Dismiss Notice

Welcome To CK5!

Registering is free and easy! Hope to see you on the forums soon.

Score a FREE t-shirt and membership sticker when you sign up for a Premium Membership and choose the recurring plan.

SPOOL IN THE FRONT

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by shaun, Jun 1, 2004.

  1. shaun

    shaun 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2003
    Posts:
    745
    Likes Received:
    0
    How would my front 10 bolt with 4.10s and 35's possibly 37's fair with a mini spool. I am debating this. What do you guys think???
     
  2. SF87K5

    SF87K5 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2002
    Posts:
    1,105
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Stedman, North Carolina
    if you do rock I have one word "brakeage". If you do just mud I am not sure how it will hold. I would take extra shafts and other parts with you if you do get the spool.
     
  3. ugly_blazer

    ugly_blazer 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2004
    Posts:
    1,214
    Likes Received:
    0
    I have a 10 bolt with 4.56 and would love to put a locker in it, but I don't because I know that I would break axle shaft/joints all the time.
     
  4. jjlaughner

    jjlaughner 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2001
    Posts:
    7,406
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Indiana
    If you want to try it I'll sell ya one! /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif
    It was in an axle I bought, I'm planning 37"+ tires so I'm pulling I'm pulling it out. It's been in there for a while I dont know how long it was run. My vehicles got to drive on the road to and from so no spool for me! It would be good in the rear of a mud truck /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif Possibley the front of a mud truck /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif But I would think on the street or rocks its just begging to snap some shafts /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif /forums/images/graemlins/yikes.gif
     
  5. namkrow

    namkrow 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2004
    Posts:
    166
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    So Cal
    I've got a spool in my front 10 bolt with 35" mt's and 4.10's. I bought it that way.

    The PO said he did break a shaft or two lol

    I'm looking for a 60 at present.
     
  6. shaun

    shaun 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2003
    Posts:
    745
    Likes Received:
    0
    how much w/ shipping???
     
  7. shaun

    shaun 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2003
    Posts:
    745
    Likes Received:
    0
    How will a spool break the axle any quicker than any other locker. Everyone says that if you let off the gas a mechanical locker will disengage and when you apply gas it will engage. Well I dont think a spool will break my truck when no throttle is applied. So technically if two trucks are climbing up a rock one with a detroit or lockrite or traclok and one with a minispool (we are talking front axle) they are both going to be applying throttle (force) to make it up said rock or obstacle and as long as this force is being applied the mechanical locker is locked therefore working just like the minispool. So how are they different.

    For street driving I wont lock my hubs problem solved. If I need 4wd on the street I wont use as much skinny pedal.
     
  8. jjlaughner

    jjlaughner 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2001
    Posts:
    7,406
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Indiana
    [ QUOTE ]
    How will a spool break the axle any quicker than any other locker. Everyone says that if you let off the gas a mechanical locker will disengage and when you apply gas it will engage. Well I dont think a spool will break my truck when no throttle is applied. So technically if two trucks are climbing up a rock one with a detroit or lockrite or traclok and one with a minispool (we are talking front axle) they are both going to be applying throttle (force) to make it up said rock or obstacle and as long as this force is being applied the mechanical locker is locked therefore working just like the minispool. So how are they different.

    For street driving I wont lock my hubs problem solved. If I need 4wd on the street I wont use as much skinny pedal.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Breakage comes from binding... when you have a axle turning int he front at the point of binding the mechanical locker disengauges and allows one side to spin faster than the other (like during turning). The mini-spool will turn contanly even through a binding point. Thats why you break the short side axle shafts during turning, the minispool is rotating and the tire is not or at least not as fast. Either ujoint or the stub shaft will give then it moves to the inner shaft then the break point moves to the teeth on the gears. So with a stock axle shaft setup that would be your weak point, with ctm joints and aftermarket shafts the week point become the gears and the driveshaft ujoints...
     
  9. shaun

    shaun 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2003
    Posts:
    745
    Likes Received:
    0
    So if I was slow and careful around turns and didnt run bigger than 35's where is the issue????
     
