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Updated: 30 spline axles? Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by Klink K5, Jan 29, 2004.

  1. Klink K5

    Klink K5 1/2 ton status

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    I have a 1986 M1009 Blazer and I actually like the stock 3:08 gears I am running with a 400 small block and TH 400 trans with 33's. Drives out good and cruises just fine. But what I would like to do with my six lug axles is make them a little better in the traction department with being a daily driver. I thought abolt buying a Detroit Locker for the rear, but don't like the locking/unlocking while turing the corners. Is there something as good but not as aggresive ratchiting 3rd member. Second is the open front. Driving in northwest Iowa in the winter, we get quite a bit of ice and snow on the roads and dont want a full posi or locker in the front cause of these conditions, is there a front 3rd member that calls for both front wheels to spin when needed. I thought about a ox locker for the front or is there a altenative without any external cables, air source of electric. Just a inhouse front diff. Lets here your thoughts and opinions on the 10 bolts and do want to keep them both without doing the 14 bolt/D60 swap just yet. Thanks, Klink /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif

    Update: CHECK my last post on the 30 spline axles I have a lead on........Thanks, KLink
     
  2. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    I suggest you leave the front open if you'll be using 4wd on ice, and put a 14 bolt in the rear with a detroit. I would not spend any money on the current axles, they have 3.08 gears and are 10 bolts which are essentially worthless. For just the cost of a Detroit C-locker for a 10 bolt you could probably have a pair of 3/4 ton axles and a set of 8 lug wheels to put your tires on.

    If you're heart-set on saving the 10 bolts, a Lock-Right would make a drastic change for the rear.

    There is nothing that is, "As good" as a locker in the traction department but delivering the seamless road performance of an open diff. I personally have an automatic locker in my DD and once you get used to it, you never know it's there until you feel the added traction. L/S units will offer increased traction over an open diff but often will fail to transfer power to a spinning tire when you need it most. There are different types of limited slips though, and some are tighter than others.

    I'd thought that I would end up removing the locker from my DD for the winter, but I find that the increased traction is so beneficial, that the minimal handling characteristics difference is definitely worth it to keep it installed. Two or three wheel drive sure beats one or two wheel drive options that I have without the locker. If it's really slick and I anticipate it causing me to slide, I use 4wd until I get to where it's less than slick. In 4wd, the rear locker is un noticable on the road, and the truck typically goes where you point it.

    I don't think you'll be disappionted with a locker in the rear. I don't think I've ever heard someone with first hand experience with a locker that says that it is too agressive for street use or that they didn't like it. I thought I'd hate mine at first, but once I got used to it being there, I don't even hardly notice it anymore. /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif /forums/images/graemlins/waytogo.gif
     
  3. Klink K5

    Klink K5 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    I haven't opened my rear axle up to check yet, but do the military trucks usually have a gov lock installed in the rear? If they do, I dont think it works. I thought about getting a lock right for the rear if ithe diff is open. If I am going to do that, I just as well spend the extra money for a detroit locker. I am NOT against the detroit, just dont like the BANG you hear when turning corners.
     
  4. 84_Chevy_K10

    84_Chevy_K10 Banned

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    It will probably have a Gov-Bomb, although I can't say for sure.

    Lockright, $300 and put it in yourself.

    Detroit, $550 and pay someone to put it in.

    You decide which is worth it on that one.

    I must be missing whatever BANG you're hearing, just a little bit of clicking that tells you to turn the radio up.
     
  5. pauly383

    pauly383 Daddy383 Staff Member Moderator

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    Many millitary , I even think most, had a rear Gov Loc. They worked great for me............until I got a gaping hole in the diff case where my crosshaft bolt used to be. /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif My budget didn't allow too much so I went 12 bolt. Spend some money on a lockright and 30 spline axles ( yours are tiny ) or a stronger axle and a Detroit. /forums/images/graemlins/k5.gif /forums/images/graemlins/usaflag.gif
    Paul
     
  6. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    If this is a mainly daily driven/street vehicle, I'd go for an Eaton posi. Gotta have the rear setup for it, but I believe you can get them for $250-300, and they aren't noticeable cornering and what not. On the street, it would be all the traction you need, especially with 3.08's. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    If you have a gov-lock in there, they are about as good as you can get for a street driven or REALLY lightly wheeled rig. (and even then it still may let loose) An Eaton posi is probably just as effective though, without the shattering carier problem.
     
  7. Klink K5

    Klink K5 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    OK I am seriously thinking Detriot Locker for the rear and 30 spline axles. Want to do It right the first time. Does anyone on the board have 30 spline axles out of a 89-91 burb or blazer? What do you people think about the front diff? what to have a good 4wd set up with the 10 bolts.
     
  8. Derf00

    Derf00 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    Have you actually driven a vehicle with a Detriot in the rear? Yes, you will occasionally know it is there, but I personally think it is a non issue on the streets. If you have a manual transmission some of the locker tendencies are a little more exaggerated. All this being said, I personally think investing any money in a rear 10b is a waste of money. Just my opinion.
     
  9. beater_k20

    beater_k20 Banned

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    i'm going to agree with Tim on this one. dont waste your money on a 10 bolt rear. i just picked up a set of axles from a K20 (10 bolt front, 14FF rear) with 4.10 gears and a gov loc out back. the only change you'll have to make is the u bolts and u bolt plates for the rear. everything else should be a direct bolt in.
     
  10. dyeager535

    dyeager535 1 ton status Premium Member

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    I think the difference in spline count between the 28 and 30 spline axles is the least of your worries in a 10 bolt.

