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Trailer length

Discussion in 'Tow & Trailer' started by kennyw, Jun 8, 2004.

  1. kennyw

    kennyw N9PHW Premium Member

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    I want to buy or build a gooseneck trailer big enough to fit 2 fullsize longbed pickups. The truck on the back could overhang the trailer as long as the axle goes far enough up the trailer to secure and haul it safely. Anyone have a good idea how long the deck would need to be to do this? I'm thinking 30-35' off the top of my head.
     
  2. 83ZZ502_Jimmy

    83ZZ502_Jimmy 1/2 ton status

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    IMO 36' is better. Friend of mine transported two on a 36' with a little room to spare. For a little extra $$ the extra room is worth it IMO.

    John
     
  3. ugly_blazer

    ugly_blazer 1/2 ton status

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    It woulnd't be much more $$$ to just go 40', what if you end up with a crewcab on there /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
     
  4. kennyw

    kennyw N9PHW Premium Member

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    I'm mainly after the minimum length to haul 2 fullsize, regular cab, longbed pickups with no more than 3' of the rear truck overhanging the end of the trailer (for legal and safety reasons)... Most of the time I would be setting it up to haul a slide in pickup camper on the front and a trail rig at the back but I want the capability for 2 fullsizes. Not really worried about a crewcab being on there with another pickup though.
     
  5. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

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    IMO there is no way to safely pull two pickups behind one pickup. You need something capable of pulling a 10,000 lb trailer plus two 6,000 lb pickups. That means a trailer with at least a 20,000 lb GVWR and a medium duty truck to pull it.

    The best pickups are rated for 15-16k lbs and even that is pushing it.

    IMO two pickups being towed by one light duty vehicle is just too much weight, and too unsafe.
     
  6. kennyw

    kennyw N9PHW Premium Member

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    I really didnt say what my tow rig would be did I? I plan on using a 2 ton or larger truck for hauling that big of a load but want to keep the trailer small enough to pull behind a 1 ton dually with just a camper and trail rig on it. If I put 2 trucks that weigh in around 6-7K and the trailer weighed 3-4K. Best case would be about 15K worst case about 18K. As long as it is planned out properly it can be done safely.
     
  7. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

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    The trailer isn't going to weigh 3-4k, you're way off with that idea. My trailer weighs 2500 and it's only 20 feet long with a wood deck. A 35' or longer trailer is going to be at least twice what mine is, the majority I've seen are three times what mine weighs at least. (most are 8,000 or so empty)

    I was going to buy a trailer that is capable of hauling two rigs but decided against it. It's just not practical for a pickup truck. I wanted to do it, but it's just not safe.
     
  8. big83chevy4x4

    big83chevy4x4 3/4 ton status

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    my k20 is 18.5" long bumper to bumper, so you would need at least a 35' bed. a 38' would be ideal.

    on the trailer weight, i would guess it would be about 6000-8000lbs depends on how its built. i use my grandpas 16' trailer, it weights about 1800 lbs. it has a 3" wood deck and 1.5" rails all the way around. that trailer was built to haul wieght, he has hauled 2 john deere B tractors and about 3 10hp john deere engines at the same time, with a motorhome
     
  9. therobzilla

    therobzilla 1/2 ton status

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    You can safely tow two 6k rig behind a gooseneck trailer no problem. I tow my blazer a side in camper and all the people and gear and with a Dodge 1 ton dually w/ a utility body with gear on it. The Gooseneck is rated to tow 20K easily. The dually will tow this very safely with brakes on 2 axles and everything safely tied down. Now your rig is going to have to be built to tow this kind of weight, but the hotshotters tow over 20K rated all the time and it's DOT legal if you rate the trailer and have the rig re-rated/re-inspeced for the weight no problem. I don't know the actual terms for it, re-rating the tow rig, but they do it all the time. I have customers that tow well over 25K in Idaho & Wyoming with a 3500 Dodge Dually and have it DOT approved and inspected.

    Saftey is the biggest factor. And a 1 ton dually can be made and re-worked to be safe at this weight factor easily. Bags in the rear, brakeaway boxes, well maintained and working trailer brakes, lights, rated trailers, right sized and rated tires, etc....

    It's kinda of a challenge pulling a long rig/trailer, but it's done on a regular basis and done legally and safely.

    Just my two cents.

    Rob
     
  10. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

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    [ QUOTE ]
    And a 1 ton dually can be made and re-worked to be safe at this weight factor easily. Bags in the rear, brakeaway boxes, well maintained and working trailer brakes, lights, rated trailers, right sized and rated tires, etc....

    [/ QUOTE ]

    That is a matter of opinion.

    Although all those items will make towing an easier experience, they do not increase the capacity of your truck.

    Breaking your GVWR and rear GAWR as well as GCWR by 30-40% on a regular basis doesn't seem like a good idea to me.