  10. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2002
    Posts:
    16,870
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    mm hmm, everyone says that, oh my 44 or 10 bolt will be fine I will just take it easy, SNAP. Every locked in 4 wheel and turned real hard? Binding even to a slight degree is unavoidable, front spool will make it real bad. Front spool will make it real hard to turn as well. Power always going to both front tires, truck wants to just keep pointing straight. And before you ask, yeah this could happen with a locker too, but not nearly as much. How is this, only people I've talked to that had welded or spooled front axles, don't recommend it, to anyone.
     
  11. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

    Joined:
    May 30, 2001
    Posts:
    17,669
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    IL, USA
    Spool in the front is good for straight line mud drags only.
     
  12. Hossbaby50

    Hossbaby50 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2001
    Posts:
    8,972
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Peoria, AZ
    If you plan on running a spool in the front you better carry alot of spare parts, and I would advise makeing sure to always have a person filling shotgun when you are offroad. That way you don't have to jump in and out of the truck all the time to unlock a hub so you can steer, then relock the hub to crawl. It is a never ending process of in and out of the truck and going back and forth to try jokey into the right spots.

    Harley
     
  13. m j

    m j 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2001
    Posts:
    4,606
    Likes Received:
    0
    how many mud draggers run a spool in the front?
     
  14. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

    Joined:
    May 30, 2001
    Posts:
    17,669
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    IL, USA
    [ QUOTE ]
    how many mud draggers run a spool in the front?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    A lot. Ask justinf or K30CJ or K5DRAGER. They run a spool or welded diff more than anything else because they don't care.
     
  15. CyberSniper

    CyberSniper 1/2 ton status Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2003
    Posts:
    2,257
    Likes Received:
    5
    Location:
    Chelsea, MI
    Bah... we have a bunch of bench wheelers on this thread. No one said they actually had a spooled/welded front so they're all going off "a buddy of a buddy of a buddy said that front spools were bad" or "I read on FullSizeChevy.com that front spools were bad" or something of the nature. I think the stigma is compared to setting up gears and doing a paint job. People are terrified of it for no real good reason other than their peers said to be.

    I have LockRights in both my 10 bolts on my longbox pickup. As long as I'm on the throttle they're locked up. Since so much bind is initiated when turning in 4wd on ANY surface both lockers are always locked up. At best, I have two tires that don't shuffle dirt and they're the outside two. Most of the time all the tires shuffle dirt except the outside rear one. The only time the lockers aren't locked up is when I'm coasting... which doesn't last very long when you're turning in 4wd. So, in order to get around this I tend to carry a bit of speed into a corner and then not reapply throttle until I've got the steering wheel almost straight again. If I need it to turn sharp I'll blip the throttle then let off so the locker-bind will come out and it'll actually turn. Normal driving, the LockRights added about 12' to my turning diameter.

    I have a K5 with a welded 10 bolt front and I've driven it around on pavement in 4wd. I've also been in it getting flat towed out of the snowbank and on the way home. When you don't have power steering because it's not running it's a real bitch to turn with the front hubs locked. But, driving the K5 around the little bit I did didn't seem to be much different than my LockRight-ed pickup. You could still feel the universal joint speeding up and down through the steering wheel, the tires still chirped, and it still required a lot of throttle to get it to move forward.

    The LockRight and the welded carrier are very similar in how they respond to turning because like I said most of the time you're putting power to the ground so my LockRight stays locked up. However, both of them are a far cry from open differentials in how they handle.

    The welded front is a nuissance when in 2wd with the hubs locked as well. You're always fighting it. While turning the steering wheel wants to oscillate with the speeding up and slowing down of the wheel universals. With the LockRight it usually stays unlocked but if I'm turning at full lock or real close to it the LockRight ratchets and sometimes locks up. Otherwise, it's like having an open front. I don't know which is more of a nuissance, always fighting the welded carrier or having the surprise of having the LockRight ratchet. Luckily I pretty much always have a deathgrip on the steering wheel otherwise the surprise lock up of the LockRight could throw me for a loop. When it locks up it's a bang that can be felt and heard.

    The welded carrier is always beating the crap out of the front end. That means the axleshafts, the universal joints, the hubs, the transfer case, drag link ends, tie rod ends, steering box, rag joint, frame near the steering box, and your trusty arms. It never gives the front end a "break". Don't mind the pun. haha. However, it doesn't shock load the axleshafts and universal joints like a locker does. I suspect the main reason why welded carriers/spools so frequently break shafts and joints is because of fatigue. Whenever I've got my foot to the floor, shifting at six grand, listening to my LockRight ratchet I know it's a lot harder on those shafts than a spool.


