If you own a gun, READ THIS !!!!!!!

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by Z3PR, Jun 30, 2005.

  1. Z3PR

    Z3PR Banned

    Mar 30, 2002
    Likes Received:
    House Passes Extreme Penalties For Some Who Use Guns In Self-Defense
    -- Bill could also make your hunting party a "criminal street gang"

    Gun Owners of America E-Mail Alert
    8001 Forbes Place, Suite 102, Springfield, VA 22151
    Phone: 703-321-8585 / FAX: 703-321-8408

    Tuesday, June 28, 2005

    Let's assume that you and your family are on your way home from
    church. You have a gun in the glove compartment that is there for

    After driving within 1,000 feet of a school (which is almost
    unavoidable), you stop by the grocery store to pick up a few items
    for lunch.

    As you are exiting your car, you are approached by a gang of
    teenagers, armed with long screwdrivers and wrenches. Realizing that
    you are about to be mugged, you brandish your firearm in order to
    scare them off -- although this act on your part is a violation of
    state law which requires that you first retreat, rather than defend

    Congratulations. Under legislation that recently passed the House,
    all the members of your family are now subject to a MANDATORY MINIMUM
    sentence of ten years in prison -- and up to life imprisonment.

    The judge would have NO DISCRETION to release you before the end of
    the ten-year period -- but an anti-gun judge could sentence you and
    your family to LIFE IMPRISONMENT.

    Sound ridiculous? Welcome to the new "tough-on-crime" House of

    It's not as though Republicans like House Judiciary Committee
    Chairman James Sensenbrenner (R-WI) have no experience with the
    "unintended" broad consequences of anti-gun laws.

    Remember the Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organization Act
    (RICO)? That bill was passed with the ostensible purpose of going
    after the Mafia.

    But it was poorly drafted. At its core, a person or business only
    had to commit two of a broad list of sometimes-fairly-innocuous
    crimes in order to be subject to stiff prison sentences. As a
    result, lawsuits and criminal prosecutions soon sprouted against
    legitimate banks and businesses and pro-life protestors.

    Never capable of learning from its mistakes, Congress is about to go
    after gun owners in the same way.

    This new bill -- touted as anti-gang legislation -- is numbered H.R.
    1279 in the House, where it passed by a 279-144 margin on May 11.
    Twenty Republicans -- including pro-gun stalwarts like John
    Hostettler (R-IN), Ron Paul (R-TX), and Roscoe Bartlett (R-MD) --
    voted against it. It now goes to the Senate, where its counterpart
    (S. 155) is sponsored by anti-gun zealot Dianne Feinstein (D-CA) and
    Orrin Hatch (R-UT).

    Similar to RICO, these two bills, at the core, would define "criminal
    street gangs" to be formal OR INFORMAL groups of three or more
    individuals who commit two or more of a long list of "predicate"

    What are these predicate crimes, of which two or more could get you
    thrown into the slammer for the rest of your life? Check these out:

    * Violation of the Kohl 1,000-foot "gun-free-school-zone" law would
    be a predicate crime in the House bill.

    * Having a gun in violation of the Lautenberg amendment -- because
    you spanked your kid or spat on your husband -- would be a predicate
    in both the House and Senate versions.

    * Accidentally shooting a doe instead of a buck (or shooting the
    wrong kind of duck) would be a "crime of violence" (under the 18
    U.S.C. 16 definition) and could therefore be a "predicate" crime if
    some of the worst provisions from both bills end up in the final
    version that goes to the President.

    And, as mentioned above, your family's trip past the school -- as
    you're driving home from church -- could send all of you to jail if
    you use your gun in self-defense, rather than first retreating as
    required in some states.

    This is because:

    * A "criminal street gang" exists as soon as this
    "informal" group
    of 3 or more individuals (your family) commits "2 or more gang
    crimes... in relation to the group" if one of the crimes is a
    of violence."

    * Violation of the Kohl "gun-free-school-zone" amendment (18 U.S.C.
    922(q)) is a "gang crime."

    * The threat to use a firearm against the muggers is both a gang
    crime and a crime of violence because it involves a "threat" of
    "force" against a person.

    The bills have other anti-gun provisions, as well:

    1. Mandatory Prison Sentences For Gun Owners

    The "street gang" provisions in the bill (as mentioned above) could
    send you and your family to jail for 10 years-to-life if you defend
    them with a gun under certain conditions.

    But even apart from those RICO-style provisions in the bill, there is
    other language in the bill that could send you to jail for twenty
    years MINIMUM if you use a gun in self-defense... even without your
    family being nearby.

