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Shame on the Swift Boat Veterans for Bush

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by Emmettology 101, Aug 12, 2004.

  1. Emmettology 101

    Emmettology 101 3/4 ton status

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    Link to article:

    http://www.opinionjournal.com/editorial/feature.html?id=110005460


    Shame on the Swift Boat Veterans for Bush
    John Kerry saved my life. Now his heroism is being questioned.

    BY JIM RASSMANN
    Tuesday, August 10, 2004 12:01 a.m. EDT

    I came to know Lt. John Kerry during the spring of 1969. He and his swift boat crew assisted in inserting our Special Forces team and our Chinese Nung soldiers into operational sites in the Cau Mau Peninsula of South Vietnam. I worked with him on many operations and saw firsthand his leadership, courage and decision-making ability under fire.

    On March 13, 1969, John Kerry's courage and leadership saved my life.

    While returning from a SEA LORDS operation along the Bay Hap River, a mine detonated under another swift boat. Machine-gun fire erupted from both banks of the river, and a second explosion followed moments later. The second blast blew me off John's swift boat, PCF-94, throwing me into the river. Fearing that the other boats would run me over, I swam to the bottom of the river and stayed there as long as I could hold my breath.

    When I surfaced, all the swift boats had left, and I was alone taking fire from both banks. To avoid the incoming fire, I repeatedly swam under water as long as I could hold my breath, attempting to make it to the north bank of the river. I thought I would die right there. The odds were against me avoiding the incoming fire and, even if I made it out of the river, I thought I'd be captured and executed. Kerry must have seen me in the water and directed his driver, Del Sandusky, to turn the boat around. Kerry's boat ran up to me in the water, bow on, and I was able to climb up a cargo net to the lip of the deck. But, because I was nearly upside down, I couldn't make it over the edge of the deck. This left me hanging out in the open, a perfect target. John, already wounded by the explosion that threw me off his boat, came out onto the bow, exposing himself to the fire directed at us from the jungle, and pulled me aboard.

    For his actions that day, I recommended John for the Silver Star, our country's third highest award for bravery under fire. I learned only this past January that the Navy awarded John the Bronze Star with Combat V for his valor. The citation for this award, signed by the Commander of U.S. Naval Forces, Vietnam, Vice Admiral Elmo Zumwalt, read, "Lieutenant (junior grade) Kerry's calmness, professionalism and great personal courage under fire were in keeping with the highest traditions of the United States Naval Service." To this day I am grateful to John Kerry for saving my life. And to this day I still believe that he deserved the Silver Star for his courage.

    It has been many years since I served in Vietnam. I returned home, got married, and spent many years as a deputy sheriff for Los Angeles County. I retired in 1989 as a lieutenant. It has been a long time since I left Vietnam, but I think often of the men who did not come home with us.

    I am neither a politician nor an organizer. I am a retired police officer with a passion for orchids. Until January of this year, the only public presentations I made were about my orchid hobby. But in this presidential election, I had to speak out; I had to tell the American people about John Kerry, about his wisdom and courage, about his vision and leadership. I would trust John Kerry with my life, and I would entrust John Kerry with the well-being of our country.

    Nobody asked me to join John's campaign. Why would they? I am a Republican, and for more than 30 years I have largely voted for Republicans. I volunteered for his campaign because I have seen John Kerry in the worst of conditions. I know his character. I've witnessed his bravery and leadership under fire. And I truly know he will be a great commander in chief.

    Now, 35 years after the fact, some Republican-financed Swift Boat Veterans for Bush are suddenly lying about John Kerry's service in Vietnam; they are calling him a traitor because he spoke out against the Nixon administration's failed policies in Vietnam. Some of these Republican-sponsored veterans are the same ones who spoke out against John at the behest of the Nixon administration in 1971. But this time their attacks are more vicious, their lies cut deep and are directed not just at John Kerry, but at me and each of his crewmates as well. This hate-filled ad asserts that I was not under fire; it questions my words and Navy records. This smear campaign has been launched by people without decency, people who don't understand the bond of those who serve in combat.

    As John McCain noted, the television ad aired by these veterans is "dishonest and dishonorable." Sen. McCain called on President Bush to condemn the Swift Boat Veterans for Bush ad. Regrettably, the president has ignored Sen. McCain's advice.





