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Why are my tires like this?

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by 4xcrazy, Jun 4, 2004.

  1. 4xcrazy

    4xcrazy 3/4 ton status

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    I installed the 3/4 ton 10 bolt front axle a few months ago, nothing really different except the brakes and hubs, no shims installed, just like the old 6 lug 10 bolt, but after the 3/4 ton instal, i noticed my front wheels now sit like this slightly........ \__/ (obviously not THAT bad, but just to get the idea across) where as before they were sitting correctly,vertically, if not slightly inward /__\

    I cannot understand this deal, as from what i see, there are no possibly adjustments to correct this little delima.


    Any ideas??

    I'd hate to install new 35's like the near future plans are, just to wear out the outer edges as some indication of the current tires are starting to show me.
     
  2. funkycold

    funkycold 1/2 ton status

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    Looks like you need to adjust your "toe" on the front tie rod. you should be able to loosen the clamps on the tie rod ends and turn the tie rod bar to bring the front of the tires in closer. If you measure from center to center on the tires, there should only be about a 1/4" difference between the front and rear of the tires. I think the front should be toed in vs the rear.
     
  3. pauly383

    pauly383 Daddy383 Staff Member Moderator

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    He means his tires lean in at the top , like when some idiot lowers his car by cutting coils or letting out the torsion bars . Not toe in , camber is what he is after . /forums/images/graemlins/k5.gif
     
  4. 4xcrazy

    4xcrazy 3/4 ton status

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    Yeah, my bad, i forgot to mention this is what the tires look like when you are standing in front of the truck looking at it, /forums/images/graemlins/doah.gif
     
  5. Hossbaby50

    Hossbaby50 3/4 ton status

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    That can be a toe in problem. Check the toe. Also look at it and see if the rim is vertical or is it leaning too? If the rim is not leaning like the tire it is a toe problem. After both me and Matt both had the problem recently. Adjusting the toe fixed it.

    If the rim is not vertical then I would suspect the ball joints are bad or the axle tubes are bent.

    Harley
     
  6. pauly383

    pauly383 Daddy383 Staff Member Moderator

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  7. rcurrier44

    rcurrier44 1/2 ton status

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    Well I have seen 2 ways of adjusting camber on our trucks.

    1: a tapered shim that goes between the spindle and the nuckle.

    2: a offset hole in that tapered upper ball joint adjuster sleave. The one that you need the funny 4 prong tool to adjust in the upper C...hopefully someone knows what I am talking about.

    I would look into both of these and see if someone put them back together incorectly.

    If you are running alot of caster your tow will also affect this... alot of positive caster (pinion tilted down) and tow out will make it appear that you have this camber problem.
     
  8. az-k5

    az-k5 1/2 ton status

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    If your toe is out it can push the bottom of tires out or in depending on how bad the toe is set. I would run a plumb bob off of your hood/fender and measure the wheel. If the plumb line is real close (within 1/16") when measuring the top of the wheel vs the bottom than it is not a camber issue (this is how I found out mine was a toe issue) then adjust the toe and see if it gets better. If it off of the plumb line than it might be ball joints or a bent housing (although a bent housing usually has one side worse than the other)
     
  9. 4xcrazy

    4xcrazy 3/4 ton status

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    My bad, also forgot to mention the ball joints are new as well, they were replaced when the install was done, figured that was as good a time to do it as any.

    Also the tierod used was from the original 1/2 ton 10 bolt, maybe there are different measurements between the two with the toe?
     
  10. bablazer73

    bablazer73 1/2 ton status

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    Upper adjustment sleeves can be purchased to correct camber/caster on 1/2 and 3/4 ton 10 bolts and D44's. I get them at Napa, for around 10 bucks.(per side) I have a Snap on tool(4 prong socket) to remove them. BUT most of the time heat is required to get them out! Did you happen to notice if your new ball joints came with that sleeve? I know the ones I buy usually come with a 0* sleeve.

    I have never used the type Paul is talking about on a truck. I have used similar for cars with good results. But The idea of shimming the splindle doesn't look good, to me anyways!
     