    Your signature says it, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

    If you aren't hard on it, a traction aid in the rear 10 bolt won't really hurt anything, but if you are worried about axle strength, forget any ideas you have about a 10 bolt, and at least step up to a 14SF IMO.
     
  11. CyberSniper

    CyberSniper 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    I have LockRights in both 10 bolts. I've driven a vehicle with a Detroit and it was a bit unpredictable. The rear LockRight I have zero complaints about. It's actually better in the snow.

    The front one sucks pretty bad unless it is really slippery. I'll have one wheel drive until the other tire locks in and that tends to jerk the steering wheel and scare traffic. This is the unpredictable part and it is very stressful to drive when it does this. It'll also bind up enough where if I'm going straight I can have the steering wheel turned up to 1/2 turn to maintain it. When I lose traction on one tire the truck jerks again.

    The nice thing about having the rear locker is that I almost never need 4wd. If I do use 4wd I can get some bitchin' holeshots. It's actually kind of fun to drag race AWD cars in the snow. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif It's also damn near impossible to get stuck. I've yet to get stuck in the snow at least. It's not for lack of trying either.



    If I had the money for a daily driver, I'd buy a locker for the rear of it and a limited-slip for the front. I have a hunch that our roads are by far worse than yours are for a longer period of time. /forums/images/graemlins/rotfl.gif

    However, my budget was limited. I bought 2 LockRights for $475 delivered to my door from National Drivetrain.
     
  12. Z3PR

    Z3PR Banned

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    I honestly belive you'd be money ahead to just do a 3/4 ton axle swap. Get a pair with matching gears. If you want a Detroit out back, keep in mind they're alot cheaper for a 14 bolt FF.
     
  13. 88Silverado

    88Silverado 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    I have 28 splines and went with a Eaton posi in the rear. Mine is a daily driver also but will see some good wheeling this summer. You can get them in different PSI settings up to 800psi. Standard is 400psi. The strength of the Eaton is very good. Ive had a Detroit in my car and it would bang pretty good and it was squirley to drive in the rain. Besides, traded some parts for the new Eaton and Auburn.
    I added the Auburn posi to the front. If im in icy conditions, I can just drive it with one hub unlocked. The advantage of a locker in the rear is you always have full power applied to both wheels even if one is in the air. With posi's, the torque is usually applied more to the spinning wheel. You can usually powerbrake with an automatic to help transfer more torque to the wheel thats not spinning.

    There really isnt any advantage of going to a 30 spline. Both axles narrow (notch) down to the same diameter just after the spline so there really isnt any stregnth difference. BTW, the 30 spline carriers are usually a little weaker because they have to remove extra material for the larger axle splines. 35" tires are about max you want to go. 10B are a pretty good rearend if you dont abuse them.

    Heres a good link on different Carriers, Posi's, etc..
     
  14. Klink K5

    Klink K5 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    I have decided on the rear to be a Detroit Locker. Now on the front, I am looking to install a Detroit True Trac type locker. Any thoughts? /forums/images/graemlins/waytogo.gif
     
  15. HarryH3

    HarryH3 1 ton status Author

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    If you have a press and a dial indicator, installing the Detroit Locker really isn't a big deal. Just check the backlash of the current setup, yank it out, swap the ring gear to the locker, install the bearings, then shim until you have the backlash set back to where it was before you started. Close it up, fill with oil, and be amazed at the new found traction. /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif To do a difff swap you don't have to mess with the pinion depth, which is the biggest pain in the a$$ of setting up a gearset. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

    The True Trac seems to be one of those things that either works or fails in a most spectacular fashion. Some swear by them while others swear at them. Someone on here blew one into shrapnel. The destruction was most impressive! Other people run them for years without problems. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
     
  16. xflatrater

    xflatrater Registered Member

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    I am one of the "swear by it" /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif Trutrac owners, it works well in my front 10B
     
  17. Mastiff

    Mastiff 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    Has anyone living in an icy state put an LSD in the front? My steering is kind of scary in icy weather with the front hubs locked and I have an Auburn up there. Thing is, I've had it in there since I've live in Iowa (came from So. Cal). I'm not sure if I should blame the LSD or something else.

    Does anyone know of a good shop in eastern Iowa, NW Ill, SW Wisc who is competent to install an ARB?
     
  18. Jonny-K5

    Jonny-K5 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    [ QUOTE ]
    There really isnt any advantage of going to a 30 spline. Both axles narrow (notch) down to the same diameter just after the spline so there really isnt any stregnth difference.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    If you go to 30 spline, spend the extra couple bucks and get a set made by moser. i got mine for 225 a set(stock shafts are $100 a piece), made out of alloy, and splined right onto the shaft, no necking down.
     
  19. bowtiepower00

    bowtiepower00 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    In addition to the Lockright, Powertrax makes a No-slip, which is a newer, improved version of the Lockright, and is supposed to be much smoother when it locks and unlocks. I would suggest going with the LR or No-slip in the rear first, and to leave the front open. If you decide that you still need more traction, you could always do the front later. It doesn't sound like you'll be doing any serious wheeling with the rig, so I wouldn't bother with the front.
     
  20. az-k5

    az-k5 1/2 ton status

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    Re: Here goes: Looking to make my 10 Bolts a little better

    I would recomend the no-slip also. It is a drop in locker and they have one that fits a gov-loc case. There is a little more give in the design to allow better on road handeling. I have driven both a lock-rite and a no-slip in the same truck (a freind of mine). Wow!! I actually had to ask why buddy removed his locker, he said that is a no-slip dumb*** So there is my story and my vote. /forums/images/graemlins/waytogo.gif
     

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