Dismiss Notice

Welcome To CK5!

Registering is free and easy! Hope to see you on the forums soon.

Score a FREE t-shirt and membership sticker when you sign up for a Premium Membership and choose the recurring plan.

well the chip for humans is here

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by surpip, Oct 13, 2004.

  1. surpip

    surpip 1 ton status

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2004
    Posts:
    10,877
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    sacramento ca
    The Associated Press
    Updated: 6:38 p.m. ET Oct. 13, 2004WASHINGTON - Medical milestone or privacy invasion? A tiny computer chip approved Wednesday for implantation in a patient’s arm can speed vital information about a patient’s medical history to doctors and hospitals. But critics warn that it could open new ways to imperil the confidentiality of medical records.

    advertisement

    The Food and Drug Administration said Wednesday that Applied Digital Solutions of Delray Beach, Fla., could market the VeriChip, an implantable computer chip about the size of a grain of rice, for medical purposes.

    With the pinch of a syringe, the microchip is inserted under the skin in a procedure that takes less than 20 minutes and leaves no stitches. Silently and invisibly, the dormant chip stores a code that releases patient-specific information when a scanner passes over it.

    Think UPC code. The identifier, emblazoned on a food item, brings up its name and price on the cashier’s screen.

    Chip's dual uses raise alarm
    The VeriChip itself contains no medical records, just codes that can be scanned, and revealed, in a doctor’s office or hospital. With that code, the health providers can unlock that portion of a secure database that holds that person’s medical information, including allergies and prior treatment. The electronic database, not the chip, would be updated with each medical visit.

    The microchips have already been implanted in 1 million pets. But the chip’s possible dual use for tracking people’s movements — as well as speeding delivery of their medical information to emergency rooms — has raised alarm.

    “If privacy protections aren’t built in at the outset, there could be harmful consequences for patients,” said Emily Stewart, a policy analyst at the Health Privacy Project.

    To protect patient privacy, the devices should reveal only vital medical information, like blood type and allergic reactions, needed for health care workers to do their jobs, Stewart said.

    An information technology guru at Detroit Medical Center, however, sees the benefits of the devices and will lobby for his center’s inclusion in a VeriChip pilot program.

    “One of the big problems in health care has been the medical records situation. So much of it is still on paper,” said David Ellis, the center’s chief futurist and co-founder of the Michigan Electronic Medical Records Initiative.

    'Part of the future of medicine'
    As “medically mobile” patients visit specialists for care, their records fragment on computer systems that don’t talk to each other.

    “It’s part of the future of medicine to have these kinds of technologies that make life simpler for the patient,” Ellis said. Pushing for the strongest encryption algorithms to ensure hackers can’t nab medical data as information transfers from chip to reader to secure database, will help address privacy concerns, he said.

    The U.S. Department of Health and Human Services on Wednesday announced $139 million in grants to help make real President Bush’s push for electronic health records for most Americans within a decade.

    William A. Pierce, an HHS spokesman, could not say whether VeriChip and its accompanying secure database of medical records fit within that initiative.

    “Exactly what those technologies are is still to be sorted out,” Pierce said. “It all has to respect and comport with the privacy rules.”

    Applied Digital gave away scanners to a few hundred animal shelters and veterinary clinics when it first entered the pet market 15 years ago. Now, 50,000 such scanners have been sold.

    To kickstart the chip’s use among humans, Applied Digital will provide $650 scanners for free at 200 of the nation’s trauma centers.

    Implantation costs $150 to $200
    In pets, installing the chip runs about $50. For humans, the chip implantation cost would be $150 to $200, said Angela Fulcher, an Applied Digital spokeswoman.

    Fulcher could not say whether the cost of data storage and encrypted transmission of medical information would be passed to providers.

    Because the VeriChip is invisible, it’s also unclear how health care workers would know which unconscious patients to scan. Company officials say if the chip use becomes routine, scanning triceps for hidden chips would become second nature at hospitals.

    Ultimately, the company hopes patients who suffer from such ailments as diabetes and Alzheimer’s or who undergo complex treatments, like chemotherapy, would have chips implanted. If the procedure proves as popular for use in humans as in pets, that could mean up to 1 million chips implanted in people. So far, just 1,000 people across the globe have had the devices implanted, very few of them in the United States.