  11. spearchucker

    spearchucker 1/2 ton status

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    Shimming the spindles would stress out the studs on the spindles since the bolts would only be contacting one side of the spindle and not laying flat against it. This would be just like adding a tapered shim to a D60. The studs that go into the pumpkin are not perpendicular to the spring plate.
     
  12. 4xcrazy

    4xcrazy 3/4 ton status

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    No, actually i only replaced two of the ball joints, the other two were still like new condition, this axle was originally on a chassis cab work truck, when i dropped the front cover, the oil still looked new, only the drivers side ball joints were bad, actually only the upper, but i replacxed both, and as mentioned, the others were still tight, so no modifications due to replacing parts was even done on the pass side.

    very confused on this, like i said, i would think nothing would be different between the two except the 8 lug and larger rotors.

    I guess when the cash flow is coming in alittle more, i will just run it down to the alignment shop and let them deal with it.
     
  13. bigburban383

    bigburban383 1/2 ton status

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    Yeah, toe has nothing to do with camber. A straight axle doesn't have camber adjustments. Or atleast a factory way of adjustment. I would check your ball joints.
     
  14. Hossbaby50

    Hossbaby50 3/4 ton status

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    Did you get the upper ball joint adjusted correctly to the right torque spec? Was it f'ed up before you replaced the ball joints on that side? Are both sides messed up?

    Harley
     
  15. 4xcrazy

    4xcrazy 3/4 ton status

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    I do not know how the wheels were sitting before the replaced ball joints, had no wheels on it at the time, as far as adjustment on the ball joints, i have yet to see this setup, or any means of adjustment on the ball joints on the 10 bolt diff, i only did the one side, and yes, both sides sit this way.
     
  16. spearchucker

    spearchucker 1/2 ton status

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    I think what he's asking is if you torqued the adjusting sleeve like what's mentioned in this ball joint write-up .
     
  17. ugly_blazer

    ugly_blazer 1/2 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]


    Also the tierod used was from the original 1/2 ton 10 bolt, maybe there are different measurements between the two with the toe?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    The tie rod from the 6 lug will likely need adjusted to align properly on the 8 lug. I replaced upper and lower ball joints on both sides of my 8 lug Dana 44 and insatlled a new tie rod and my tires do the same thing now, maybe they are supposed to be like that? Everthing was done right and torqued to the proper specs. I am going to take it to the alignment shop and have it aligned, regardless if it will make the tires stand straight or not. Their $20,000 computerized alignment machine has got to be more accurate than my $1.00 tape measure that I bought at Big Lots. I want my tires to last as long as possible. Besides, for $159.95 I can get a 5 year "no questions asked" warranty on the alignment.
     
  18. darkshadow

    darkshadow 1 ton status

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Also the tierod used was from the original 1/2 ton 10 bolt, maybe there are different measurements between the two with the toe?


    [/ QUOTE ]

    The tie rods are diferand between these two axles, the 1/2 ton is longer andthe tapered pin is smaller. So it will be lose and give you problems ( a dumb ass i got a sub off of did this to me /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif)

    just a thought did you install you new axle at a different degree? as in tilting it to make the u-joint aline beter? if so would your ball joints now NOT be at 90* but off abit, and this would tilt your wheels?
     
  19. 4xcrazy

    4xcrazy 3/4 ton status

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    As far as tilting the axle, no everything was installed the exact same way the 1/2 ton axle came off. As far as adjusting sleeves, i have seen no sign of this setup on the corp 10 bolt, the ball joints simply pop out and the new gets pressed in, no sleeves or anything in this deal, not sure how the D44 is setup, never had one.

    Well i just did a search of the front setup, and evidently there is some kind of adjusting sleeve in there, although i did not see any signs of this deal, guess i'll have to tear into it and check it out, see whats up, or better yet, just take it out and let the pro play with it so it's done right i guess.

    Well thanks for the info and comments, i'll get it done later.
     
  20. ugly_blazer

    ugly_blazer 1/2 ton status

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    A 4x4 shop around here told me once that some of the 10 bolts didn't have and adjusting sleeve, so it's possible that your's doesn't have one.
     

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