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What makes the M1008 a 1-1/4 Ton?

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by BigCountryx, Jul 17, 2005.

  1. BigCountryx

    BigCountryx 1/2 ton status

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    Trucks with D60/14FF combos are called 1 tons in civilian models, but 1-1/4 ton in Military models. Why?
     
  2. MNorby

    MNorby 3/4 ton status Premium Member GMOTM Winner

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    I'm not certain on the true answer but would the TH475 have something to do with it??? 1-tons only had the TH400 :confused:
     
  3. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    The M1008 has the TH400 just like the other CUCV's (to the best of my knowledge)

    They are rated 5/4 ton because the Army rates them for what they figure they can safely carry. The Army figures they can safely carry 2500 lbs (I agree) which is 1 1/4 tons of payload. They also figure the M1009 can safely carry 1500 lbs so rate that as a 3/4 ton.

    Rene
     
  4. 79blzr

    79blzr Newbie

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    There were 1 Ton, and 1 1/4 Ton CUCV's. The only major difference is on the rear axle. The 1 1/4 ton had wider spring perches to accomodate the add-a-leaf/spring helpers. The 1 1/4 Ton variants were used as communication vehicles and needed the extra hauling capacity to accomodate the weight of the radios. Thats why when you purchased used "Detroit Locked" 14 BFFs on the internet, the spring perches may need to be relocated, and they may not. Being old and remembering this stuff is what really scares me!! :crazy:
     
  5. BurbLover

    BurbLover 1/2 ton status

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    To put it simply, when the military wants something, the put together a specifications requirement. For this particulat spec (M1008), it called for it to be a 5/4 vehicle among other requirements. GM submitted there vehicle package stating that it met this requirement. Basically, the military wanted a 5/4 ton truck & GM said this particular package would meet that.

    I guess one could say that the 14BFF/D60 combo is a 5/4 setup, not a 1-ton :doah:
     
  6. afroman006

    afroman006 1/2 ton status

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    Uhhh where did you get this info? I really think you are mistaken in the statement that the 1 1/4 tons had different spring perch widths because any CUCV pickup (this excludes blazers) with a 14 bolt FF rear axle had the standard GM spring width of 40." You are also wrong about why the spacing is different. There is absolutely no reason to change spring perch width to accomodate add-a-leaves, because they go on top of or in the actual spring pack. The reason 1 & 1 1/4 ton pickups had narrower spacing was so that dually trucks would not have to use different frames or spring hangers.

    In addition, not nearly "all" 1 1/4 tons were used for communications equipment, at best I would say "some" or "a few." They were just used as all around pickups, hauling troops, gear, trailers, medical equipment (M1028 I believe) and whatever else needed to be moved that was too small for a deuce.
     
  7. mike reeh

    mike reeh 1/2 ton status

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    Id say its the springs that qualify it as a 5/4 ton..........

    mike
     
  8. 79blzr

    79blzr Newbie

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    While you are correct about the dually issue, the rest of the post is absolutely incorrect. The "1 TON" M1008 will directly bolt up to a 1/2 ton M1009 (BLAZER) without any modification. To do this mod axle swap with the 1 1/4 ton axles, the spring perches need to be relocated.
    The perches from the 1 ton and 1 1/4 ton 14BFF also look completely different. The 1 ton perches are cast and have two hollowed out areas, The 1 1/4 ton is solid steel with only the centering hole on top. PM me your email addy, and I'll shoot you pics (I have 1 of each in the backyard. :haha: )


    On this note, I don't remember saying "all" 1 1/4 tons were communication variants. I will add this piece of info though. The 1 1/4 ton M1008 was designated by the department of defense as a communication variant. By NSN, it also cost $34,331 as opposed to the standard $14,775 1 TON M1008. Now of course the militarry used them how they saw fit, but by the book they were considered special purpose vehicles and should have only been used as communication trucks. Almost like the modern day MRC HMMWV's.
     
  9. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    Again, more wrong info. My diff's were from a M1008 5/4 ton, stamped steel perches 40" apart. The cast perches were most often found on older civi 14 bolts, and civi 3/4 ton 14 bolt FF's did have the correct perch width (42.5").

    Not a single one ton K truck had the wider perch width, not civilian or military. Any 14 bolt with 42.5" perch width spent it's life under a 3/4 ton.

    Rene
     
  10. afroman006

    afroman006 1/2 ton status

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    My email is afroman006@hotmail.com I'm curious about the solid steel perches, I've never heard of or seen such a thing and have dealt with my fair share of 14 bolts. Have you ever bolted a M1008 14 bolt into a half or 3/4 ton? The 14 bolt that was in my 3/4 ton suburban and now is in my 3/4 ton trail truck came from a M1008 and it most certainly had the 40" wide perches that had to be cut off. I also parted out 3 other M1008's and they were all normal chevy 1 ton chassis with 40" wide perches. They also all had troop seat racks in the back so they certainly weren't communications trucks. Good indicator of how monetarily efficient uncle sam is huh.
     
