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Timing problems with new crate motor

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by COCHEV, Sep 11, 2003.

  1. COCHEV

    COCHEV 1/2 ton status

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    I'm down in the bay area helping my buddy out with his 86 blazer. he just droped in a GM Goodwrench crate motor and we can't get it timed. when we put it to TDC and set it at 8 degrees advanced it runs like crap. it's not 180 out, we/ve checked it twice. it will run better if we time it "by ear" but then the timing mark is no where to be seen. we even went to the parts store to make sure we had the right ballencer. also, when we get it running ok it runs hot.

    i think they might have installed the timing gear wrong when it was assembled and didn't line up the 2 timing markes correctlly. we might drop the pan and timing cover tomorrow and see. other then that, i'm stumped. what do you guys think???
     
  2. call your local dealer and ask them the deal with it. When I put mine in they told me something about problems with timing. I know mine came with two different markers. Heck I forget now what it was we did, but mine timed great.
     
  3. gravdigr

    gravdigr 1/2 ton status

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    One other problem I had with my Jasper motor that sounds a hell of a lot like your problem....I could not get it timed for crap. Finally I pulled #1 plug and got TDC then checked the rotor button,, it was at least 90 degrees out. At the time I had no clue how or why and I just moved my plug wires around and everything works fine now. Later I learned that the problem is where the oil pump and distributer join together. You need to reach in the distributer hole with a long screwdriver and turn the oil pump a bit until it lines up with the dist at correct time. Before pulling the timing chain cover I would pop off the dist cap and see where the rotor is pointing at TDC. If it isn't pointing right at plug 1 the oil pump needs turned.
     
  4. Grim-Reaper

    Grim-Reaper 3/4 ton status Author

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    Wrong harmonic ballancer. That's what it was on mine. Timing mark is not matching the placement of the one on the timming chain cover.

    If yours is like mine look between the water pump and block. I eyeballed mine off the center bolt on the back of the water pump. On the motor it replaced that was about 8 degrees. Ran great no problems passing emmisions.
     
  5. COCHEV

    COCHEV 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Wrong harmonic ballancer. That's what it was on mine. Timing mark is not matching the placement of the one on the timming chain cover.


    [/ QUOTE ]

    well we looked into that. but the crate he oldered was for an 86 and we took his old ballancer to the parts stor and compaired it to a new one from an 86 and they were the same. does chevy make 2 different kinds for a 350? /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
     
  6. Quack_Addict

    Quack_Addict 1/2 ton status

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    Pull the left (driver side) valve cover and check valve timing - then compare where you're at to the mark on the harmonic balancer.

    I normally just set the distributor where it needs to be (as described previously). If it doesn't fall down all the way onto the oil pump, bumping the starter a time or two makes it fall right down; then just tighten up the distributor retainer / bolt.
     
  7. Grim-Reaper

    Grim-Reaper 3/4 ton status Author

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    Look where the timming tab is on the old motor and on the crate. My old motor you looked between the water pump and the block to see the tab. The crate the tab was between the water pump and power steering pump. The ballancer you have is marked for the straight up position. Your timming mark is at the 2 o-clock.
     
  8. COCHEV

    COCHEV 1/2 ton status

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    we have set the distrib in as everyone has discribed and stll no good. was there any difference in ballancers and timing marks through the 80s for a 350 OR a difference in where you mount the timing tab?????
     
  9. COCHEV

    COCHEV 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Look where the timming tab is on the old motor and on the crate. My old motor you looked between the water pump and the block to see the tab. The crate the tab was between the water pump and power steering pump. The ballancer you have is marked for the straight up position. Your timming mark is at the 2 o-clock.



    [/ QUOTE ]

    we are going to look into this right now. can anyone tell me why the heck they would put the tab in different places for different years? and so if im reading this correctly the ballancers my all be the same but the tab my need to go into a diffeerent spot? why?
     
  10. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    I would guess the tab was moved either for different balancer sizes (if there were any later) or more likely, the accessories started to get in the way of the original timing location.
     
  11. COCHEV

    COCHEV 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Wrong harmonic ballancer

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Grimmy, you nailed it. after messing around with all the stupid ass parts stores, we finally went to a GM dealer and made the guy start pulling out ballancers. the first one matched our old one, then the next one the timing line was about an inch to 1 1/2" different then ours. so, 130 bucks later (OUCH!) and 2 more parts stores later to get a ballancer installer (the only way to do it- we know /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif) we got her together and she timed out perfect no problems.

    thanks for all the repleys, guys /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     
  12. Grim-Reaper

    Grim-Reaper 3/4 ton status Author

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    [ QUOTE ]
    [ QUOTE ]
    Wrong harmonic ballancer

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Grimmy, you nailed it. after messing around with all the stupid ass parts stores, we finally went to a GM dealer and made the guy start pulling out ballancers. the first one matched our old one, then the next one the timing line was about an inch to 1 1/2" different then ours. so, 130 bucks later (OUCH!) and 2 more parts stores later to get a ballancer installer (the only way to do it- we know /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif) we got her together and she timed out perfect no problems.

    thanks for all the repleys, guys /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Told you so LOL. I went through exactly the same problem. See the problem is your truck specs the ballancer with the timing mark straight up. The new crates even though they direct replacement for 85 down that timing tab was not the same location. Your not going to hurt the motor running the wrong one. They do ballance correctly, just the mark in the wrong place. Now when I dropped that crate in my truck and tried to time it that sucker was isling at about 200rpm with about 40 degrees of retard. That impressed me.

    Also some come passengerside dipstick and some can run either or. In our 79 the passengerside dipstick was a BIG improvement over the driverside. Much easier to get at.
     

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