Dismiss Notice

Welcome To CK5!

Registering is free and easy! Hope to see you on the forums soon.

Score a FREE t-shirt and membership sticker when you sign up for a Premium Membership and choose the recurring plan.

Starter engagement problem *UPDATE*

Discussion in '1973-1991 K5 Blazer | Truck | Suburban' started by Pure Insanity, Jan 7, 2002.

  1. Pure Insanity

    Pure Insanity 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2001
    Posts:
    4,579
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Dade City, Florida
    Heres the deal, I have a Vortec motor in my Blazer. I have it converted a carb, but thats beside the point. I didnt think anything about it when I ordered the flexplate, but I may have gotten a "smaller" flexplate. All was fine until about a week ago, when it started getting noisy and making a hillacious noise like the starter is kicking back out. Its getting worse and popping out more often FAST! I got under and looked at the flywheel and it looks like the ring gear is not getting good engagement to the starter gear. The block has the holes for both types of starter. (straight across and angled)

    Heres the bad part of the question, how do I find out how many teeth are on my flywheel w/o painting a tooth and counting them while I rotate the eng. by hand, or pulling the motor??? I am thinking I will end up having to paint a tooth, and count my way around.

    What are the 2 options of tooth count, and what do I need to order for a starter, when I find out? I am totally lost on this one. <img src="http://coloradok5.com/forums/images/icons/crazy.gif">

    If ya can't stop.......Smile as you go under! <img src="http://coloradok5.com/forums/images/icons/smile.gif">
    PIC of mine from flblazers site<a target="_blank" href=http://www.flblazer.alloffroad.com/photo3.html>
    GO&lt;/a&gt;<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by pureinsanity on 01/08/02 05:04 PM.</FONT></P>
     
  2. 55Willy

    55Willy 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2001
    Posts:
    9,946
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Keizer, Or
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    if the inspection cover is off, just count one fourth(1/4) and times it, way easlier then counting every tooth..it sould be either a 153(1/4=38 teeth) or 168(1/4=42teeth). I was hopping that Summit would show the diameters of the two but it doesn't otherwise you could just pull a tape on it.

    <font color=red>Life is like a mud hole:</font color=red><font color=blue>
    When the S#!T gets deep, you have to keep moving and friends can always pull you out</font color=blue>
    55 Willy's
     
  3. Pure Insanity

    Pure Insanity 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2001
    Posts:
    4,579
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Dade City, Florida
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    The only prob is......how do I know I counted my way around 1/4 of the flywheel? Is the spacing of the teeth different on the 2? If so I could measure teeth per inch.

    If ya can't stop.......Smile as you go under! [​IMG]
    PIC of mine from flblazers site<a target="_blank" href=http://www.flblazer.alloffroad.com/photo3.html>
    GO</a>
     
  4. TorkDSR

    TorkDSR 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2001
    Posts:
    1,258
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    bucks co pa
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    wise ass (i was wondering the same thing "hows he gonna know when hes done 1/4" but i wasnt gonna say nuthin)

    beligerence doesn't justify intelligence.
    <font color=blue>wheelers hate posers.</font color=blue>
    <font color=red>79k15/400/700r4/205/38.5</font color=red>
     
  5. lasvegas

    lasvegas 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2001
    Posts:
    122
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Las Vegas, Nevada
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    If you give me the part number, I might be able to look it up. When I was picking my flywheel recently, I researched the heck of this issue and I think I have a pretty complete listing of chevy/gm flywheel and flexplate numbers and stats. Let me know if you have the part number.
     
  6. Twiz

    Twiz 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2001
    Posts:
    3,729
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Clearfield Ut.
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    The only thing I know is that there is a differnce between single piece rear main and two piece as -far as it relates to the flex-platel. I don't know if the diameter changed..

    Two-piece flex plate is the only thing I have on hand.
    - Dia is 45 inches. so a 1/4 of that would be 11.25 inches.
    I don't know if that helps, because it's a 2-piece rear main.

    <font color=white>.</font color=white>Eric
    <font color=white>.</font color=white>Twizted
     
  7. lasvegas

    lasvegas 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2001
    Posts:
    122
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Las Vegas, Nevada
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    also, you MIGHT be able to measure the diameter of the flywheel with a tape measure through the starter hole, a rough measurement. The size difference between the small and big diameters does not require an exact measurement to know what you have. OR, assuming it is an automatic (flexplate) you could take off the bellhousing cover and do some measuring counting that way.
     
  8. Twiz

    Twiz 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2001
    Posts:
    3,729
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Clearfield Ut.
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    Lasvegas:
    See what you can find on a 96 and up, flex-plate. Look for a dia. and tooth count. I think that might help, if you could.

    <font color=white>.</font color=white>Eric
    <font color=white>.</font color=white>Twizted
     
  9. lasvegas

    lasvegas 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2001
    Posts:
    122
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Las Vegas, Nevada
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    twistzid, you have a 45 inch flexplate?
     
  10. 55Willy

    55Willy 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2001
    Posts:
    9,946
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Keizer, Or
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    use a framing square and where it hits a tooth at one arm of the square to the other arm of the square...it will make a 90 and count the teeth between them.

    <font color=red>Life is like a mud hole:</font color=red><font color=blue>
    When the S#!T gets deep, you have to keep moving and friends can always pull you out</font color=blue>
    55 Willy's
     
  11. Twiz

    Twiz 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2001
    Posts:
    3,729
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Clearfield Ut.
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    Got myself all confused, now.. Radius?...thats not it, out-side diameter....?
    Whatever....
    I taped the out-side the flax-plate and its 45 inches.