    Does this strategy of attacking combat Vietnam veterans sound familiar? In 2000, a similar Republican smear campaign was launched against Sen. McCain. In fact, the very same communications group, Spaeth Communications, that placed ads against John McCain in 2000 is involved in these vicious attacks against John Kerry. Texas Republican donors with close ties to George W. Bush and Karl Rove crafted this "dishonest and dishonorable" ad. Their new charges are false; their stories are fabricated, made up by people who did not serve with Kerry in Vietnam. They insult and defame all of us who served in Vietnam.
    But when the noise and fog of their distortions and lies have cleared, a man who volunteered to serve his country, a man who showed up for duty when his country called, a man to whom the United States Navy awarded a Silver Star, a Bronze Star and three Purple Hearts, will stand tall and proud. Ultimately, the American people will judge these Swift Boat Veterans for Bush and their accusations. Americans are tired of smear campaigns against those who volunteered to wear the uniform. Swift Boat Veterans for Bush should hang their heads in shame.

    Mr. Rassmann, a retired lieutenant with the Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department, served with the U.S. Army 5th Special Forces Group in Vietnam 1968-69.
     
  2. Shaggy

    Shaggy 3/4 ton status

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    This guy is the only member of Kerry's crew that is actively campaigning for him, IIRC. The only line I'm even going to comment on is this one -

    [ QUOTE ]
    They insult and defame all of us who served in Vietnam.


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Yeah, sure they do. Kerry's actions when he came home insulted and defamed everyone that served in Vietnam, I don't see how this does it. I like the way he twists all the facts around to make it seem like the group is secretly financed by Bush.
     
  3. gjk5

    gjk5 3/4 ton status

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    The bottom line is that Kerry served with the guys he rolled out at the DNC for several weeks, some of these swiftboat vets served with him (but not on the same boat) for much longer, and besides; they have the right to state their opinions just like everyone else.

    And if anyone should hang their head in shame for voicing their opinions it is John Kerry for sh*tting on his fellow servicemen when he returned from his suspicously brief tour of duty.

    Not to mention, Jim Rassmann was not a crew memeber on that boat, he was CIA (I think) temporarily riding that swift boat, so he is not exactly an expert on Kerry's strength of character (or lack of).


    I personally wish neither one of these candidates were using their military history to campaign as neither has much to to be proud of.
     
  4. Goober

    Goober 1/2 ton status

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    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]



    For the sake of argument let's assume that Sen. Kerry served honorably and genuinely deserves all his medals.

    He's still a guy running for office without any real plan. His whole campaign is built on "BUSH SUCKS. VOTE FOR ME."


    Unless he can come up with something that has some substance he doesn't have a prayer in November.
     
  5. Beast388

    Beast388 1/2 ton status

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  6. Emmettology 101

    Emmettology 101 3/4 ton status

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    Boy, I have never seen Ferenheit 9/11, but have read alot about it and the mixed reviews. This video to me seems to do alot of what people are accusing Moore of doing!! And it's funded by the RNC. *shaking head* /forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif
     
  7. mrk5

    mrk5 The Sticker Guy Moderator Vendor GMOTM Winner Author

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    Have you ever watched Band of Brothers?

    When I think of Senator Kerry in the military, I picture the officer that was in charge of EZ Company in training. Can't remember his name, he was played by the dude from Friends.

    I just think Senator Kerry had his political aspirations in mind during his military service.

    But, hey he was there, and could have been killed at any time. So you can't fault him for that.
     
  8. Emmettology 101

    Emmettology 101 3/4 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]

    He's still a guy running for office without any real plan. His whole campaign is built on "BUSH SUCKS. VOTE FOR ME."


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Last time I looked at their(Kerry and bush) websites, Kerry's had one thing on it about Bush(on the front page). Bush's was filled with anit Kerry links... I just went and viewed both beofre replying and Kerry's hasn't changed, yet Bush's site is now less geared towards anti-kerry stuff. Before, the page was riddled with anti-kerry report,s links, statements... I think Bush is way ahead of Kerry in the "he sucks" campaigning!
     
  9. Emmettology 101

    Emmettology 101 3/4 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Have you ever watched Band of Brothers?

    When I think of Senator Kerry in the military, I picture the officer that was in charge of EZ Company in training. Can't remember his name, he was played by the dude from Friends.

    I just think Senator Kerry had his political aspirations in mind during his military service.

    But, hey he was there, and could have been killed at any time. So you can't fault him for that.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I may have seen that movie a while back, but honestly cant remember it. But one thing is at least Kerry served! What ever time amount it may be, he didn't have daddy get him out of it or have controversies about not being able to find proof that he served! Hell, there was a reward afford for anyone bringing forth proff that Bush was in AL(i think that where it was).... We have a leader that ditched out on his service time. At least Kerry had the balls to go to war!
     
  10. skratch

    skratch 1/2 ton status

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    Still doesn't change the fact that Kerry has no plan, he has nothing to stand on other than his three purple hearts /forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif
    I have friends and family memebers with more purple hearts, and not one of them ever brags about it.

    Assuming Kerry served honorably, what he did afterwards speaks volumes about his lack of character.
    His voting record (or lack thereof) speaks louder than anything he can do or say during his campaign now.

