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small engine techs: briggs and stratton 14 HP engine runs for a few seconds then dies

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by R72K5, Aug 29, 2005.

  1. R72K5

    R72K5 Banned

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    i just picked up this nice later model 40" 14 horse V twin briggs powered riding mower for a song and it doesnt seem to be getting fuel at all,

    i put a lil gas down the intake and it will run for a few seconds then poof die, every time, same thing, tried everything, runs great but acts like no fuel at all

    any ideas what to check ? what i should or can ?

    thanks
     
  2. BigOrange90Jimmy

    BigOrange90Jimmy 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    sounds like the jet in the carb is stopped up from having fuel sit in it. rebuild...

    be sure to get COMPLETE model number off engine before going, including the code
     
  3. danny7139

    danny7139 1/2 ton status

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    yea it sounds like a carb needs a rebuild and there should be stickers by the air intake somewhere depending on the model which states the model and codes of the engine
     
  4. R72K5

    R72K5 Banned

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    hum thats crappy, oh well.. only gave 100 for it and its worth many times that,

    so how do you rebuild these carbs ? ive never been in one, im afraid of them, i can do Q jets all day long, but one of these, hmmmmmmm..., scary.. me and small engines DONT get along, at all..


    what all is involved as far as taking carb apart and rebuilding and reassembling it, what all do you have to do inside these carbs ?

    soak and blast ? do briggs carbs use a flaot and bowl and needle and all that like a tecumseh does ?

    thanks
     
  5. dodgedude99

    dodgedude99 1/2 ton status

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    give the bowl on the carb a couple of whacks with a screwdriver handle.

    B&S bowl carbed motors have a tendency to stick if fuel is left in them.
     
  6. diesel4me

    diesel4me 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Dont be scared...

    If you can rebuild a Q-jet,a briggs carb will be a peice of cake!..they are not all that much different really--and no accelerator pump!..pretty simple actually..You check the gas filter to see if its blocked up??...the float could just be stuck closed too..might have to remove the bowl and see..its probably rusted up if its sat for awhile..

    Some of those vertical twin cylinder briggs have a fuel pump,some are mechanical,some run off vacuum from the breather hose to the crankcase--they have a diaphram inside..that often dries up and wont pump anymore..

    If you have a tank off another mower,you could try running it directly to the carb and gravity feed it(put the tank up higher that the carb)--if it starts and runs that way,its likely the fuel pump..most riders have the gas tank 3 feet away under the seat..its hard for the fuel pump to suck the gas from that far away,even when the fuel pump is ok!--

    I have a Yard-Man with a twin cylinder Kohler that uses a similar fuel pump--I have to crank it for 20-30 seconds before it starts if it has sat awhile since I last started it..yours might come back to life if you can get it to run for awhile!..good luck! :crazy:
     
  7. R72K5

    R72K5 Banned

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    haha well i was messing around jswut now and i yanked the hose to the carb from the tank and no gas comes out, just a little tiny bit did at first and then nothing, and there is gas in the tank,,
    it is gravity feed, straight form tank to carb, no vacuum, no anything else, i do have another tank, yeah

    im sure it would run if i put the tank on and another hose

    im gonna yank the original rubber black hose and go get the clear nylon or neoprene or whatever stuff from a local shop and flsuh the tank out

    theres no filter that i see anywhere either

    is there supposed to be, on gravity feed ?

    should there be ?

    thanks
     
  8. BigOrange90Jimmy

    BigOrange90Jimmy 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    the kit could run anywhere from 6-30 bucks. without the thing sitting in front of me, i can't give you a straight answer.

    if possible, give me the first 6 digits of the model # and i could tell you better.
     
  9. R72K5

    R72K5 Banned

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    i have no idea which is or where the model code is but ill look around and see, hmm

    but hell 30 bucks is cheap, thats cool

    thanks
     
  10. R72K5

    R72K5 Banned

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    well hell that was simple as hell

    model code


    92040732
     
  11. diesel4me

    diesel4me 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Gas filter..

