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support bars from tranny to t-case....

Discussion in '1973-1991 K5 Blazer | Truck | Suburban' started by dyeager535, Apr 4, 2001.

  1. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Wondering what, if anything, would have been used (K30's I would imagine would have had this combo) on a Hydraulic clutch bellhousing, and an NP205. I know the 700's got bracing from bellhousing to transfer case, and I believe my bellhousing did too, but I'm not sure if the 205 does..I know it has two bolts on the passenger side, but not drivers side. (thought these were for earlier transfercase to frame mounts though)

    I definitely want to run them if they are necessary, but there aren't many hydraulic clutch/205 combo's running around that I can just check on...I assume ones from a 700 could be adapted to work though. Thoughts on running/not running them? If theres no question I should be running them, no reason to tell me horror stories, just that I need them. Thanks!

    Dorian
    My K5 and Chev/Olds tech/links page: <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.dorianyeager.com/index2.html>http://www.dorianyeager.com/index2.html</A>
     
  2. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    I have the non-hydraulic bell housing and an NP 205...no braces, I don't think they were used from the factory either. I can't see the hydraulic bell housing being much different strength wise.

    Rene

    [​IMG]<A target="_blank" HREF=http://jules.coloradok5.com>http://jules.coloradok5.com</A>
     
  3. HarryH3

    HarryH3 1 ton status Author

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    Don't know specifically about the arrangement with the hydraulic clutch. However, my 205 attached to the back of a Turbo 400 came with that brace.

    <font color=black>HarryH3 - '75 K5</font color=black>
    <A target="_blank" HREF=http://ThunderTruck.ColoradoK5.com>http://ThunderTruck.ColoradoK5.com</A>
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  4. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Why exactly did GM feel the need to run them on the 700's then? I think you are right, the housing for the hydraulic are no weaker, it just seems odd that Gm decided that the 700's needed them...I don't think the 350's and 400's got them either...maybe just a thinner casting on the 700. Thanks for the input.


    Dorian
    My K5 and Chev/Olds tech/links page: <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.dorianyeager.com/index2.html>http://www.dorianyeager.com/index2.html</A>
     
  5. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Yours had the t-case to frame brace or the bellhousing to t-case bracing? If transmission to t-case, one brace or two??
    thanks

    Dorian
    My K5 and Chev/Olds tech/links page: <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.dorianyeager.com/index2.html>http://www.dorianyeager.com/index2.html</A>
     
  6. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    I beleive the TH350/NP203 came with a brace, not too sure about other 'auto' combo's though. I would think any auto combo would need one just to keep the case from cracking.

    Rene

    [​IMG]<A target="_blank" HREF=http://jules.coloradok5.com>http://jules.coloradok5.com</A>
     
  7. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Still don't see why, with both bellhousings being aluminum and both being around the same thickness, (AFAIK) that GM decided the auto's needed bracing and the manuals didn't. Maybe I'm missing something here, but with a 203, I can't imagine the t-case was what they were trying to protect (I could if it was only the 208) Ahhhh...think I got it..the manual tranny bellhousing are completely round aren't they? More evenly distributed stress.

    Dorian
    My K5 and Chev/Olds tech/links page: <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.dorianyeager.com/index2.html>http://www.dorianyeager.com/index2.html</A>
     
  8. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    Don't forget the huge stiffeners cast into the manual housing...[​IMG]

    Rene

    [​IMG]<A target="_blank" HREF=http://jules.coloradok5.com>http://jules.coloradok5.com</A>
     
  9. Emmettology 101

    Emmettology 101 3/4 ton status

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    Yes, the th350, 400 and 700's come with bars. Just one though and some Th400 combos in 3/4 and 1 tons had supports from the bottom bellhousing inspection pan to the engine block also!


    <font color=green><A target="_blank" HREF=http://emmett.coloradok5.com>http://emmett.coloradok5.com</A></font color=green>[​IMG]
     
  10. Grim-Reaper

    Grim-Reaper 3/4 ton status Author

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    In the 70's with the introduction of the 203 (one heavy mother of a case) GM was having problems with all the weigh hanging on the back would bust the bell housing if the truck was taking a beating. This was happening only on the Automatic trucks. sometime after 75 they started making a "4x4 TH350's" that had a thicker bell housing and a provision for to braces that ran form the motor mounts to a beefed up tranny cover. They also used a brace running fron the side of the T-Case to the bell housing to brace there. The Manual trucks had a stronger bellhousing to behin with and it also had a fou housing instead of the bottom cut off that also added strength so I'm not sure the Manual truck got any other brace off the bell housing. Depending on the year the manuals did get either a rod off the case to the bell housing or a torq arm to the frame. and some came with none of the above. My guess in the 3/4 ton trucks with manuals got those braces. I guess some of these braces carried into the 80's on trucks with the cast iron cases like the 205. Now unless you have owned your truck from new and did all your own work there is no telling if your truck came with the braces. A lazy tranny shop or mechanic may not have put them on after rebuilding a tranny or replacing a clutch. Just no telling.

