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vortec install completed-transmission acting funky

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by ChickenRammit, May 13, 2006.

  1. ChickenRammit

    ChickenRammit 1/2 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    i just got the vortec started up today. i just need need to go get a new exhaust put on with dual cats to accomidate the 4 oxygen sensors that the vortec is equipped with. only problem is that i have to rev the engine kind of high just to get moving. i just had the transmission rebuilt and it came from the same donor truck as the engine. is there some chance i wired the lock up torque converter incorrectly? i put in 10 quarts of transmission fluid. after i started the engine and ran it for a while, i checked the dip stick and it was a quart and a half low so i added the appropriate amount. please help.
     
  2. 1-ton

    1-ton 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    Did you make sure the torque converter was locked in all the into the transmission before you installed it?
     
  3. ChickenRammit

    ChickenRammit 1/2 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    i bolted the trans to the engine and then installed them as a combo into the truck. when i bolted the tranny on, the torque converter was well seated to the input shaft. i'm pretty sure the converter is on correctly, unless theres something else i should know.
     
  4. big83chevy4x4

    big83chevy4x4 3/4 ton status

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    4L60E or 4L80E?

    there is no way to wire the TQ lockup wrong, its all conputer controlled, not to mention it has nothing to do with stall speed.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2006
  5. 1-ton

    1-ton 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    The reason I ask if the converter was in all the way is because the electronics have nothing to do with the tourque converter stall speed. The only thing I can think of that would cause the problem you are having is the converter not installed correctly, or the converter is bad.
     
  6. ChickenRammit

    ChickenRammit 1/2 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    its a 4l60e. heres another question. on the trans lines that go to the radiator, is the bottom one flowing from the radiator to the trans and the opposite for the top one? when i put the trans line back on, i couldnt remember which one was which. could this have anything to do with it?could i have installed them backwards by any chance?
     
  7. big83chevy4x4

    big83chevy4x4 3/4 ton status

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    the bottom on the trans goes to the bottom on the radiator. that is the pressure. the top is the return to the tranny. you possibly could get air in the system if you crossed them, but i don't think the symtoms would be the same as what your saying.

    stock converter?
     
  8. ChickenRammit

    ChickenRammit 1/2 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    yeah, stock converter, brand new too.
     
  9. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

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    did you fill the torque converter fully with fluid before you installed everything? I know my 4l80e is something over 13 quarts of fluid overall...
     
  10. ChickenRammit

    ChickenRammit 1/2 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    no, i didn't fill it up at all, i just followed the instructions the tranny shop gave me when i had it rebuilt. they said to fill the transmissin up with 4-5 quarts of fluid and then as soon as i get the engine started, continue filling the tranny with 5-6 more quarts of fluid. thing was, i was able to fit all ten quarts in before i even started the motor. after motor started, it needed another quart and a half. this amounts to 11.5 quarts and the specifications in the service manual call out for 11.2 quarts on a completely dry transmission.

    aside from all that, the transmission shop said there should be a 3/16" to 7/16" gap between the torque converter and the flexplate. this was something i didnt pay attention to when i bolted the tranny to the motor. so about an hour ago i went and stuffed some spacers(washers) between the converter and the flexplate. i then took it for a drive and it was no better. then i gave it more gas and i don't know what happened, butnow there is no power to the wheels period. the engine just spins freely.

    does it sound like a bad torque converter? or did the trans shop build the tranny wrong? if all else fails i am just going to take the truck to the tranny shop and let them deal with it. they give a one year/12,000 mile warranty. i havent even put one mile on it and i had it rebuilt in january. i just need to know if it's something i did wrong, or if it sounds like a faulty rebuild.
     
  11. 1-ton

    1-ton 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    This is the reason most transmission shops refuse to do "bench jobs" (i.e. rebuild a transmission, then give it to the owner to install himself). I am thinking you did not get the torque converter in all the way, and when you tried to drive it, the pump burned out, which is why it will not move at all now. I have seen a few inexperianced people do to this to there newly rebuilt transmissions.
     
  12. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

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    you should always fill the torque converter before installing it on the transmission. Just letting the pump push fluid into and air out of the torque converter is not a good thing. You'd likely never get all the air out of it. THe fact that your trans shop said nothing about that makes me suspect of them.
     
