Dismiss Notice

Welcome To CK5!

Registering is free and easy! Hope to see you on the forums soon.

Score a FREE t-shirt and membership sticker when you sign up for a Premium Membership and choose the recurring plan.

welded spider gears vs. a locker

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by colbystephens, Oct 25, 2005.

  1. colbystephens

    colbystephens 1 ton status GMOTM Winner

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2005
    Posts:
    10,924
    Likes Received:
    20
    Location:
    Oregon
    what's the value in having an after market full time locker over welding your spider gears? i'm not too familiar with how lockers work - so maybe if i understood that i would be able to see an advantage to the lockers, but welding the spider gears makes complete sense and so I don't really see the value in spending tons of money on a locker unless you have a selectable locker.

    colby stephens.
    www.web.pdx.edu/~colbys
     
  2. spoolnaround

    spoolnaround 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2002
    Posts:
    1,419
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Kingsburg Ca
    A Detroit will allow you to turn easier under most instances. A spool is always locked so turning is a chore all the time.

    edit: A Detroit will unlock when power is not applied thus enabling you to turn the front wheels if in front and not push the front when in the rear. When I decide to spend the money I will get selectable lockers. I am welded front and rear and it sucks in some places when you need to turn in a tight spot.
     
  3. 76blazerguy

    76blazerguy 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2004
    Posts:
    125
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    wichita, Kansas
    im also at a little confusion to this subject. My transfer case has H and L Loc. I assume its just the rear that locks but what kind of locker does it have?
     
  4. spoolnaround

    spoolnaround 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2002
    Posts:
    1,419
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Kingsburg Ca
    Thats not for a locking dif. The H and L is high range and low range gearing in the transfer case. The loc just means its locked into 4 wheel drive.
     
  5. 76blazerguy

    76blazerguy 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2004
    Posts:
    125
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    wichita, Kansas
    oh ok. thanks so its only actually in 2 wheel drive when its in high? if so why would you put locking hubs on? im sorry if this sounds really dumb. I have to learn somehow though
     
  6. spoolnaround

    spoolnaround 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2002
    Posts:
    1,419
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Kingsburg Ca
    You should have a 203 in your K5, you have 2H, 2L N 4H, 4L. All this means is you have the ability to be in 2 or 4 wheel drive in high range (same gearing as driving on the street) and 2 or 4 wheel drive in low range (thats wheen your rig revs to 3K RPM going 10 MPH) :wink1: does that help any?

    The locking hubs help slow down the wear and tear on front end parts. A full time 4X4 the front driveshaft always turns due to the hubs always being engaged.
     
  7. 76blazerguy

    76blazerguy 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2004
    Posts:
    125
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    wichita, Kansas
    oh yea that makes perfect sense would you ever lock a 12 bolt? or is it not worth the cost?
     
  8. thedrip

    thedrip 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2003
    Posts:
    1,129
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Chattanooga, TN
    If he has a 203, there is no 2wd.. there is
    Low Lock
    Low fulltime
    neutral
    High fulltime
    High Lock

    in the "fulltime" settings, there is an open diff in the tcase between the front and rear outputs.
     
  9. txfiremank5

    txfiremank5 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2004
    Posts:
    3,105
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    San Antonio, TX.
    Just to make it a little clearer.. he means, you have:

    Hi loc,Hi, N, Lo, Lo Loc :D

    Hi loc - Hi 4wd
    Hi - hi 2wd
    N - nuetral
    Lo - lo 2wd
    Lo loc - Lo 4wd

    For simplicity
     
  10. txfiremank5

    txfiremank5 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2004
    Posts:
    3,105
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    San Antonio, TX.
    true, but it's just easier to think of the Hi and Lo as 2wd. :thumb:
     
  11. colbystephens

    colbystephens 1 ton status GMOTM Winner

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2005
    Posts:
    10,924
    Likes Received:
    20
    Location:
    Oregon
    so basically the big difference is turning radius? in the future i'm going to go to 4.56 - 4.88 from my 4.10's, maybe i should try welding the spider gears to see what it's like while i've got the longterm but temporary 4.10's to see if i think it's worth dropping the dough for real lockers in the future. but i guess that doesn't take into account my desire for selectable lockers. i suppose i'll just have to think about that. any other major differences other than turning radius?
     