    To each his own, but just stay the hell away from me when you're going down the road.

    Pushing it is one thing, but overloading by 40% is downright scary here.

    I'm done commenting here, but y'all really should know better to say that anything like that can be done, "Safely" or "legally". Despite what a truck is plated for, if it is overloaded as per what the manufacturer says it can tow/carry, it will likely break the law. I don't think there is any question that the suspension, frame, and drivetrain is not made for that kind of abuse either, even though the engine in some of these newer trucks sure is.
     
  11. therobzilla

    therobzilla 1/2 ton status

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    To the original poster:

    I would urge you to reasearch the topic very carefully. It just amazes me that one person can know so much about everyting??? /forums/images/graemlins/bow.gif Why post anything else from anyone else?? /forums/images/graemlins/dunno.gif I will post up a link to the DTR board, and you can do some reasearch here too, some of the hotshotter here have towed these weights just fine and have had there rigs recertified just fine by DOT and others.

    Don't listen to just me, but don't listen to just one. It just totally amazed me?? /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif

    Here is the link I promised DTR Home Page

    Good luck and do your homework, don't over worry, you can caravan with me anytime /forums/images/graemlins/woot.gif, I hang on 10 on the CB! /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif
     
  12. afroman006

    afroman006 1/2 ton status

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    I give you exibit A. I had these two CUCV's hotshotted to my shop. The tow rig is an F250, bone stock at the time. He hauled it about 50 miles, in the rain. Top speed was 60 MPH and we had absolutely no problems. The trailer is a 40 footer. [​IMG]
     
  13. ugly_blazer

    ugly_blazer 1/2 ton status

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    I agree with you, I think that when properly equipped a 1 ton truck can safely hall 2 full size trucks. I've seen the hotshotters hall 4 cars, sometimes 3 conversion vans, etc... And as you stated they are DOT legal. I drive a semi truck, and when DOT looks at (inspects) your truck they climb up your a$$ with a microscope! If it were unsafe there would be no way that they would recertified and definitely never make it through a weigh station if they were overweight. Again, don't listen to opinion presented as fact from someone who likely has never even pulled a gooseneck trailer...
     
  14. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

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    You're right, I have never pulled a gooseneck trailer, but the last I checked there is a 33' 5th wheel in my backyard.

    You guys are pathetic to say that I'm a "know it all" because I understand the factory ratings for a vehicle. It doesn't take long to read a trailering guide and realize a rig is overloaded at that kind of weight.

    Two trucks @ 6,000 lbs + a 7,000 lb trailer = 19,000 + 7,000 lb truck to pull them = 26,000 lbs.

    That kind of weight is really borderline even for an F-550 or similar truck, and you'd have to actually measure the weight the pin weight because you might manage to bust the GVWR with that much pin weight.

    The only reason I've researched this subject is that two weeks ago before I bought my own trailer, this is something that I was considering doing myself. I sat here and crunched the numbers, and it is just not practical or safe.

    I assure you that the above F250 is exceeding its GVWR, rear GAWR, and the rating of those two tires in the back of the truck. I'd bet by a signficant amount, too (I would venture to say that rig is up to 1,000 lbs over the GVWR and even more than that over the axle rating and tires).

    Seriously people, you've got to have more sense than this. DOT will let you plate your rig for whatever you want. I can plate my 1 ton for 14,000 if I want. I can plate my trailer for another 14,000. That means I can make my single wheel truck and trailder combo, according to you guys, "Legally" gross nearly twice its factory spec'ed GCWR. That would be insane, unsafe, and impractial......and most likely illegal.

    I highly doubt any insurance policy will cover you if you're overloaded by that kind of margin, either.

    DOT doesn't give a rat's ass what your truck can pull or what it is rated for. All they're going to do is check your hitching equipment, check the truck for brakes, lights, etc., and send you down the road.

    Checking the manufacturer's rating is YOUR responsibility and it is very irresponsible for someone to overload a truck like that and head off down the public roadway.

    /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif We're all adults here. I've pulled more than my share of trailers. I've pulled some pretty damn scary ones, too. Just because I lived to tell about it doesn't make those experiences safe.

    Grow up and get past the tone that you don't seem to like about my posts, the intentions of it are good. Seriously reconsider what you're doing before you hitch a trailer with a 20,000 lb GVWR to a truck with an 8,800-10,000 lb GVWR and expect to go down the road.

    There is absolutely nothing safe about overloading anything to that margin. I'm sure some of you don't even realize just how unsafe that is.

    New pickups have so much power/torque they will pull anything and bring anything up to speed. That's why it's damn near impossible for me to sit here and tell you that Ford with a school bus/garbage truck engine and 1 ton gear isn't enough for pulling a specific weight, but seriously guys, check your ratings and weight your vehicles before you make decisions like this.