  11. TravisO

    TravisO 1/2 ton status

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    Not to burst your bubble, but I pulled a pair of axles out of a 1984 CUCV, 14FF with 4.56's and Detroit along with the matching open carrier Dana 60F. The 14FF is sitting in my garage right now with cast perches (with the two hollow spots) and a perch width of 40.5".

    All 1973+ trucks and classic Blazers (1972-) are 40.5". All 1973+ Blazer and Suburbans are 42.5".
    Travis
     
  12. tRustyK5

    tRustyK5 Big meanie Staff Member Super Moderator GMOTM Winner Author

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    I'm well aware of the perch width's and the different style's of perches and what fits what... My old civi 3/4 ton 14 bolt FF had the cast perches, the 14 under the truck now was from an 85 M1008 and had the stamped steel perches, 4.56's and Detroit.

    Apparently there was a method to what got stamped perches and what got cast...it's just not abundantly obvious, and doesn't seem to have much to do with application or GVW.

    All 73 and up 1/2 and 3/4 tons are 42.5". The Classic K5's (72 and older) and all the '73-91 K30's, and M1008 (and variations of same) were 40.5".

    My old 14 was from a '77 K20 and did not require the perches to be moved in order to bolt it up under my Jimmy.

    Rene
     
  13. u2slow

    u2slow 1/2 ton status

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    5/4-ton is the military's own payload rating of the vehicle.

    Most civilian '1-tons' have a payload rating in the 3500-5500lb range. Well over 1-1/4 tons.
     
  14. royjones

    royjones Trucker upper Premium Member

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    what the heil

    O K people we cane all get along here. no one person knows everything. well exc maybe are wife.s :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha:
     
  15. 6.2Blazer

    6.2Blazer 1/2 ton status

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    I think the main trouble here is that people are trying to compare a civilian "1-ton" truck to the military version they referred to as "5/4 ton". Keep in mind that the terms 1/2 ton, 3/4 ton, and 1 ton are really outdated and do not accurately describe the actual payload rating of any half-way new truck.......rather they are just carry over terms from a long time ago that people still like to use to distinguish between different classes of trucks.

    Just go look at the specs of new trucks. A new Chevy 1500 series truck, depending on configuration, can have a payload of over 2,000 lbs...........so should it be considered a "1-ton" truck? A 2500HD can have a payload of over 4,000 lbs........but it's a mere 3/4 ton truck right?

    Anyway, the "5/4 ton" statement was simply what the military rated the truck at and has nothing to do with any "beefing up" of any components nor can it be used to compare it to an equivalent civilian truck. I would even guess the equivalent civilian version had a factory rated payload capacity at least equal or greater than 2,500 lbs.

    Also in regard to the 14FF rear axles found in CUCV's, all the ones I've ever seen or heard about had the same spring perch location. This would be the first time ever I had heard about a "1-ton" and "5/4 ton" variants of the M1008.
     
  16. muddog

    muddog 1/2 ton status

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    OK...all CUCV's excluding the M1009 Blazer shares the same frame as the civilian 1 ton frame. There are 2 braces that sit behind the engine in th frame rails and 2 pieces of metal riveted to the frame where the shackle mount brackets are bolted for reinforcement. This is the only differences. They were all rated at 5/4 ton again excluding the M1009 (3/4 ton) . Never, ever were they rated at 1 or 5/4 strictly 5/4. The only thing giving this the 5/4 ton rating is the good ole gubbment.
    GVWRs are as follows

    M1008 and M1008a1-8800
    M1009---6400
    M1010---9450
    M1028,a1---9400
    M1031---9200

    Dont have the specs on the DRW version of the M1028a2,a3 but I beleive it is 11.


    Spring perch widths and perches themselves. They came with both the solid ones and the stamped steel ones. Width is 40.5 period. This is also the same width as any civilian 1 ton of that body style. Only 1/2 tons and 3/4 tons used the 42.5 spring perch width.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2005
  17. dieselponyexpress

    dieselponyexpress 1/2 ton status

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    Not sure what you mean by the riveted pieces - a little like the shakle flip kits (?) :confused: But the reinforcements behind the engine are missing on my 1984 M1008! My buddies M1008 does have them although. According to my parts catalog, only 85+ M1008 came with the front reinforcments.

    Don't want to be pedantic but all info (good or bad) given on a huge forum like here is easily spread around. :wink1:


    Oh yes: GVWR of M1028A2 & A3 is 10120lbs
     
  18. bigjbear

    bigjbear 1 ton status Staff Member Moderator

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    Just to throw a little gas on the fire: the M880 5/4 ton is a Dodge w250 (3/4 ton civi), small block, 727TF, NP203 and D44/D60 combo. The 5/4 ton designation is purely US Mill and has nothing to do w/ what the mfgs called them. Just look at the M1009 if you need more proof. Its just a regular 1/2 ton K5 in camo.
     
  19. TravisO

    TravisO 1/2 ton status

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    Come on now. It's a well known and documented fact that camo paint adds at least an extra 1/4 ton capacity. :haha:
    Travis
     

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