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Started truck & it dumped 4 qts of oil on driveway

Discussion in '1973-1991 K5 Blazer | Truck | Suburban' started by MJF, Sep 25, 2002.

  1. MJF

    MJF 1/2 ton status

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    Here's my situation. I am building a 3/4 ton chevy. The engine is a SB400 & came out of a 79 GMC truck. It had an oil cooler on it & I couldn't get the hoses to the cooler re-connected after I swapped the engine so I took it off. I went to the chevy dealer & picked up the piece that bolts to the block(that the oil filter spins on to) & got an oil filter(Fram PH13). The gasket on the oil filter appeared to line up exactly with a gasket on the block. I figured this was wrong(but surely the counter help at pep boys wouldn't lie to me), but put it on anyway.

    I cranked it up, which was an extremely exciting feeling after all the hard work, & shut it down after 5 or so seconds. In that five seconds, it dumped the 4 quarts I had put in on the driveway.

    Now I need to find a solution. With the oil cooler, the filter was a PH13, but it looks like I need one with the same size fitting but a larger diameter filter. As I said before, the oring on the block is exactly lined up with the oring on the filter. Is this just an issue of I got the wrong filter? If so what do I need to measure to go get the right filter?


    Thanks
    Mike
     
  2. tipoil

    tipoil 1/2 ton status

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    i've got a 400 sb in my truck whit the oil cooler ac pf35c
    the 350 sb in my car as the same filter in it .
    have the guy cross reference the ac filter and see if ur is the same

    one more thing i know this sound stupid but is the oil pressure sending unit pluged in (under the distributor and above the filter).

    hope it helped a bit
     
  3. Pure Insanity

    Pure Insanity 1/2 ton status

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    </font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
    one more thing i know this sound stupid but is the oil pressure sending unit pluged in (under the distributor and above the filter).

    [/ QUOTE ] I was kinda thinking the same thing. If you just rebuilt the motor there is another oil galley plug that some machine shops take out when cleaning the block (and occasionally forget to put back) just under the edge of the back and top of the left head by the intake. If all else fails look for that one too. The bad part is if that one is out, you have to pull the head to get it back in.
     
  4. HarryH3

    HarryH3 1 ton status Author

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    There isn't a gasket on the part that the oil filter screws onto. It should just be a flat, machined surface. The gasket on the oil filter seals against that surface. If you have a gasket there, then I think the oil filter adapter is installed upside down. The gasket on the adapter should be against the engine block, not facing the oil filter. /forums/images/icons/shocked.gif
     
  5. MJF

    MJF 1/2 ton status

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    The oil filter adapter doesn't have a gasket. It's just a small piece of metal. The o-ring(gasket) appears to be(haven't removed it yet) in a groove in the block &amp; is the same size as the o-ring on the filter.

    [Light bulb goes off] Maybe if I remove that o-ring, the filter o-ring will go in it's place &amp; make a good seal. At first I was thinking I needed a larger diameter filter so the filter's o-ring would go outside th blocks' o-ring.

    I'm not a very good mechanic. I can usually fix anything I take apart, buit in this case I changed everything around &amp; am a little confused. Also I didn't have the engine rebuilt, I just swapped it over &amp; removed the oil cooler.

    Thanks
    Mike
     
  6. HarryH3

    HarryH3 1 ton status Author

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    Did you buy a new filter mounting surface, or just the center "pipe" that the oil filter screws onto? There should be no gasket, o-ring, or groove on the oil filter mating surface. I've never removed the oil cooler adapter, so I'm not certain if you can just screw the filter to the block, or if it requires another adapter to provide the filter sealing surface. Perhaps there was a gasket on the backside of the oil cooler adapter that is just stuck to the filter sealing surface? If so, then you can just remove it and re-install the oil filter. But if it's stuck into a groove in the block, then you'll need one more part to complete the conversion. The filter mating surface has to be very flat and smooth.
     
  7. MJF

    MJF 1/2 ton status

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    The filter adapter is a piece that has a bypass valve &amp; the threaded piece that the filter screws onto.

    As far as the mating surface on the block goes, it has an o-ring on it that is held in place. Either it's stuck really well or there is a groove for it. I will go home tonight &amp; try to get it off &amp; see if there is a groove. Hopefully there won't be a groove &amp; I'm all set.

    If there is a groove, it makes things a little more challenging. The way it looks there is enough mating durface left on the outside of the o-ring that an oil filter that is a little larger than the one I have would seal there. I was looking at my filter &amp; it looks like there is a "dished" area just inside the o-ring. The round o-ring on the block would probably fit right in there. I have never seen one like this before, but in theory I would have twice the sealing potential as long as it didn't block any passages on the oil filter. I was thinking I would just go to the parts store &amp; find all the filters listred for SB chevys &amp; compare them until I found one that fit as I just described.

    If all else fails, I guess I could go &amp; get an aftermarket oil cooler &amp; see if that will fix it. I believe this truck came from the factory with the oil cooler installed, but I'm not sure.
     
  8. MJF

    MJF 1/2 ton status

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    Well so much for that. I just did a quick search for oil filters &amp; all the years I checked said Fram PH 13. Oh well I'm lost. Maybe I'll call the dealer today &amp; see what they say about an extra adapter for the maitng surface.
     
  9. Shaggy

    Shaggy 3/4 ton status

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    <font color="green"> I think that the gasket from the old filter stayed attached to block when it was removed so you've got double gaskets right now. Get that gasket off the block, there shouldn't be a groove there, just a flat surface. Put the new filter on (the one you already have) and you should be good to go. This happened to me once on my old Toyota and the thing leaked like crazy. </font color>
     
  10. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    The oil cooler adapter uses an o-ring to seal to the block mating surface. (I have one on my 350, dad has one on his 454 that we both added) You can still get this o-ring at the dealer.

    Unless the block was machined for an o-ring (kind of doubt it, but also don't own a 400) the mating surface for the filter on the *block* is the same, whether oil cooler equipped or not. As you state, the cooler is a bolt on deal, it just replaces the "standard" oil filter adapter, using two long bolts, the cooling adapter, and that o-ring.

    With the cooler removed, the o-ring is removed, (because the o-ring seats in the cooler adapter, and seals the block mating surface) and the oil filter seats flush with the block, using the gasket that is on the filter.

    Make sense? Help in any way? I remember that the o-rings that were on the donor trucks were pretty shot, so I'd imagine they could also glue themselves to the block easily. If after removing the cooler adapter though, the machined flat spot on the block is grooved for an 0-ring, I'm as lost as you.
     
  11. cheyenne_77

    cheyenne_77 Registered Member

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    I am currently building my 400 and there is no groove, just a highly flat polished surface. As you will know, when you install the filter you put a smear of oil on it so that you can thread the filter on against the "flat" surface with the o ring staying intact and not destroying itself on instalation. There should be only one on the filter and none on the block.
     
  12. MJF

    MJF 1/2 ton status

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    I will check to see if the block is grooved or not tonight. Hopefully it's not. Thanks for all the input.

    Mike
     
  13. Mr.Chevy4x4

    Mr.Chevy4x4 1/2 ton status

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    I agree Shaggy! I worked at a Jiffy Lube in highschool and they refered to it as "double gasketed". The old o-ring will sometime stick to the block and the new one tries to seal on top of it. I have seen them seal initially and when the customer drove off and built up some oil pressure it emptied the pan in 1 block. They ended up buying the customer a new motor after that one. They actually have that as a step in their procedure to check and make sure the old o-ring came off with the filter. My $.02


    Mike
     

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