    If you haven't already obtained a minispool I'd look into getting a LockRight from Jeg's for $200. You can usually resell them for at least $150 on eBay in case you don't want it in the future. The nice thing about the LockRight is that you can use some of the tricks I mentioned above. Plus, the niceness of driving around with the hubs locked/drive slugs in 2wd as compared to a spool.
     
  16. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

    Joined:
    May 30, 2001
    Posts:
    17,669
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    IL, USA
    I agree with you 100%. Most of the people that have never had a front locker whine when they really should shut their mouths. I had always thought it would be far worse but in reality there is no comprimise.

    If I had it to do all over again I would have welded my front diff years ago, because I feel that would be much better than an open diff after having a front locker now.

    But, for $300, the lockright has been one of my best investments yet.
     
  17. Hossbaby50

    Hossbaby50 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2001
    Posts:
    8,972
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Peoria, AZ
    Well I personally run a lockright front. It isn't that bad for crawling. There is definitly more steering input needed but with crossover it isn't bad at all. The benefits definilty outweigh the negatives by a long shot.

    I wheeled a couple weeks ago with 4xCrazy in his burb with a fairly small narrow tire. He welded his front 10 bolt up. It was a bear for him to try and crawl with it. He was having to unlock hubs and make many manuvers to get on line with the welded front. He didn't like it and it looked like a total PITA to wheel with. I would definitly go with a lockright over a weld or minispool.

    After watching him struggle with the welded front and not be able to turn unless a hub was unlocked I can't recommend it to anyone.

    If you are running a low traction surface like mud, snow, etc then maybe go ahead and weld it but in the rocks here in AZ there is to much traction and steering is very hard.

    The other problem with the welded front is there is always bind on the front axleshafts and ujoints. A locker will unlock an release that bind. With the locker you can stop, back up a litle to release the bind and then roll forward and steer more easily. Not with the welded/spooled.

    Harley
     
  18. CyberSniper

    CyberSniper 1/2 ton status Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2003
    Posts:
    2,257
    Likes Received:
    5
    Location:
    Chelsea, MI
    Yeah, I know, it's kind of strange how people are when they have a bunch of friends speculating.

    I'd rather not have a locker in the front of my daily driver but I certainly would rather have the locker than an open differential. Ideally, I'd have an ARB or a limited-slip. But, my daily driver is also my wheelin' rig and no open differential or limited-slip compares. It's like comparing Condoleezza Rice and Sharon Stone. They're both old and smart but I know which one I'd rather have. /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif Well, maybe that was a bad analogy... /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif

    The K5 came with the welded front... but I doubt I'm going to bother yanking the carrier out and replacing it with one of my spares and put a LockRight in it unless something weird happens like the welds break or the carrier cracks.
     
  19. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

    Joined:
    May 30, 2001
    Posts:
    17,669
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    IL, USA
    What difference does it make having a locker in the front fo your DD? If the hubs are unlocked, or even if you're in 2wd, it's practially invisible.

    I have driven mine on the road with the hubs locked in and it does just fine. You don't even notice it.
     
  20. CyberSniper

    CyberSniper 1/2 ton status Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2003
    Posts:
    2,257
    Likes Received:
    5
    Location:
    Chelsea, MI
    300" of snow each season makes a world of difference. If I lived somewhere where it didn't snow then it wouldn't phase me at all. But, here, in the great white Upper Peninsula of Michigan there is snow on the ground more often than not. This year it snowed for 38 or 39 days straight and about half of them were in 4wd... and running a locked front on snowy roads sucks. It pretty much starts snowing in the beginning of October and finishes sometime in April. This year we were lucky and it didn't snow in May.

    When the snow is deep or loose it isn't a problem. Or when the roads are good enough to run 2wd. It's those areas where there is little to no snow where the system binds up that is the problem. You end up driving with the steering wheel a quarter turn off trying to keep it going straight because of all the bind... then you hit a loose patch and the truck lurches at the traffic next to you or the curb. The traffic next to you or oncoming traffic really doesn't appreciate it when you lurch at them. It makes driving stressful. The holeshots you can pull are awesome though, it leaves AWD car owners drooling. /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif
     

Share This Page