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to anyone that has welded their spiders...

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by jekbrown, Aug 16, 2002.

  1. jekbrown

    jekbrown I am CK5 Premium Member GMOTM Winner Author

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    is there a function check you do after this install? I welded mine just like the ck5 tech article says to... and when I corner I get more of a sand-paper type sound. I assume its my tires not turning at different speeds (a good sign!) but I havent heard much chirping. I dunno, maybe I havent tried turning sharp enough. Also, I have noticed a general tendency when in a turn for the rig to want to come to rest/slow down... I was backing into my driveway and each time I lost momentum and stopped it seemed to take more gas than normal to get going again... is this just cause its welded and I was turning slightly or...?

    if anyone out there (rene!!) has welded their spiders, please let us noobs know what kinda symptoms (other than the tight-turn chirp!) you experience. thanks much!!

    J
     
  2. Shaggy

    Shaggy 3/4 ton status

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    <font color="green"> I don't have welded spiders, but the symptoms you describe seem as though they'd be pretty normal. Some tires don't chirp or squeal, probably has to do with the durometer of the rubber. I know that My Swampers don't make any noise when I spin 'em (yeah yeah, I know, only done it a couple of times), they leave black marks and haze a little, but no squealing noises. As for the slowing down when turning, that seems normal as well. Since you're basically dragging one tire along it's creating friction, hence resisting movement.
     
  3. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    The resistance of the tires in tight turns means you have to 'power' into a parking spot for example. The same forces that make the tires chirp act to slow the truck down in tight quarters.

    My tires don't always chirp around corners, but there are certain corners i go around regularly that they always chirp. One in particular has a bump half way through the corner and it always chirps right there. On not so tight corners you can just hear them scuffing a little...

    One example I can give is that turning into my driveway I use granny low. I crest a speedbump and have to cut hard right and uphill into the driveway. There is enough resistance to cause clutch chatter if I use second...

    Rene
     
  4. mplogic

    mplogic 1/2 ton status

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    There is no "function" test, you just disabled all function in that rear end. /forums/images/icons/smile.gif Ever ridden a RWD sport quad, like a banshee or something on the street? With a solid rear axle (no diff) both rear wheels are driven at the same time which fights against your steering input causing the vehicle to always want to go straight. Whenever you are not going perfectly straight on a perfectly even surface you will have to fight the tire that wants to drag with more throttle or aggressive steering. As you give it more gas in a turn to overcome this you will hear louder chirping or squealing as you lay down rubber. When you are trying to coast through a corner you will have a ton of understeer as the rear end is wanting to go straight. As you give it throttle to overcome the dragging tire, you will experience extreme oversteer as the rear end wants to kick out. Be careful when pulling out into traffic if you give it too much gas or try to pull into the first lane. Also they can be a real handful on the freeway, especially on a long curvy downhill. You can lessen the severity of the effect by driving in 4WD on the street which will help pull the truck into line. Vehicle manufactures don't put anything in a car that isn't absolutely necessary (drivetrain wise). If it was deemed usable (or safe) to drive on paved surfaces without a differential then all these cheaply made RWD little econoboxes would have solid axles in their rear ends. A FWD vehicle is hardly turnable on the street with a locked diff. You can probably get away with it by learning how the truck will handle in various situations and then anticipating them. Driving on dirt is another matter. The lack of traction allows the tires to turn freely, although you are still losing traction by always kicking one tire loose. Not really a "tread lightly" sort of setup. The only time a fully locked rear end is ever necessary is in very low speed rock crawling or drag racing where steering with the rear end is desirable.
     
  5. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    You are grossly overstating the effects in everyday traffic. It is hardly noticable on 'street' driving and it takes almost twice the throttle input to 'kick the rearend sideways'.


    Try sticking with first hand experience...

    Rene
     
  6. mudhog

    mudhog THEGAME Staff Member Super Moderator

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    </font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
    The only time a fully locked rear end is ever necessary is in very low speed rock crawling or drag racing where steering with the rear end is desirable.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    it may not be NECESSARY but it sure is nice to have in most all situations /forums/images/icons/grin.gif
     
  7. mplogic

    mplogic 1/2 ton status

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    Heh, I hear ya. If my rig spent more time off-road than on road, I'd probably consider spooling the rear end too.

    Rene, I don't doubt that you are very skilled at handling your truck. I just don't recommend a fully locked rear end to anyone who drives mostly on-road. Most of my experience is drag racing related. I've seen people lock up their rear ends in their daily driver, weekend racer and then after trying to drive it a week around town pulling it back out. I've driven a truck with a fully locked rear end and it was not for me. But, I am a bit of a handeling freak, being a racing to wheeling convert. /forums/images/icons/smile.gif If I was a "born and raised" wheeler, I'd probably not mind the on-road drawbacks. But you've got to admit that it does handle differently than an open rear or even a locker and it does take some getting used to.
     
  8. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    Yes I admit it takes a little getting used to...but it is extremely predictable and the things that take getting used to are the low speed and tight turning type things. At speed, freeway, and even city it's seamless...

    One thing I will say is that I would not do this to anything less strong than a 14 bolt...

    Rene
     
  9. m j

    m j 1/2 ton status

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    I had a Datsun 510 with a welded dif and it never intentionally went off road, cant say it was a dragracer either

    http://trans-amseries.com/carfacts.html

    according to this site the coolest roadrace cars in the world (guess I could be biased about that) use a spool or detroit and they run super tight street circuits

    </font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
    Vehicle manufactures don't put anything in a car that isn't absolutely necessary (drivetrain wise)

    [/ QUOTE ]

    this sounds pretty hard to argue your side with things like 'Eventual Trac' and the electro magnetic clutches in some modern 4x4s

    with completely bald tires a welded/spooled dif can be a deadly thing, not to much different a discription then with a open dif though.

    a 'posi' is scarier as you never really know when it will release and possibly contribute to an unwanted offroad excursion. all 5.0 mustang owners have experienced that fun

    a detroit has annoying quirks when the axles recouple with cute lil names like 'locker induced lane change', that phrase overstates the problem but they do kick the truck around a bit and the huge metallic crashing sound can have you wondering if the tranny just fell out and pedestrians stare at you.

    I have owned all of them and still am a proponent of a spool in the rear dif, but I wouldnt let my mother drive the vehicle in the rain.
    If you can't drive then stay away from any posi/locker equiped vehicle, but if you dont lose your wits or actually enjoy hanging the tail out come on to Team Sideways
     
  10. KRAZIE87K5

    KRAZIE87K5 1/2 ton status

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    um.... k?!!!!! Like Rene said...
    </font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
    Try sticking with first hand experience...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    -Dan
     
  11. 72THING

    72THING 1/2 ton status

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    LOL. Mike, you're hilarious. I agree a posi or auto locker can sometimes be hairy. But a welded diff or spool is always predictable.

    Will
     

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