    The company’s chief executive officer, Scott R. Silverman, is one of a half dozen executives who had chips implanted. Silverman said chips implanted for medical uses could also be used for security purposes, like tracking employee movement through nuclear power plants.

    Such security uses are rare in the United States.

    Meanwhile, the chip has been used for pure whimsy: Club hoppers in Barcelona, Spain, now use the microchip to enter a VIP area and, through links to a different database, speed payment much like a smartcard.

    whole story
     
  2. boggerless

    boggerless 1 ton status Premium Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2003
    Posts:
    22,728
    Likes Received:
    96
    Location:
    dearborn heights, Michigan
    the begining of the mark of the beast. 666 f^^k that not me brother. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gifas much as hospitals charge let them earn it. /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif /forums/images/graemlins/k5.gifto /forums/images/graemlins/truck.gif
     
  3. hi pinion

    hi pinion 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2003
    Posts:
    5,354
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    **PLUMBING THE WORLD**
    The nautural chain of events........wow. Scary dude.
     
  4. unclematty

    unclematty 1/2 ton status

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2003
    Posts:
    3,164
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    SLC UT
    HMMMM!???
    I think that I would like them in my children, w/ locators also . as soon as they are out of the house, out come the chipsOTHER THEN THAT, FORGET IT!! /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
     
  5. hi pinion

    hi pinion 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2003
    Posts:
    5,354
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    **PLUMBING THE WORLD**
    [ QUOTE ]
    HMMMM!???
    I think that I would like them in my children, w/ locators also . as soon as they are out of the house, out come the chipsOTHER THEN THAT, FORGET IT!! /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif

    [/ QUOTE ] /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif you crack me up /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif Thats funny unclamenty /forums/images/graemlins/waytogo.gif I have always been a firm beleiver in what everything in the Bible is true though. Its just one extra fact that leads me to beleive it even more. Its more than a weird coincidense something written that long ago , could contain such stinging percision .Scres the crap out of me actually. /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
     
  6. Resurrection_Joe

    Resurrection_Joe 1 ton status

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2002
    Posts:
    17,372
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Gettysburg, SD
    I think they should put chips under the skin of everyone





















    Then all the proper people can carve them the [censored] out with thier belt knife
     
  7. Can Can

    Can Can Pusher Man Staff Member Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2000
    Posts:
    15,555
    Likes Received:
    156
    Location:
    Cochrane, Alberta, Canada
    I'm willing to bet that the civilian workers who were beheaded in Iraq would have LOVED the opportunity to have a mini-locator hidden somewhere beneath their skin........ /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
     
  8. newyorkin

    newyorkin 1 ton status

    Joined:
    May 8, 2001
    Posts:
    16,555
    Likes Received:
    157
    Location:
    Los Estados Unitos
    Yikes, I had started thinking the "mark of the beast" in revelation was purely symbolic... Pretty wierd to see something so close to what the bible says in a literal sense...
     
  9. boggerless

    boggerless 1 ton status Premium Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2003
    Posts:
    22,728
    Likes Received:
    96
    Location:
    dearborn heights, Michigan
    they chose to be there,knowing the danger. thats irelavent. people on death row wish the didn't commit the crime. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/k5.gifto /forums/images/graemlins/truck.gif
     
  10. Can Can

    Can Can Pusher Man Staff Member Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2000
    Posts:
    15,555
    Likes Received:
    156
    Location:
    Cochrane, Alberta, Canada
    [ QUOTE ]
    they chose to be there,knowing the danger. thats irelavent. people on death row wish the didn't commit the crime.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    That has to be the crappiest attempt at a rebuttal I've ever read. It almost sounds like you couldn't care less that your fellow countrymen are getting their heads cut off........

    /forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif /forums/images/graemlins/screwy.gif
     
  11. sled_dog

    sled_dog 1 ton status

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2002
    Posts:
    16,870
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    I worry about when this does not become an option. You adopt a pet, it likely already has the chip. I could bet sooner or later whenever a child is born, they will immediately put the chip in them. Not me, and not my kids.
     
