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Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by Shaggy, Jul 20, 2004.
not the treaded X, even cut and paste wouldn't show it.
whats that picture of? i dont get it /forums/images/graemlins/dunno.gif /forums/images/graemlins/1zhelp.gif /forums/images/graemlins/whistling.gif
The evacuation of the Saigon embassy in 1975.
Wow, that speaks VOLUMES Shaggy.......
Forgive my ignorance but what does that mean? I guess you have to know the background of it all... /forums/images/graemlins/doah.gif /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
I am pretty sure it is implying that we need to start worrying about America, not a country half way around the world. They believe we need to pull out of the middle east, etc. just like we pulled out of Vietnam.
[ QUOTE ]
I am pretty sure it is implying that we need to start worrying about America, not a country half way around the world just like we pulled out of Vietnam.
[/ QUOTE ]
That's not what it's saying at all.
I should probably say that this is satire, it's not an actual campaign poster for Kerry/Edwards. I'm going to be disappointed if only one person gets the significance of this poster, I think that it's ****1ng brilliant.
Great poster. Speaks volumes about Kerry's war experience.
Which consists of:
1.How to cut and run.
2.Abandoning your command
2 Loosing a war.
I think everyone knows that it's satire and most people recognize it's from Saigon but I'm just having trouble with the significance.... /forums/images/graemlins/doah.gif....just call me 84gmcjimmy... /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Rather than explain it, I'll just link to where I got it and you can read the comments there.
I understand it now, its all in what context you read it I guess. I figured it was an actual poster at first, call me 84gmcjimmy too I guess.
Thanks! Now I'm schooled on the Siagon fiasco! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Here's some of the better explanations from that site:
"For those wondering what Kerry has to do with the fall of Saigon. . . .
1. Kerry campaigned vigorously for a Communist victory.
2. Kerry testified before Congress and urged the Democratic Congress to abandon the South Vietnamese to the Marxist invaders.
3. Kerry went to Paris to meet with North Viet Nam representatives in an effort to bolster the Vietnam Marxist movement.
4. Kerry assurred the American people while testifying before Congress that having Marxists take over all of Vietnam would have minimal impact on the people of Vietnam.
5. Kerry sought to demoralize soldiers and the American public by publicly and falsely accusing multiple servicemen of war crimes.
6. Kerry was cited specifically by the North Viet Nam military chief of staff, General Giap, as being a major factor in the triumph of the Marxist regime in Vietnam.
Now other than that, Kerry really didn't have much to do with the fall of Saigon."
'Apparently, these two dullards completely forgot about Congress's primary role in this debacle. Between 1970 and 1973, a Democrat-controlled, anti-war Congress cut off virtually all military funding for the Vietnam conflict, despite the fact that (1) an uneasy peace had been established and (2) all that was needed to maintain that peace was a continued military precence and/or funding of our anti-communist allies in the South. The embarrassing airlift photos from 1975 were the direct result of Congress cutting military appropriations necessary to ensure this continued peace: There was nothing to deter the communist forces from taking over, because all but a handful of U.S. troops guarding the U.S. embassy had been withdrawn in early 1973, and we didn't provide South Vietnam with the necessary funding to maintain their military superiority over the North. It's also worth mentioning Kerry's role in drumming up support for ending the war prematurely."
"Ok, this about puts me over the [darn] top. So now Gerald Ford and/or Barry Goldwater are responsible for Vietnam? Let's think about this. John Kennedy put us into Southeast Asia beginning with "advisors" based on his love affair with special forces faggots and the CIA (if you want it done right, call in the Marines - the highest kill ratios and successful missions throughout the war). Kennedy had no concept of what the overall goal was other than a general counter-balance to Communist aggression with "police actions" and Black Ops, ie. Bay of Pigs fiasco (another example of this approach would be the Clinton administration’s police/equivalent response approach to Terrorism in the 90's which the current JFK apparently still agrees with).
So Kerry comes back from 3 1/2 months in Vietnam, after campaigning for the magic number 3 in the Purple Heart category (ticket home) by reporting to sickcall at BAS for every sliver that requires Bactine and a band-aid. Along the way, he gets two other decorations falling under the category of “maybe this will shut him up”. Incidentally, if turning your boat around amid small arms fire and picking up the guy who fell overboard is called “Heroic”, what do you call it if you DON’T turn around – “[darn] You, I’m Covered” or how about “Chargeable Offense”.
So, Kerry comes home. Richard Nixon took office on January 20th 1969 at a time when America under Lyndon Johnson already had 569,000 troops in Vietnam. But somehow, according to Kerry, Vietnam is “Nixon’s War”. Interestingly, although two Democratic Presidents put us into Vietnam and escalated and politicized the Hell out of it, every Democratic member of Congress lines up to shake Kerry’s hand after he lies before Congress in ’71 with false charges of war crimes. The result? Somehow, Vietnam becomes the Republican’s fault. Nixon ultimately all but gave us the victory, but public sentiment had degraded so much due to the lying left-wing political machinations of Democratic operatives like John Kerry (who mysteriously ran for the Senate within a year of testifying), the effort became no longer feasible and Nixon begins the reduction in force.