    If it has an external gas filter,use one designed for a small engine--not a car universal one..the small engine ones use a fine mesh screen--the car ones paper element is too restrictive to let the wimpy fuel pump (if it has one)or gravity feed to flow enough fuel..they only cost a few dollars,Home Depot or Lowe's has them!..some tanks have a screen in the fuel fitting if there is no external filter..I bet it runs after you get gas to the carb!.. :crazy:
     
  12. Kiwi John

    Kiwi John 1/2 ton status

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    The 14HP V-twin usually has a solenoid on the carb that prevents 'after-fire' when engine is shut down. This needs to be activated by the ignition switch and is interlocked with the seat-switch and the blade-engage lever or switch.
    Check this circuit first before you start stripping the carb. Those carbs are Mikuni and rarely need a 'rebuild'.
    these engines almost always run a fuel pump situated above the Right hand side rocker cover run by engine vacuum pulses from the rocker cover itself.
    The fuel filter should be a pleated paper type, about cotton-reel size.
    Disconnect the fuel pipe before the fuel filter. Fuel should run freely from the tank. Debris often collects in the bottom of the fuel pipe u-bend.
    Disconnect the fuel pipe after the fuel pump. Fuel should pulse here when engine is cranked on starter. then reconnect and listen for the solenoid to click when ignition switch is turned on. If it doesn't, it will never run.
    BigOrange90Jimmy means the whole series of numbers:Model, Type, Code.
    These are on a long,thin metal plate on the engine cover somewhere if it is a Vanguard engine or on the rocker cover if it is an Intek engine.
     
  13. R72K5

    R72K5 Banned

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    but it has none of this stuff, no pump, no electrical to the carb, nothing like this

    the fuel hose runs straight from bottom of tank to the carb, no filter, no pump, no anything,

    hmmmm...

    can you guys figure out what mower this is if i gave all the engine numbers ?


    thanks
     
  14. Kiwi John

    Kiwi John 1/2 ton status

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    Yes. You need 3 numbers. Model. Type. Code.
    They are always listed in that order on the plate.
    the number you gave earlier is the Code No. We need the other two to help you more.
    Is the engine a single cylinder 14 HP or a twin cylinder 14 HP? (my earlier assumption was twin cyl).
    It sounds like your machine has the fuel tank mounted in the dash panel? sort-of under steering wheel console? for it to be gravity feed. this makes me now think you have single cylinder engine?
    Gravity-fed fuel system should still have a fuel filter and, as diesel4me says it should be a small mesh type (either red or white plastic). But there was a recent service bulletin a couple of years ago diesel4me, that said you can use the pleated paper filter on gravity-fed systems where the drop from bottom of tank to top of carb is 3 inches or more. This is the better filter and is preferable to stop dirt that gets thru mesh one.
    You pulled the fuel hose off the carb and no fuel came out. There is the first problem. Make sure the fuel tank cap has a vent hole to let air in, or take it off, leave loose. Any fuel running?
    If not, blow back up fuel line gently with compressed air. You should hear bubbles in the tank. Any fuel running yet? Hold the end of the hose low down so gravity can let fuel run. You have to hav fuel running freely out of this hose before you go anywhere near the carb.
    Cut the line and fit a fuel filter before you reinstall. Did you fit the new fuel line you were going to get?
    Randy, these machines are not 'rocket science'.
    Get fuel to the carb and then come back to me if you need more help, with the 3 numbers above.
    How long since it was last running properly before you got it, do you know?
     
  15. R72K5

    R72K5 Banned

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    no its two cylinder V series
    the gas tank is up high in front of dash
    the carb is way up front behind grille
    the fuel hose is real long

    its real basic
    its got fuel to carb just fine now i fixed that, it runs freely out of the hose at the carb inlet yes! i already said i fixed that in earlier post..



    if its not rocket science then why wont it run without putting gas in the carb now?


    ill try and get the numbers

    these things are way more complicated and picky than any car engines
    i dont get along with these things, they just never run for long or at all, every mower i get, tecumseh, briggs, you name it, always some damn thing goes wrong with them, but i can run a car or truck forever with no problems normally, and perform any and all work on it as needed, easy.,

    small engines are a crock of %$#@!