  13. NateInChandler

    NateInChandler 1/2 ton status

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    Being a experianced certified transmission specialist and working for a top name tranny shop in the valley here i can deffinatly say that from your description you have a internal transmission problem (ie filter fell off, Cut lip seal, or a bad convertor) As far as how it bolted up, There should be NO washers between the convertor and flexplate.. There will be a small gap when the convertor is not pulled up to the flexplate and if there was no gap when you bolted the convertor to the flexplate you have problems ( Convertor not fully engaged into pump, someone had shimmed out the flexplate away from the crank or others) The first mistake you made is putting all 10 quarts in the thing before you started it.. what happens is with that much fluid in it before you start it, it creates a air lock inside the transmission and sometimes (SOMETIMES) it will not move at all until you drain the pan back down and fill it the right way (4l60 is 4 quarts to start then pour 5 more in, move the gear selector through the different gears and fill to spec) DO NOT FILL THE CONVERTOR before you start it, 1/2 to 3/4 of a quart is fine just to keep everything lubed during startup, i work on about 15 4l60's in a period of one week and have NEVER FILLED THE CONVERTOR and havent had a problem.. plus the fact that you will never be able to completly FILL the convertor from just pouring fluid in, it needs to actually be pumped in and centrifical force pushs it outwards and makes more room for the pump to push fluid in..
    If the trans is full of fluid and you have looked at every possible thing thats outside of taking the pan off then i would take it back to the shop that built it and have them look at it.. I wouldnt try moving it any more than you half to as depending on whats wrong it may burn it up... Im glad i could help.. nate
     
  14. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

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    can you explain why not to fill the converter? everything I've always been taught is to fill the converter.
     
  15. 1-ton

    1-ton 1/2 ton status Premium Member

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    The next problem is when you take the transission back to the people that built it. They might blame everything on you, and not warranty the transmission.
     
  16. NateInChandler

    NateInChandler 1/2 ton status

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    Sled, Its personal preferance but i dont like to Fill the convertor so to say before i install them. Im on a time clock so the faster i get the job done the more money i can make, so why waste your time trying to completly fill the convertor (some take up to 8 quarts of fluid) when 1/2-3/4 of a quart is just fine for startup (plus the convertor company normally pre-lubes them and puts fluid in to check for leaks at the welds) the second reason is because if for some reason you spill some fluid while putting the convertor in the transmission and dont realize it, it may blind you into thinking that your front seal is leaking.. (comebacks are a techs worst fear, expecially when it takes 1-2 hours to pull some transmissions just to find out that you had spilled some fluid while installing the convertor.) a auto transmission is completly safe to run low on fluid if your not trying to drive it, sitting in nuetral or park for a period of time while you drink a beer will not hurt it as long as you have some fluid in it..
    Ive actually gotten pulled off of jobs while filling a car and let it sit there and run while im talking with customers or something like that and it didnt harm the transmission at all.. so in all, its personal choice, but it will not hurt it if you dont pre-fill it.. Nate
     
  17. NateInChandler

    NateInChandler 1/2 ton status

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    BTW, a good Transmission builder will pre-lube most of the parts inside of the transmission when being assembled, AS will the torque convertor company after they assemble the convertor will spin balance it then put fluid in it and check for leaks at all the welds.. This is pretty fun to watch (especially when they have a pin hole leak and you just put 160PSI of air pressure in the convertor=BIG MESS). Like i said before, i would recommend having it towed to the shop that built it and if they are a straight up shop, they will diagnose and fix the problem.. .. Good luck.. nate
     
  18. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

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    gotcha, makes sense. I'm a flat rate tech, saving time makes plenty of sense haha
     
  19. NateInChandler

    NateInChandler 1/2 ton status

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    Sled, Its a different type of system that my employer has, Yes sort to say im on a time clock, and i do get paid by the hour also, but we also have a bonus program, for the first hour over 40 i get a big bonus, for everyone hour past 41 i get $10 a hour on top of my normal pay.. So in retrospect, the faster i get cars done and out based on flat rate time i make more and more money... Kinda a wierd program but it works.. Nate
     
  20. ChickenRammit

    ChickenRammit 1/2 ton status GMOTM Winner

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    there was a gap between the converter and the flex plate, the shop told me there would be. they said if the gap was more than 7/16" then it needed to be shimmed. i put washers in there temporarily just to see if that was the problem. i am going to take those back out before i take it to them. i spent $1,400.00 to have it rebuilt, i just thought for that price it should function correctly. your knowledge has been greatly appreciated.
     

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