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    alright well a got a new problem,. i just removed the manifold that this thread is in RE of.. and its cracked,..

    soooooooo...........


    wont be fixing it..... `less i cant find another one,

    it wasnt leaking that i could tell, but it has a pretty bad crack in it, and its towards back of truck side of the middle(up high on outlet area almost at mounting bolt holes) of the manifold,

    i will try and get the nice pair i know of for 20 bucks if he still has them, if not then ill have to find another and i threw them all out cept for a driver side one but it has stripped stud holes so hum,.,

    i gotta fix that intake bolt hole still though, so still need to know how to do this repair that this thread is in RE of


    thanks
     
  8. garlicbreath

    garlicbreath 1/2 ton status

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    Like I said, take it to napa, they will tell you what kind of drill bit to use and how to do it.
     
  9. diesel4me

    diesel4me 1 ton status Premium Member

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    rats!

    I saw a pair of "ram horns" at a swap meet today--10 bucks for the pair,with new studs already installed!--If I had known you needed them I'd have bought them and sold them to you for 20!...too late now though.. :frown1:

    But as far as drilling and tapping goes,the only way to learn how is by doing!--use a small bit like a 3/16 at first after center punching it,then use a 5/16 drill--(the correct size for tapping a 3/8 hole!)...I'd practice on some old parts first before attempting to do the manifold(s)!..it IS a bit tricky!--getting to know the limits of how much torque the tap will take before it snaps off in the hole is the hardest part!.

    .Use oil or kerosene on the tap!..you need to screw the tap in a turn or two,then back out--repeat until its all the way thru..dont force it too hard!--if you feel the tap twisting,its about to snap,back it out and clean the chips out and try again..You can buy a "T" handle for the taps,or special sockets so you can use a rachet--I use a small adjustible wrench most of the time--the "t' handle wont fit in most places..when tapping a "blind" hole like your thermostat bolt,be careful not to "bottom" the tap in the hole-it WILL snap off,and its a bitch to get a broken tap out that "hit bottom"--just like a bolt,but worse!...

    I'd buy a couple of taps--the 3/8 ones get a workout on chevy's,since its the most common bolt size on them.(and its likely the first one wont last long,if you have little or no experience using them!--you havent lived until you have to get a broken tap out of the hole your tapping--they make tap extractors(costly and hard to get)--or a punch and hammer can shatter it and hopefully not the part your trying to save--my favorite way is to use the cutting torch!-(yeah,I break em despite all my "experience"too!)-taps melt faster than mild steel or cast iron,and flare up like sparklers on the 4th of july,I think the torch is fastest and best for that job..a light pull of the trigger and POOF,no more tap...

    The drill bits are up to you--any "high speed steel" bits will work,the "titanium" yellow ones last much longer and will drill harder steel without dulling so fast(kind of important on exhaust studs,they get hard after many years of being heated up and cooled off..)..beware of China drills that are barely capable of drilling wood!.( buy name brands like Vermont American,etc)...as for drilling them out,a hand drill works ok,but takes a good "eye" to drill it straight...

    A drill press is challenging too,as you need to use wood blocks to align the manifold with the bit--one with a tilting table is a blessing!(mine ain't,and its a benchtop model--too short to get most manifolds under it :mad: )..its a job that takes practice to get right--I did hundreds of broken stud removal/retapping at the parts stores machine shop I worked at--got pretty good at it after awhile,but I still have a few that I pooched beyond repair!..even with lots of practice,you still break a few taps once in a while...