    I'm trying to say this in the nicest way possible. As a private citizen I don't want to have to go through weigh stations or inspections or any stupid crap like that. But if people continue to overload pickup trucks in this manner I think one day I probably will be required to submit to such inspections.

    Please, dear God, make activity like this stop!!!!!1 /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif

    If overloading by a 40% margin was safe or legal, you think I would have paid $3000 for a 14,000 lb trailer when there are pleny of brand new 7,000 lb trailers on the market for $1500?
     
  15. jac6695

    jac6695 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    It just amazes me that one person can know so much about everything???

    [/ QUOTE ]

    You do realize this wealth of knowledge comes from the Wonder Boy himself? /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif
    We need a new forum: Ask Timmy . /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif Put it right near the Center of Gravity.

    My brother and a good friend each have 3-car trailers they tow everyday with GMC 2500HD trucks and have absolutely no problems with them. My brother has actually weighed his with and average load of 3 midsize cars and all axles are within manufacturers ratings. With being used to tow something around 80% of the time (empty trailer or loaded, in the city), the disk brake pads on his '01 truck lasted near 100,000 miles. Does that sound like an overloaded truck? Properly loaded and setup, this kind of load is fine on a pickup truck.

    Kenny never did say what his tow rig will be, but two pickup trucks on a gooseneck towed with a 1 ton truck would work well.
     
  16. jac6695

    jac6695 1/2 ton status

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    Timmy, I don't think anyone likes to be critical here, but you really do come across as a know-it-all. You are right about reading trailering guides and ratings, but consider this for a moment (just think about it).

    From the GM website, a 2500HD truck with DMax/Allison is rated to tow a 15,500 lb. trailer (remember, single wheel, 3/4 ton truck, not even a Dooley). You are right about two average pickup trucks weighing 6000 lbs./each, but we all have seen 4 wheel drive 1/2 ton and 3/4 ton trucks shown to weigh much less. A gooseneck trailer long enough to to fit these two trucks will not weigh 7000 lbs. as you described, but more like 4000 lbs. (or less).

    6000 + 6000 + 4000= 16,000 lbs. That is pretty damn close to the 15,500 GM wanted. I don't think you have to haul two 6000 lb. trucks at the same time and could meet the GM spec easily with on 500 lbs. less.

    You also have to remember that this is GM spec on a single wheel truck, which for liability reasons is way under rated. These trucks are capable of more weight.
     
  17. skratch

    skratch 1/2 ton status

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    The only thing I want to add here is that over the past week I was dealing with Overbuilt Trailer company, and their 20ft 10 ton gooseneck with tandem duals weighs in dry at 5945lbs. I know they build some seriously heavy trailers and there are lighter ones on the market so the weight that some of these more knowledgeable souls are giving is just about right.

    I used to work where a lot of these hotshotters were picking up lease return cars and hauling 3-4 or more on their trailers. The tow rigs, like others stated, have been recertified with higher a GCVWR for pulling these trailers. It can be made very safe and legal.

    From their experience though I have learned to stay away from the large Fords for this type of hauling, it tends to tear up the cab structure (at least on the crappy roads around here) specifically the F650 and up. But most of the guys I saw doing this succesfully were running either re-certified Dodge 1ton duallys or SuperDuty's likethe 450-550 with custom beds.

    Sounds like quite a venture your going to be embarking on, good luck with it! /forums/images/graemlins/waytogo.gif
     
  18. kennyw

    kennyw N9PHW Premium Member

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    Tim are you aware how the Companys that build the trucks we drive design them? The 73-87 C/K30-50 series trucks for example all use the same frame. Only difference is axles, brakes and springs. So if you put in air bags and better brakes (or properly equipt trailer brakes) you are increasing the Gross Combined Vehicle Weight Rating (GCVWR). You could get a 1 ton from the Factory with a GVWR of 12-15K with the same frame as the 10K GVWR and that isnt even the COMBINED rating.

    I am an engineer and would not put something on the road that was not safe but I also know that a GCVWR on a truck can be raised from the original factory # if done right. However, my plans for a tow rig look something like this:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    So this discussion really should not be part of this thread...
     
  19. kennyw

    kennyw N9PHW Premium Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    I was going to buy a trailer that is capable of hauling two rigs but decided against it. It's just not practical for a pickup truck. I wanted to do it, but it's just not safe.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    That sounds like the people who say it isn't practical or safe to put tires on a truck that are larger than stock because the factory didnt do it /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif
     
  20. 83ZZ502_Jimmy

    83ZZ502_Jimmy 1/2 ton status

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    So a setup like these would scare you.... /forums/images/graemlins/waytogo.gif /forums/images/graemlins/waytogo.gif

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    The first one is from Canada where its legal to pull doubles. I'd do it with mine if it were legal..

    Second pic is a 3500. This setup hauled 32k pounds one time, 2 Crewcabs and a Suburban.

    I think its doable and safe, as long as the driver understands his limits.

    BTW these are not mine..
    John
     

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