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"Self-Etching Primer" vs. "Epoxy Primer".....?

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by Greg72, Mar 16, 2003.

  1. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    \"Self-Etching Primer\" vs. \"Epoxy Primer\".....?

    Can anyone tell me the difference between these two....or are they the same item?

    I bought some self-etching primer to coat bare metal. I am still doing some sheetmetal repair and was told that self-etching is the correct stuff, because you can clean it away from the areas you are working on easily and then just give a quick re-spray when you're done. Unlike some of the rust inhibitors I've seen, it can also be topcoated later with "real" paint.

    I'm also seeing a lot of guys using Epoxy primers in the early stages of a restoration to preserve the cleaned metal...so now I'm confused if I've bought the wrong thing, or if maybe this is the SAME stuff???

    I'd appreciate getting a "brand name" or "product name" for the Epoxy primer if anyone can help me with that. I'm hoping for stuff in rattlecans, since I'm not really setup for "real" painting in my garage...!!!
     
  2. BadDog

    BadDog SOL Staff Member Super Moderator Author

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    Re: \"Self-Etching Primer\" vs. \"Epoxy Primer\".....?

    Self-etching has (phosphoric?) acid in it so that it sort of cleans and digs in to the metal by micro-pitting it. Usually greenish in color. This is what you want if you have any expanses of bare metal larger than your hand, if you’ve got it, not a bad idea on any bare metal. However, it does not fill or “seal” at all. It must be top coated to protect and you can not sand on it, it is applied very thin. I personally prefer to use an etching wash with other primers rather than self-etching primer top coated with other primers.

    Epoxy and Urethane primers are the good stuff. They (usually) have high solid contents so they build fast (for final sanding and filling scratches) and they help “seal” the stuff below them. I don’t think you’ll have much luck with epoxy primers in a rattle can. Seems like I’ve seen it, but don’t remember where. Industrial supply maybe? Urethane (sometimes incorrectly referred to as “epoxy”) requires a catalyst so, no go for cans…

    (Disclaimer) I’ve been out of body work for 12 years now but, I think that’s pretty accurate…
     
  3. bad_bo_ti

    bad_bo_ti 1/2 ton status

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    Re: \"Self-Etching Primer\" vs. \"Epoxy Primer\".....?

    as far as rattle can self etchers, i just went through a paint training where i work and they said they dont recommend using rattle can etch primers on areas bigger than a half dollar. the company i work for uses both epoxy and a new direct to metal primer (etch) what exactly are you using this on, floor boards outside? some primers will rust through unless coated with paint. i used an aresal etch primer on my blazer in a few spots and while it sat out side it rusted through /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif
     
  4. 70~K5

    70~K5 1/2 ton status

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    Re: \"Self-Etching Primer\" vs. \"Epoxy Primer\".....?

    [ QUOTE ]
    (Disclaimer) I’ve been out of body work for 12 years now but, I think that’s pretty accurate…

    [/ QUOTE ]

    No Russ you're just into a diferent type of body work now. /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif /forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     
  5. BadDog

    BadDog SOL Staff Member Super Moderator Author

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    Re: \"Self-Etching Primer\" vs. \"Epoxy Primer\".....?

    Hmmm, good point... /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif

    I used to put them together after wrecks so you couldn't tell they were ever wrecked (frame machine, body, paint, etc. Owned and ran a shop). Now I cut it appart and add protection specifically so I can GO OUT AND WRECK IT! /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif
     
  6. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Re: \"Self-Etching Primer\" vs. \"Epoxy Primer\".....?

    [ QUOTE ]
    ...the company i work for uses both epoxy and a new direct to metal primer (etch) what exactly are you using this on, floor boards outside? ...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Um....actually I was planning on doing the entire inner tub area in my K5 (footwells, seating area, and entire bed including vertical bedwalls)...it still needs a bit of rust repair, so I didn't want to have to bring it somewhere for the Epoxy primer. Once it's stripped down for painting, it kinda hard to drive anyway (no seats, etc)...

    I don't have a problem with putting a "final coat" of paint over the self-etching primer, but I'm just trying to establish if the epoxy primer is a "superior" product that I should be using instead.


    /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
     
  7. JK5

    JK5 1/2 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    Re: \"Self-Etching Primer\" vs. \"Epoxy Primer\".....?

    I have found that PPG's DP40LF is about the best all around primer.
    It is an epoxy that is self-etching....
    It can be used over bare metal....sand blasted metal....because it has acids to promote adhesion.
    It comes in white, red, black and green...that helps when color coating....
    If you reduce it with DT reducer....it can be used as a sealer... /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    I don't know what product your using.....
    But ALL self-etching primers are good... /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
    Even some spray can primers.... /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif
     
  8. JK5

    JK5 1/2 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    Re: \"Self-Etching Primer\" vs. \"Epoxy Primer\".....?

    [ QUOTE ]
    (Disclaimer) I’ve been out of body work for 12 years now but, I think that’s pretty accurate…



    [/ QUOTE ]

    Hummm......
    Didn't the epoxy primers have LARGE amounts of Lead in them..... back then!!! /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif
    They've removed Lead...in most primers and paints!! /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
     
  9. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Re: \"Self-Etching Primer\" vs. \"Epoxy Primer\".....?

    JK5,

    I bought THIS one from The Eastwood Company:

    [​IMG]


    You can see the specs at www.eastwoodcompany.com I can't do a direct link to it because their website is weird.

    Anyway, if you know anything about this particular primer that would be great.

    /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
     
  10. BadDog

    BadDog SOL Staff Member Super Moderator Author

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    Re: \"Self-Etching Primer\" vs. \"Epoxy Primer\".....?

    There was all kinds of bad stuff back then. Iso-cyanates were the worst. Never heard of lead in the E-Primers though, who knows. Or was that a joke? /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

    Hmmm, you sound like my kids asking if they had cars when I was young…
     
  11. Greg72

    Greg72 "Might As Well..." Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Re: \"Self-Etching Primer\" vs. \"Epoxy Primer\".....?

    [ QUOTE ]

    Hmmm, you sound like my kids asking if they had cars when I was young…

    [/ QUOTE ]



    ......HA HA HA....or what it was like when the whole world was in "black and white" before color was invented!!!!!


    /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif
     
  12. JK5

    JK5 1/2 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    Re: \"Self-Etching Primer\" vs. \"Epoxy Primer\".....?

    I never used that product...
    But The Eastwood Company doesn't sell junk...so it should work fine... /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    It's probably much cheaper than DP40LF....
    it's about $80 a quart.....with the catylist!!! /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif
     
  13. JK5

    JK5 1/2 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    Re: \"Self-Etching Primer\" vs. \"Epoxy Primer\".....?

    Yep...it's TRUE!!!! /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif
    They used lead to KILL RUST!!! /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
    It may have KILLED US TOO!!!

    It's a good thing we changed professions!!! /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     

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