    I know a guy who worked at Midas Muffler shops for many years--he can use the torch to remove the stud,he just heats it up and blows it right thru!--then he runs a tap through the hole and its DONE--he does not even take the manifold off in many cases!..and he is real good at getting them out if a little is left sticking out too--a lot better at it than I am!... :blush: :crazy:
     
  10. R72K5

    R72K5 Banned

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    hum

    i dunno about this

    this doesnt sound good

    i think this truck is doomed
    engine needs heads put on now, has ruined exh manifold, intake i need on it has a problem, cant find rear end of frame rails or spring hanger either for it, have to do title work on it still, need to find a betetr geared axle and dump the 4.57 one under it, cant find a cab and chassis dually 3.73 or 4.10 axle for it,

    at least i got to drive it a few times, humm..


    so anyways, a gold colored bit ? theres some of those over at the garage too, humm

    since the manifold that has the broken off stud is cracked i wont be attempting to repair it but now i have to find another one thats good


    not having much luck and if it continues then im gonna have to part the truck instead and loook for another one i guess,

    i just want a daily driver chevy truck

    its just impossible these days

    i guess i can attempt to fix the intake manifold i hate to waste it since its fine other than the busted off bolt, but i dunno,..

    and wont do me any good now anyways less i find a ram horn manifold,


    whata bout helicoil for the intake bolt hole ?

    whats its take to prep for one and install it ?

    which way is better?
    which is less pricey ?
     
  11. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Well, in aluminum intakes I've done (stripped threads, not a bolt left in it) I just bought a threadsert, drilled it oversize for the standard tap the threadsert took, and did it that way.

    I hate helicoils, but threadserts need a goodly amount of metal around the hole to be used so won't work everywhere...thermostat bolt holes are ideal though.

    A 4bbl iron intake is scrap metal, you should be able to get one of those for a ton less than what a helicoil set will cost you, probably less than a single good drill bit, without spending time to fix it. I certainly wouldn't pay more than $5 for a "normal" iron intake, see them all day long at the swap meets for that price.

    Just an idea.
     
  12. R72K5

    R72K5 Banned

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    it was a 350 horse 350 intake from a 71 camaro

    i scrapped it already

    right now ive got a 12 horse briggs engine thats got a broken off bolt and a stripped (exhaust) hole in the block

    need to fix them and make new exhaust with a pipe and flange and welding


    if cant fix this then its off to shredder with that riding mower along with this 8 horse one out here too


    how to fix ?

    block is aluminum, so,,


    thanks
     
  13. Roz

    Roz 1/2 ton status

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    torch and easy-out.they are cheap. i break bolts all the time and have good luck with those. alum is awsome cause it u mess it up just reweld it and drill-tap a new :)
    dont get discouraged, we all been thre and its a good learning experience. i learnd anti-seize is a good thing too :cool1:
     
  14. TJS

    TJS 1/2 ton status

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    I weld a nut to the broken bolt /stud. I use a 240amp HTP MIG machine. I have never failed extracting a bolt/stud yet. I even was able to extract a broken crank snout bolt with the engine still in the truck. I have been doing it this way for years.
    T.J.
     
  15. diesel4me

    diesel4me 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Briggs repair...

    The Briggs and Stratton mower engines usually have pipe threads in the exhaust outlet,as well as the 2 bolts --I'd get a muffler with pipe threads and use that, rather than try to extract the broken bolt from the block--many times its nearly impossible to remove them--they are so close to the hole where the pipe threads are,there isn't enough "meat" to drill it out without pooching the pipe threaded part...and most mower engine blocks are magnesium or zinc die cast,which is nearly impossible to weld..at least I have never sucessfully welded one,even with that special rod you use with a propane torch..

    I'd use the pipe threads in the exhaust port--borrow a tap from a plumber if the threads are carboned up or booggered..most briggs motors use 1/2" npt on the muffler up to 6 hp..larger hp motors have 3/4 NPT or 1" NPT..you might need a few elbows and pipe nipples from home depot or a hardware store to point the muffler where you want it...its a much easier solution than trying to drill out those broken bolts in the block--its difficult,not like a cast iron block--the drill will wander off the harder bolt and tend to chew into the soft block instead....you could always run it open headers too!..I would not scrap them just because the muffler came off!...
     

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