  12. Z3PR

    Z3PR Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2002
    Posts:
    19,217
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Everywhere
    I like the idea of a chip that will give medical info instantly. It could save alot of lives. I forsee it used for I.D.ing someone for law enforcement also. Someone wouldn't be able to lie to the police about who they are. Mark of the beast ??? I don't know all about that now. Is't that something that can be seen ???
     
  13. newyorkin

    newyorkin 1 ton status

    Joined:
    May 8, 2001
    Posts:
    16,555
    Likes Received:
    157
    Location:
    Los Estados Unitos
    [ QUOTE ]
    Is't that something that can be seen ???

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Not necessarily. If it's truly literal and to be considered literal, then the wording used in the bible is important, and no wording says the mark must be visible to the human eye. The wording of the mark when it's described is:
    [ QUOTE ]
    Revelation 13:16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
    13:17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

    [/ QUOTE ] *in alternates with "upon" depending on translation.
    Basically, if you have a scannable chip in your hand, and the currency system becomes wholly electronic and dependant on that chip being your "cash" and "pin", and you can't buy or sell without an implanted chip. Like the article said about it being used for whimsical stuff like entry to a club without the hassle of cash or ID. That's a big selling point!

    Another interesting article I'd read several years ago (before I really knew about "the Mark") was about these chips and the problems they were having with their physical location on the body. There were two problems addressed in that article; how to power the chip, and how to read it.
    The power supply had used some kind of thermal energy, so they needed to be located where the body radiated heat well.
    They also needed to be scannable at close range.
    The two most convenient locations on the body that matched these criteria were the back of the hand and the forehead.

    Now, the power supply issue is moot because these chips don't seem to be energized until scanned, although they don't say where the ability to track movement comes from; maybe the chips are powered and emitting constantly, but that would be pretty difficult to make completely "safe".
    But the location issue is still important. They need to be located near the surface of the skin to be scanned. You wouldn't want them implanted deeper in the body, because that would require a longer or variable range scanner or longer range emitting of the chip, which may make it easier for unauthorized scanning, not to mention the health factors of more powerful close-range radio frequency. Not to mention how inconsistent the range can become as people become overwieght, etc. So where can it be near the surface so it can be scanned within like a 1/2" range scanner, but just above bone so it can't sink deeper into the body? What places on the body stay fairly consistent in density and gain less weight as your body changes? The back of the hand, the forehead, the shin, the top of the foot, maybe the kneecaps or elbows. Out of these places, which are convenient enough to use in a supermarket, or for entry to a secured room? The hand and the forehead. The forehead might be particularly convenient for law enforcement, if they want to, say, scan passengers boarding an airplane without the passengers knowledge that they're being scanned? When you walk through the metal detector, your head is usually in a consistent position, while your hands may not be... Just set the detector to scan the vicinity the head is usually in.


    Maybe this will wipe out half the human race... most everyone gets the chip, then people who've had it for 20 years start dying from some kind of unforeseen physical side effect of it, and the rest of the population self-mutilates to get it out... Economy collapses because we can't purchase anything...Wait, is this in the bible? /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif

    I, personally, would MUCH rather fingerprints be used than a foriegn object placed within my body that I don't know anything about. At least with my fingerprint, I know when I'm being scanned (if I'm conscious), even if it is less secure. How about we keep using cash instead of biotechnology?

    I don't work in the medical field, but it seems to me a centralized database of patient information does not require a physical device on a patient. Why this guy thinks that, I don't know... Someone's going to have to manually update the data with every dr. visit, someone's going to have to manually load the history that's currently on paper. Nothing the chip can do can't be done with a social security number, or even a name and date of birth. It's not like the chip can be a key that gives the dr access to the database; my doctor's had to look at my records plenty of times over the phone or without me being present, so I'd guess the chip might even inhibit doctors abilities if justified by that "security" argument.
     
  14. mrk5

    mrk5 The Sticker Guy Moderator Vendor GMOTM Winner Author

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2004
    Posts:
    12,351
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    Location:
    Northern Colorado
    I agree with ZP3R.

    What makes this the mark of the beast?