    Diging it in the dirt with my K5's
    Grim-Reaper
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  11. BurbinOR

    BurbinOR 3/4 ton status

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    Got them on my 79 406/T350/NP203 combo - both sides.

    <font color=orange>'79 - 406 TPI -<font color=orange> K5#5 - <font color=blue>See it at---&gt;<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.blazzinor.coloradok5.com>http://www.blazzinor.coloradok5.com</A>
     
  12. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Yep, bellhousing came out of the wrecking yard, was in a pile of bellhousings. No way to know. I'll check and see what kind of provisions for mounting them I have. Its a truck, theres no such thing as overkill.

    Dorian
    My K5 and Chev/Olds tech/links page: <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.dorianyeager.com/index2.html>http://www.dorianyeager.com/index2.html</A>
     
  13. HarryH3

    HarryH3 1 ton status Author

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    Dorian, my setup came out of a 1980 1-ton GMC truck. I got everything from the tranny down to where the driveshafts attached to the axle yokes. It has the large brace that bolts to the right side of the transfer case. From there it goes up to one of the bolts that hold the tranny to the engine.

    <font color=black>HarryH3 - '75 K5</font color=black>
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  14. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    Quick example of the weak link Dorian, I skyed my truck while having a testoterone moment in the mud about 2 years ago. I got the front end about 3 feet or so off the ground coming out of a hole and landed pretty hard.[​IMG]
    When I got home I had a puddle of 90 weight on the ground under my tranny, I guess my landing was pretty hard because the cast iron T-case adaptor was cracked...[​IMG] however the bell housing was fine[​IMG]

    A brace couldn't hurt, but I wouldn't worry about the bell-housing either.

    I sent ya a PM

    Rene

    [​IMG]<A target="_blank" HREF=http://jules.coloradok5.com>http://jules.coloradok5.com</A>
     
  15. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Cool. Nice to know the bellhousing can handle it. Only way I see myself getting air is getting run off the road : )

    Another person that has broken the adapter...any chance anyone out there knows someone that is making these things for less than 8 million a pop? I can't believe that it would be very hard to make a better (read stronger) machined aluminum adapter. The "feet" on these things where the bolts go seem to really be the weak link, although sounds like you found another hehe...in any case, I am not going to run poly trans mounts just for this reason. maybe if I had poly motor mounts, but with the stock mounts, I can see how much the motor/trans twists under acceleration, and without the soft rubber to cushion that, the bolt "ears" are going to be the first things to break.


    Dorian
    My K5 and Chev/Olds tech/links page: <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.dorianyeager.com/index2.html>http://www.dorianyeager.com/index2.html</A>
     
  16. Grim-Reaper

    Grim-Reaper 3/4 ton status Author

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    Yeah I have helped straighten that sort of mess out before. Bud has a 72 K5 Got it air born came down hard on the nose and broke lots of parts. He had a 700r4 with corvett servo then works in it and a 208 (not my truck don't give me heck about a 208 in a 72 his didn't have it anyway he had a D20).
    Well old GM Mounts don't stop foward motion. Busted diverside exhuast manifold when it hit the cross member, Ripped the case off the back of the tranny. The 208 didn't bust the back of the tranny broke. It was nasty damage. All that ATF pouring out the truck looked like it was bleeding.

    Diging it in the dirt with my K5's
    Grim-Reaper
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  17. jarheadk5

    jarheadk5 1/2 ton status

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    FYI: My 87 with 305, 700R4 and 208 has both braces: Block to bellhousing and bellhousing to xfer case. I believe it's one per side; bellhousing to xfer case is on passenger side (this I know-added fluid to case today), block to bellhousing is driver side (I think-wasn't looking there).

    [​IMG] Semper Maintenance!
     
  18. Wheels

    Wheels 1/2 ton status

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    On my 79 which used to have a th350/np203, had the block to bell housing and bellhousing to 203. Modified the bell housing to t-case strut from this set up to fit the 700r4/np205 set up I have now. According to a source, the strut that runs from the bellhousing to the t-case is a torque strut that is supposed to prevent automatic transmissions (manuals are tougher) from twisting when under torque, mainly in the main housing area and not in the bell housing area. All 4x4 auto tranny's have a thicker case in the bell housing area (should have a "K" cast into the top side of the bell housing area). The struts that go from the dust cover to the motor mounts (should be two) are designed to provide extra support for the center section on autos (another weak area). Manual tranny's have a 1-piece bell housing and reinforcements cast into the housing itself.
     

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