    The man is a veteran and I applaud him for that, but I am sickened by his actions since his time in service, and that is why I will vote for Bush.
     
  11. mosesburb

    mosesburb For Rent Premium Member GMOTM Winner

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    Wow, what a wonderful story /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif.

    Now to see what really happened, go to:
    Swift Vets

    Here is a little taste:

    [ QUOTE ]
    (ii) The Bronze Star Lie

    As recounted in the attached affidavits of three on-scene participants (and verified by many others present) Kerry's operating report, Bronze Star story, and subsequent "no man left behind" story are a total hoax on the Navy and the nation. As recounted in the affidavits of Van Odell (Exhibit 6), Jack Chenoweth (Exhibit 7), and Larry Thurlow (Exhibit 10) (and verified by every other officer present and many others), a mine went off under PCF 3 -- some yards from Kerry's boat. The force of the explosion disabled PCF 3 and knocked several sailors, dazed, into the water. All boats, except one, closed to rescue the sailors and defend the disabled boat. That boat -- Kerry's boat -- fled the scene. After a short period, it was evident to all on the scene that there was no additional hostile fire. Thurlow began the daring rescue of disabled PCF 3, while Chenoweth began to pluck dazed survivors of PCF 3 from the water. Midway through the process, after it was apparent that there was no hostile fire, Kerry finally returned, picking up Rassman who was only a few yards from Chenoweth's boat which was also going to pick Rassman up. Each of the affiants (and many other Swiftees on the scene that day) are certain that Kerry has wholly lied about the incident. Consider this: How could the disabled PCF abandon the scene of the mine? Why did Kerry have to "return" to the scene?

    Kerry's account of this action, which was used to secure the Bronze Star and a third Purple Heart, is an extraordinary example of fraud. Kerry describes "boats rcd heavy A/W and S/A from both banks. Fire continued for about 5000 meters." Exhibit 17. In other words, the boats went through a double gauntlet at about 50 yards distance that was 3.2 miles long (comparable to Seminary Ridge at Gettysburg on two sides), and yet none of the other boats within feet of Kerry's boat heard a shot or suffered an injury after the PCF 3 mine explosion, except for John Kerry's buttocks rice wound of earlier origin.

    Clearly, Van Odell is right when he says, "John Kerry lied to get his Bronze Star . . . I know. I was there. I saw what happened." As Jack Chenoweth swore, "his account of what happened and what actually happened are the difference between night and day." Most poignantly, Larry Thurlow, whose brave actions saved the PCF 3 boat that day after Kerry fled, has the right to say, "When the chips were down, you could not count on John Kerry."



    [/ QUOTE ]

    These guys saw it and don't agree with what Kerry or Rassmann saw/said /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif.

    Maybe that is why Kerry wants this ad not to be shown.
     
  12. Beast388

    Beast388 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Boy, I have never seen Ferenheit 9/11, but have read alot about it and the mixed reviews. This video to me seems to do alot of what people are accusing Moore of doing!! And it's funded by the RNC. *shaking head* /forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

    [/ QUOTE ]

    This video can in no way be compared to F9/11. All the RNC has done is compile quotes from Kerry himself. There has been no spin put on any of that. Kerry is doing the speaking, in which he clearly flip-flops and changes his view on Iraq, Saddam and the war in order to get the nomination. Kerry said all of that....no one else. /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif
     
  13. skratch

    skratch 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    he didn't have daddy get him out of it or have controversies about not being able to find proof that he served! Hell, there was a reward afford for anyone bringing forth proff that Bush was in AL(i think that where it was).... We have a leader that ditched out on his service time. At least Kerry had the balls to go to war!

    [/ QUOTE ]

    You might want to research that a bit better, rather than believe the media hype.
    His dad didn't get him out of anything, and the practice of transfering to another unit inorder to work in another field outside of the Guard was common practice then.

    He didn't ditch anything, he applied for training on the aircraft used during Vietnam but was denied, his aircraft wasn't used over there, so why should he have been deployed.

    You need to do a bit more research and try to think for yourself rather than spit the same weak media hype.
     
  14. mosesburb

    mosesburb For Rent Premium Member GMOTM Winner

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    If you want(!) to know the truth behind un-fairandhate9/11, look here:

    Moore's Lies
     
  15. Emmettology 101

    Emmettology 101 3/4 ton status

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    Funny how you know he served when the records are misteriously missing and there were even rewards offered by a party in the RNC..... No one has foudn proff that he did this service in AL or AR....

    Where is your proof?
     