    Federal law prohibits the mere possession of a firearm during and in
    relation to a crime of violence. The term "crime of violence"
    clearly includes brandishing or even opening your coat to display a
    firearm to defend yourself against a mugger -- without retreating --
    in states that require retreat. Hence, a concealed carry permit
    holder who opens his suit jacket and displays a firearm to a
    potential mugger in these states is liable under this section because
    "crime of violence" means the threatened use of force against
    or property.

    Section 114 of H.R. 1279 would increase the MINIMUM penalty for
    shooting the mugger (i.e., a Bernie Goetz-type offense) to TWENTY
    years in prison.

    2. Expanding The Lautenberg Gun Ban

    Section 109 of the House bill -- and its counterpart on the Senate
    version -- makes it more likely that a person will NOT get bail if
    they possessed a firearm after committing a "Lautenberg
    Again, a person could be held to commit such a misdemeanor if the
    person spanked their kid or spat on their spouse. So for having
    committed this small infraction (and for owning a gun) a person faces
    a higher probability of being held in jail until trial.

    ACTION: Contact your United States senators. Ask them to oppose
    anti-gun so-called "gang" legislation.

    You can visit the Gun Owners Legislative Action Center at
    http://www.gunowners.org/activism.htm to send your Senators a
    pre-written e-mail message.

    -----Pre-written letter-----

    Dear Senator:

    H.R. 1279 and its counterpart, S. 155, are supposedly "anti-gang"
    measures. But they are so poorly drafted that they could lead to
    lifetime prison sentences for fathers who protect their families from

    Under H.R. 1279, a family which drives within 1,000 feet of a school
    (which is almost unavoidable) with a gun in the glove compartment
    could be a criminal gang if the father or mother brandished the gun
    to scare off a mugger. All members of the family could be subject to
    a MANDATORY MINIMUM sentence of ten years in prison -- and up to life
    imprisonment, at the discretion of the court.

    The Senate bill is only slightly better.

    Please oppose these anti-gun abominations.

  2. mtn. burb

    mtn. burb 1/2 ton status

    May 13, 2004
    Likes Received:
    Ojai Calif.
    Man will either be ruled by God, or by tyrants.

    Guess which we have chosen?

    God, thru Jesus His Son, created us to live in Liberty.

    When we abandoned His Law Word, and shifted from self governing behavior, to lawlessness, man and civil government steps in and puts the shackles on us.

    This happens over and over in history.

    But it is especially grievous in America. A waste of a wonderful inheritance.

    When will we say "Uncle", repent, and turn back to God?

    Our natural rights as men hang in the balance.

    Pray for America and God Bless our Troops.
  3. gjk5

    gjk5 3/4 ton status

    Mar 17, 2004
    Likes Received:
    Grand Junction, CO
    That on it's surface is pretty inflammatory Paul, these bills will not pass and the interpretation offered is the most outrageous (and unlikely) outcome. I agree with the gist of what is said there but the way it's presented is what makes us look like "gun nuts" to other folks. Just like the anti-gunner's "assault rifle" hysteria makes them look foolish to us.

    Take a look at www.nraila.com the NRA has a pretty good handle on what legislation needs to be defeated (or is even a threat).

    I just read that a little closer as well, the scenario put forth assumes a "retreat law" which is state by state (Colorado does not have it) and Florida was the only one I know for sure does have it. Luckily here need not retreat first, we can just start blasting at will if we feel threatened, not to mention someone has to prove that you did not try to retreat (if you were in FL) which would be pretty difficult.
  4. az-k5

    az-k5 1/2 ton status

    Oct 15, 2003
    Likes Received:
    Phoenix AZ
    Eventually people will get so fed up with crime,and the laws in the way for stopping it, that every day citizens will beat criminals to a pulp with their bare hands. That is until they outlaw making a fist in public. I don't see the need for this law. Why the hell does there need to be a "legalized overrunning of honest citezens" law. Retreat, WTF, that gives criminal agressors a legal avenue if they get hurt. It is already illegal to rob a bank, steel a car, and to kidnap. It is already more punishable if you carry a gun. This bill is not in favor of protecting me.
  5. newyorkin

    newyorkin 1 ton status Premium Member

    May 8, 2001
    Likes Received:
    Los Estados Unitos
    Hopefully this won't make it through the senate, but I'm sure we'd have thought it ridiculous to see it get through the house if we'd been paying attention before.

    I'll write to my Senators, but unfortunately, it's a futile effort in my state. This bill would have to have NAZI written on it for them to even half consider voting against it.
  6. mtn. burb

    mtn. burb 1/2 ton status

    May 13, 2004
    Likes Received:
    Ojai Calif.
    :haha: :haha: :haha:

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