    <font color=white>.</font color=white>Eric
    <font color=white>.</font color=white>Twizted
     
  12. lasvegas

    lasvegas 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2001
    Posts:
    122
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Las Vegas, Nevada
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    According to my stuff, the one piece started in 86. But there are still 12 3/4" and 14" after that. The smaller ones had 153 teeth and the larger ones had 168.

    Part No. Diam. Year Crank Flange Converter Bolt Tooth
    Bolt Pattern Pattern Count
    471598 14" 70-85 3.58" 10.75" 11.5" 168
    471578 14" 70-80 3.58" 10.75" 11.5" 168
    471529 12 3/4" 69-85 3.58" 9.75" 10.75" 153
    14088765 12 3/4" 86-up 3.00" 10.75" 153
    12554824 14" 86-up 3.00" 11.50" 168
    14088761 14" 86-up 3.00" 10.75" 11.5" 168

    The above info is from the GM performance parts book. Hope this is some help.
     
  13. Twiz

    Twiz 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2001
    Posts:
    3,729
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Clearfield Ut.
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    Circumfrence!!!!!!

    Give me some slak, My frontal lobes clocked out hours ago..I'm working on instincts now..

    <font color=white>.</font color=white>Eric
    <font color=white>.</font color=white>Twizted
     
  14. 55Willy

    55Willy 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2001
    Posts:
    9,946
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Keizer, Or
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    <blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr>

    wise ass (i was wondering the same thing "hows he gonna know when hes done 1/4" but i wasnt gonna say nuthin)

    <hr></blockquote>
    Wise ass????? " It's better to remain silent and be thought a fool, then to open your mouth and remove all doubt."

    But all in all your post was very informative[​IMG]

    <font color=red>Life is like a mud hole:</font color=red><font color=blue>
    When the S#!T gets deep, you have to keep moving and friends can always pull you out</font color=blue>
    55 Willy's
     
  15. lasvegas

    lasvegas 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2001
    Posts:
    122
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Las Vegas, Nevada
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    Isn't radius equal to 1/2 Pie squared or something like that. That should be easy to back out your diameter. But 55Willy's idea would work excellent too.
     
  16. Twiz

    Twiz 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2001
    Posts:
    3,729
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Clearfield Ut.
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    O.K. so to put this all togather, we come up with...

    A 14 inch diameter flex-plate, would have a circumfrence of 45 inches, a 1/4 of that would be 11.25.
    So, measure 11.25 inches around the flex-plate and count the teeth.
    *I came up with 42 teeth, so I have a 168 tooth flex-plate.*

    Now what happens if the diameter is 12 inches? I don't know.
    But useing Lasvegas's chart, the 12 inch flex-plate has 153 teeth.
    Both 14" plates have 168 teeth.
    If Steve measures his, and the measurements come out like mine did (above).
    Than it's a 168 / 14" flex-plate and Steve is screwed.
    If they come-out diffent, than Steve's pulling out the tranns again, atleast 1/2-way (still screwd)

    <font color=white>.</font color=white>Eric
    <font color=white>.</font color=white>Twizted
     
  17. ChevyHuny

    ChevyHuny 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2001
    Posts:
    2,279
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Washington State
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    <blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr>

    In reply to:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    wise ass (i was wondering the same thing "hows he gonna know when hes done 1/4" but i wasnt gonna say nuthin)



    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Wise ass????? " It's better to remain silent and be thought a fool, then to open your mouth and remove all doubt."

    But all in all your post was very informative

    <hr></blockquote>



    LOL!!! You have helped me on a million things Jeremy dont worry about his worthless comment..he is just BEING an ass. :)
     
  18. TorkDSR

    TorkDSR 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2001
    Posts:
    1,258
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    bucks co pa
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    ass? i dont get it.

    beligerence doesn't justify intelligence.
    <font color=blue>wheelers hate posers.</font color=blue>
    <font color=red>79k15/400/700r4/205/38.5</font color=red>
     
  19. TorkDSR

    TorkDSR 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2001
    Posts:
    1,258
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    bucks co pa
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    and im still kinda curious to find out how to only count 1/4 of the teeth, maybe there's some obvious method that im missing [​IMG]

    beligerence doesn't justify intelligence.
    <font color=blue>wheelers hate posers.</font color=blue>
    <font color=red>79k15/400/700r4/205/38.5</font color=red>
     
  20. Pure Insanity

    Pure Insanity 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2001
    Posts:
    4,579
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Dade City, Florida
    Re: Starter engagement problem

    Thanx everyone but its kinda a moot point now.....Pure Insanity is down for the count. [​IMG] I had to limp it home 30 plus miles from work. Made for quite a ride. It wont idle in gear and is generally running like shiznit. Anything under 2 grand it bucks and kicks, get above 2 and its like you were rear ended by a train. (WHEEEEE!!!) LOL! I am done playing w/ this carb. I am gonna order a new one and be done w/ it.

    As for the flexplate issue....I am 95% sure its cracked. Its a new flywheel w/ less than 1000 miles on it. I will just pull the motor, get an SFI approved flywheel, and put in a stall converter while Im there. The list goes on, as to why I am pulling it for now.

    Thanx everyone.

    If ya can't stop.......Smile as you go under! [​IMG]
    PIC of mine from flblazers site<a target="_blank" href=http://www.flblazer.alloffroad.com/photo3.html>
    GO</a>
     

Share This Page