    thanks
     
  16. R72K5

    R72K5 Banned

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    14 HP TWIN II
    cast iron sleeve
    industrial commercial engine
    400707
    1221 01
    92040732

    im just about ready to junk this damn thing

    im sick of it not starting and running without giving it gas can
    pissing me off


    its a big mower and in perfect shape and looks nice and isnt very old but it doesnt run so its useless

    i cant have yard ornaments around here i already have too many others around
    i have an old beater loud and clunky 30" 8 horse red snapper i ride around the property to mow it all, i have a whopping 25 and 40 bucks in the whole thing and it does an excellent job of cutting

    screw the newer piece of junk ones, tired of them, thhat goes for cars, and anything else they make anymore, all junk crap




    thanks
     
  17. diesel4me

    diesel4me 1 ton status Premium Member

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    old vs new...

    I tend to agree--yesteryears tractors were cast iron engines and tranny's,and had thick steel plate frames and cast iron beam front ends--nowadays everything is die cast aluminum ,zinc,or other "pot" metal crap!..

    Thats why I got away from fixing small engines--they ARE simple,and its nice to use your arms to pull a motor instead of a hoist,and be able to carry it to the workbench..but I've had more than a few that would not run,despite everything appearing to be perfect!...90% of the mowers I get need a brand new carb--even if they LOOK perfect inside,some just dont want to run,period!...

    I recently rescued a nice 6.5 HP push mower (Craftsman..ugh!)from being scrapped,it was in the metal pile at the landfill--it looks like brand new--I cleaned the carb out because all it will do it start and stall immediately--you can keep it running on ether or if you "choke" it by placing your thumb about halfway over the carb where the air filter goes..despite the carb looking perfect,it just wont run without doing that!--so I dig thru my junkpile of spare parts,and spend an hour putting another "good" carb I saved off another similar engine...does the same F'n thing!--leads me to believe its not the carb(rare for 2 to do the exact same thing!)... :doah:

    I'm not that experienced with newer stuff either--this thing probably has electronic ignition(got great spark),but its acting like its got a vacuum leak--none that I can see anywhere,maybe the head is cracked or something,I dunno--I'm ready to toss it in the metal pile I'm getting ready to cash in for scrap--I've wasted enough time and effort on it--its a shame to throw something so decent looking away,but its pissed me off for the last time!--didn't stop whoever owned before me from junking it!.. :rolleyes: :crazy:

    I think a 14hp twin briggs is worth fixing though...IF you can get it straightened out for short money...shellac in the carbs is what kills most small engines,and when people find out its 50-100 bucks for a new carb,it gets scrapped most of the time.. :(
     
  18. Kiwi John

    Kiwi John 1/2 ton status

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    Ok r72k5. sussed it.
    The numbersyou give tell us it is not a V-twin. It is the older Horizontally opposed L-head (flat-head) twin engine.
    This engine has Briggs own carb mounted on the front and it DOES have the vacuum operated fuel pump. This looks a bit rectangular and is on the front of the carb bowl. It is where the fuel line goes to on the side. There is also a short rubber hose off the bottom of this fuel pump which is the vacuum hose and this goes to the crankcase or breather.

    Your problem is to get fuel thru the pump & into the carb.

    As earlier, you should have a fuel filter in-line and good flow through the pipe to the fuel pump.
    Take the air filter and housing off the top of the carb so you can see the carb.
    4 screws hold the top of the carb on. If you take this carb top off then you can check that you have fuel pumping thru the pump. Crank the engine, fuel will spurt up vertically so keep eyes clear. If not. you have to rebuild the pump (kit part # 393397)
    The fuel shut-off solenoid was an option on this engine. you don't seem to have it. There is a bolt on Left side of carb below choke lever which drains float bowl and accesses main jet for cleaning.
    carb rebuild kit #491539 should have everything else you need.

    There are 2 very fine springs in the fuel pump. note how they come out for when you reassemble.

    Shout if you need more help.
     

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