The more accurate comparison to the current War on Terror is to WWII. Fight the country that attacked us because we must, but it’s the battle against the worst murdering dictator of our generation in a part of the World which represents the greatest concern that matters. The comparison to Vietnam is valid in only one regard. The unrelenting self-serving protest from the lying left-wing sways a weary population into capitulation, ie. the scene depicted in the photograph of the pell-mell evac of Saigon in ’75."
At least Kerry was there...where was Bush? I dont really care one way or the other. Kerry and Bush are both scumbags. Both have done things to be very ashamed of...in this election we will be choosing the lesser of the two evils, the question is really "which one?" I thought our choices were pretty pathetic in the 2000 election, but now Im really concerned.
Yeah Kerry was "there" alright, protesting against the war and calling his fellow soldiers murders. Im one that believes service in the National Guard is honorable, I dont know how you meant this but I strongly disagree if you think that Natl Guard service is something "to be very ashamed of.."
That slogan came from a poem by Langston Hughes a member of the communist party. [ QUOTE ]
Langston became interested in socialism during his youth. His belief that all property should be divided equally among society lead him to join the Communist party. In 1932, he went to the Soviet Union as part of a team of writers to produce a documentary. He admired the Soviet Union and saw it as a symbol of hope. Though the country was poor and struggling, Hughes noticed there was no racism or economic divisions. He wrote the poem "One More 'S' in the U. S. A." for the U. S. Communist party in 1934. In later years, his involvement with the Communist party brought him before the McCarthy Committee which was investigating the influence of communism in the United States. This was during a time of nationwide anti-communist hysteria (The Cold War). Hughes made a deal with the committee and no charges were ever filed. But the experience brought his character into question
[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Let America be America again.
Let it be the dream it used to be.
Let it be the pioneer on the plain
Seeking a home where he himself is free.
(America never was America to me.)
Let America be the dream the dreamers dreamed--
Let it be that great strong land of love
Where never kings connive nor tyrants scheme
That any man be crushed by one above.
(It never was America to me.)
O, let my land be a land where Liberty
Is crowned with no false patriotic wreath,
But opportunity is real, and life is free,
Equality is in the air we breathe.
(There's never been equality for me,
Nor freedom in this "homeland of the free.")
Say, who are you that mumbles in the dark?
And who are you that draws your veil across the stars?
I am the poor white, fooled and pushed apart,
I am the Negro bearing slavery's scars.
I am the red man driven from the land,
I am the immigrant clutching the hope I seek--
And finding only the same old stupid plan
Of dog eat dog, of mighty crush the weak.
I am the young man, full of strength and hope,
Tangled in that ancient endless chain
Of profit, power, gain, of grab the land!
Of grab the gold! Of grab the ways of satisfying need!
Of work the men! Of take the pay!
Of owning everything for one's own greed!
I am the farmer, bondsman to the soil.
I am the worker sold to the machine.
I am the Negro, servant to you all.
I am the people, humble, hungry, mean--
Hungry yet today despite the dream.
Beaten yet today--O, Pioneers!
I am the man who never got ahead,
The poorest worker bartered through the years.
Yet I'm the one who dreamt our basic dream
In the Old World while still a serf of kings,
Who dreamt a dream so strong, so brave, so true,
That even yet its mighty daring sings
In every brick and stone, in every furrow turned
That's made America the land it has become.
O, I'm the man who sailed those early seas
In search of what I meant to be my home--
For I'm the one who left dark Ireland's shore,
And Poland's plain, and England's grassy lea,
And torn from Black Africa's strand I came
To build a "homeland of the free."
Who said the free? Not me?
Surely not me? The millions on relief today?
The millions shot down when we strike?
The millions who have nothing for our pay?
For all the dreams we've dreamed
And all the songs we've sung
And all the hopes we've held
And all the flags we've hung,
The millions who have nothing for our pay--
Except the dream that's almost dead today.
O, let America be America again--
The land that never has been yet--
And yet must be--the land where every man is free.
The land that's mine--the poor man's, Indian's, Negro's, ME--
Who made America,
Whose sweat and blood, whose faith and pain,
Whose hand at the foundry, whose plow in the rain,
Must bring back our mighty dream again.
Sure, call me any ugly name you choose--
The steel of freedom does not stain.
From those who live like leeches on the people's lives,
We must take back our land again,
I say it plain,
America never was America to me,
And yet I swear this oath--
America will be!
Out of the rack and ruin of our gangster death,
The rape and rot of graft, and stealth, and lies,
We, the people, must redeem
The land, the mines, the plants, the rivers.
The mountains and the endless plain--
All, all the stretch of these great green states--
And make America again!
[/ QUOTE ]
Funny how Kerry uses a qoute from a communist to represent himself and the amerika he wants for us all.
For those bashing Kerry's war record, maybe you should take a look at this article.
It's a pretty fair assesment of his military record. It's funny out of all the poeple that served under him on the Fast boats only one guy has anything bad to say about him.
The only thing that I see in that article that I explicitly disagree with is about the automatic transfer back to the states. Everything else that I've read says that an officer had to ask a superior officer to make the request for transfer, and the transfer was decided upon on an individual basis.
ALot of people seem to think that a purple heart is only given out if you're seriously injured, but it seems that two of his wounds were not even serious enough to take him off duty, and the other only had him in the hospital for 2 days. Not to belittle the wounds, but he makes it seem like he almost died 3 times.
Separate names with a comma.