  12. spoolnaround

    spoolnaround 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2002
    Posts:
    1,419
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Kingsburg Ca
    I wouldnt waste my money on a 12 bolt. When you have $150 in your pocket go looking for a 14 bolt. You should be able to find one for that amount if you do some looking. When you find a FF14 (thats a full floater 14 bolt) make sure its out of a 3/4 ton and it should bolt right in. Even a semi floating 14 bolt, you can find them n 6 lug I think. The only thing you might have to do is mess with the e-brake, there are 2 or 3 different styles. You may need gears in your front end to match as well. Normally its cheaper to find a matched set 14ff and 8 lug Dana 44 or 10 bolt that came out of a 3/4 ton than it is to re-gear. A Dana 44 or 10 bolt will hold up to 35's great if you drive it right.
     
  13. spoolnaround

    spoolnaround 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2002
    Posts:
    1,419
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Kingsburg Ca
    only applies to front end: And being able to turn. If you go this route I would put a cooler inline, I burned up a pump 1 mile into the trail (in the snow) the first time I went out in my welded front.

    A plus to welding is cost and predictability. Thats it! If I had the funds it would be a selectable locker but Detroits are priced right, strong and work great.
     
  14. spoolnaround

    spoolnaround 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2002
    Posts:
    1,419
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Kingsburg Ca
    Just trying to be as simplistic as possible. This is the most newbeeish stuff I have ever answered :D I remember being there once too :wink1: .
     
  15. 76blazerguy

    76blazerguy 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2004
    Posts:
    125
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    wichita, Kansas
  16. zeroz400

    zeroz400 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    May 30, 2004
    Posts:
    410
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Libertyville, IL
    If you drive on the street and your rear diff is welded your gonna be chirpin around every corner and its gonna wear your tires out quicker. Lockers disengage going around corners so that the outside wheel can turn faster then the wheel inside. So keep that in my mind.
     
  17. monster man

    monster man 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2003
    Posts:
    282
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Reno, NV
    as for welding, the number one reason I would avoid it is due to the fact that if done improperly (it is very hard to get a good surface, especially with all that gear lube residue), they'll break, leaving you stranded. I'd rather go with a spool




    looks like the start of a good project, and I of course LOVE the color scheme :D Great shape!

    First tip is not to go mud bogging with the roof off if your interior is in nice shape :haha:


    Sounds like you don't have the Mile Marker conversion kit for your Blazer yet. That's the number one step for NP203's in my opinion- it adds locking hubs to your front axle (right now they are on flanges and the axles always turn). THis gets rid of the differential in the t-case and makes it operate like a part time t-case, saving you gas and making engagement positive.

    I can't tell from the pics- is that done already?

    Throw on some 32 or 33" mud tires for now (may need to trim an inch or two off the back of the front fender), and that will net you a LOT of traction. Stick with your stock rims and lift for now, and just build it as you break it. Work on driving skill rather than relying on the truck to get you through. You have to know how to pick the right line and know your vehicle's limits, etc. My advice is if you're going to upgrade, you might as well go straight to the best options, no sense half-assing it, so save up for the big toys and have fun with what you've got for now. I think your rig is ultra cool and I'd love to have it in my driveway
     
  18. Kyle89K5

    Kyle89K5 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2000
    Posts:
    2,273
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    OKLAHOMA
    IMO, I would go welded or spool/mini spool. I didn't like the characteristics of a locker. I'm a simple guy, so I want to either know I'm locked, or open. For strength, I went mini-spool in my 14. The turning radius dropped, but not much, it handles different, sure, but after driving it like this for about a day, I was okay with it. The added plus of I ALWAYS KNOW how it's gonna act is worth it to me. Offroad, you can't beat it.

    KP
     
  19. 76blazerguy

    76blazerguy 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2004
    Posts:
    125
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    wichita, Kansas
    thanks man it has manual locking hubs, i think they are warn hubs. I have just been doing mods to get it running good again so i havent touched the suspension or tires yet. It had been sitting in a barn for 20 years so i had to replace anything rubber. All the seals and belts, and the power steering and steering box have all been replaced other than that i put on a new intake, carb, exhaust and i just got some headers in the mail. Im planning on buying some tires and getting some cheap wheels in the next week or so. Then im gonna start on the suspension. But its all a learning process for me thats why im grateful to have you guys here!
     
  20. steve_kibbe

    steve_kibbe 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2004
    Posts:
    2,895
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Spartanburg, SC

    Just going back to the first post.......

    Is your blazer going to see any pavement?

    If you weld the rear, your blazer will want to push through a corner. Its like steering on ice with forward momentum.

    If it were me, and I was planning on upgrading to 3/4 or 1 ton stuff and only going to run 35's or so, I'd weld it until it broke :D
     

Share This Page