    I see no problem as long as it's voluntary. I know many people who require tons of medications or have really bad allergies. It would be nice for them to have something like that, because it would allow EMTs and such to find out medical information imediately.

    Like RJ says, you could always just cut it out.
     
  15. hi pinion

    hi pinion 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2003
    Posts:
    5,354
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    **PLUMBING THE WORLD**
    But , how would people know that over two thousand years ago??? Dosent that strike everyone here odd?? They might not talk about computers,etc,but i think its pretty damn close.I dont know. It just seems to amazingly coinsidential to me. Its almost a perfect match to what the bible says. I think its is true. Just like everything else that has been in the bible and has came true.This is just another fact backing up the obvious in my book.Just my thoughts, Jake*
     
  16. hi pinion

    hi pinion 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2003
    Posts:
    5,354
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    **PLUMBING THE WORLD**
    If you cut it out,you cant buy anything. This might be the begining stages of it /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
     
  17. newyorkin

    newyorkin 1 ton status

    Joined:
    May 8, 2001
    Posts:
    16,555
    Likes Received:
    157
    Location:
    Los Estados Unitos
    [ QUOTE ]
    I see no problem as long as it's voluntary.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I don't either, but think about the nature of society. What's voluntary often becomes necessity. If you brought a block of gold to Walmart and tried to use it to pay for your stuff, you wouldn't be able to buy anything. No one says you have to have "cash", it's voluntary. But no matter how much gold you have, without cash/credit/debit, you're not gonna use it to buy anything...

    If it becomes mainstream in medical, how long will it take before a doctors office says "Oh you don't have a chip? I'm sorry, but we only take patients with ID chips here. Too much hassle without it."
    Or you apply for a job, and one of the requirements is that you have an id chip to integrate with thier security system. Sure, there are still jobs that don't require the chip, but can you get them?
    The implant can be voluntary in the eyes of the law, but required to live in society. That's kinda what the bible is saying with the buy/sell line.
    If there were specific laws requiring that individuals without the chip have the same services available as individuals with the chip, that all vendors still accept cash or whatever, then it would be a little easier to accept. But even then, vendors can make it such a hassle that you have to go with a chip just to get anything done.

    To be honest, I'm somehow still skeptical that this is the Mark of the Beast. I was pretty convinced the mark of the beast wasn't something we would be able to recognize immediately. This almost seems too obvious to me...



    edit: wasn't done typing, not sure why I posted...
     
  18. hi pinion

    hi pinion 3/4 ton status

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2003
    Posts:
    5,354
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    **PLUMBING THE WORLD**
    AND THAT NO MAN MIGHT BUY OR SELL,SAVE HE THAT HAD THE MARK,OR NAME OF THE BEAST,OR THE NUMBER OF HIS NAME. Lets read that gain." Save he that had the mark." This could mean alot of things. But why would it not be convincing to you, if it wasnt "obvious"???? Not everything in the bible has a hidden meaning, or is a riddle. Mabey this time its out there blaintenly??
     
  19. mrk5

    mrk5 The Sticker Guy Moderator Vendor GMOTM Winner Author

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2004
    Posts:
    12,351
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    Location:
    Northern Colorado
    I can see your point. But what would stop me from just carrying a little "chip holder" in my pocket. They could just scan that also. I'm talking about as far as using if for day-to-day type transactions.

    The advantage to having it implanted medically is that you wouldn't loose it in a severe accident.

    Can you refer me to the passage of the bible that concerns the mark of the beast? I'm not that familiar with the bible.


    Side story: When I was in Israel in '97, there were Muslim women handing out propaganda type pamphlets about the evils of western civilization. There was a story in there about how all Americans at that time were getting chips implanted and barcodes tattooed on our bodies.
     
  20. mrk5

    mrk5 The Sticker Guy Moderator Vendor GMOTM Winner Author

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2004
    Posts:
    12,351
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    Location:
    Northern Colorado
    [ QUOTE ]
    Can you refer me to the passage of the bible that concerns the mark of the beast? I'm not that familiar with the bible.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Nevermind. You must have replied to Z3PR at exactly the same time I did, and I didn't see that post.
     

Share This Page