  16. gjk5

    gjk5 3/4 ton status

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    Jesus H. Christ I am sick of this argument. Serving or not serving is not any qualification for being our CIC. And W. has not gone around bragging about his military svc. (rightfully so, as he has nothing to brag about). Kerry on the other hand has gone on ad nauseum about his service, which is at the very least worth scrutinizing. Not to mention that after his service, which may or may not have been questionable, he came back and badmouthed the military and servicemen in general. He should be ashamed to call attention to and expect glory from his service when he came back and called himself and EVERY serviceman a "war criminal".

    It just disgusts me to hear all of these spurious pro-Kerry arguments, the guy is a scumbag and a disengenuous ass-kisser. That being said, W. is not exactly my ideal choice for president, he's not the most intelligent or well-spoken guy, and is a poor businessman; but he does have a set and isn't afraid to piss some people off which is more than can be said for Theresa's husband.


    It boils down to the same thing it always has (at least since I've been able to vote): You've gotta vote for the guy you think sucks less. At this time that is W. It's unfortunate that the Dems fielded such a lame ass candidate, I am a firm independent and might have voted for someone more middle of the road, but they picked the leftyist two they could, so screw 'em.
     
  17. ugly_blazer

    ugly_blazer 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    But one thing is at least Kerry served! What ever time amount it may be, he didn't have daddy get him out of it or have controversies about not being able to find proof that he served! Hell, there was a reward afford for anyone bringing forth proff that Bush was in AL(i think that where it was).... We have a leader that ditched out on his service time. At least Kerry had the balls to go to war!

    [/ QUOTE ]



    Bush is also not boasting on his war record. You sound like the typical left winger, shifting the focus of the arguement when you realize that you have nothing to say. Who made Kerry's war record the centerpeice of his campaign? KERRY DID! If he wants to make this such a big part of his campaign, with that BS reporting for duty salute and all, then yes it should be questioned. If he is lying about what happened then I would never want him to be our commander in cheif. I like this ignorant arguement that "I don't care if he isn't telling the truth because it happened XX years ago..." So what, he is lying about it today, that should give you some indication as to what kind of guy he is...

    Bush is far from my favorite person also, but through all of the attacks on him from left wing extremist and the media, he has never once threatened them with hot-shot lawyer friends. Kerry is just a whine bag chicken sh!t, accept it and get over it.
     
  18. skratch

    skratch 1/2 ton status

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    You are such a putz!

    Turn it on me why don't you, because you are to lazy to search the internet.
    Typicall Democrat/forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif
    I found the articles on this myself, find them for yourself.
    Besides I never said he actually did his service. He was in the Guard, what did his service actually entail while he was a transitional memeber of those units? You're not a vet so you wouldn't understand what it's like to be a transitional member of a unit or how hard it is to track them. I'd challenge you to find the records of every unit I've been assigned to and if I was where I was "supposed" to be.

    I'm not suprised no one remembers him, if you could find any of my commanders I doubt even one of them would remeber me, even with my awards, commendations . . . and a unique name, not one of them could tell you anything about me or wheather I was ever where I was supposed to be.
    Hell even Gen. Dodson probably wouldn't remember me, even though I pushed him face first into the mud in the middle of the night on a recovery.
    Officers have more important things to do than remeber the name and disposition of everyone under their command, especially transitional memebers of their units.

    At least Bush never disgraced the flag, unlike Kerry.
     
  19. Emmettology 101

    Emmettology 101 3/4 ton status

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    Everywhere I look, people want proof! The Rep's ask for it, the Dem's ask for it. If you make a comment, you have to prove it... I am not being lazy and have read quite a few articles on this matter.... And they were all about how they cant find proof that GW served during that time period.

    So if you say that no one would remember you even your commanders and such.... They how do all these Vets have such a great recalection(sp?) of exactly what happened in Vietnam with Kerry? If it is so hard to keep track, how are all these people coming forward doing it?
     
  20. Shaggy

    Shaggy 3/4 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Everywhere I look, people want proof! The Rep's ask for it, the Dem's ask for it. If you make a comment, you have to prove it... I am not being lazy and have read quite a few articles on this matter.... And they were all about how they cant find proof that GW served during that time period.


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Why do the Libs insist on assuming that GW was not there unless there's proof, why does the burden of proof rest with him to prove that he was where he was supposed to be? The accuser is supposed to bear the burden of proof, not the accused. If I accuse you of being a goat-[darn], wouldn't it rest with me to prove it rather than with you to disprove it?

    [ QUOTE ]

    So if you say that no one would remember you even your commanders and such.... They how do all these Vets have such a great recalection(sp?) of exactly what happened in Vietnam with Kerry? If it is so hard to keep track, how are all these people coming forward doing it?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    You have a serious problem with logic. You're comparing people remembering an experience they had to a commanding officer remembering one person that was under their command 30 years ago. I don't even remember all my teacher's names from grade school; that was only 20 years ago and there was only one teacher in each class. I do, however, remember most of the traumatic and memorable events that occured in the schoolyard.
     

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