Nasty outside edge tire baldness...

[The Pumpkinator]

Think I can get just a few more miles out of it?

My truck was in need of some new meats, especially up here in snow country, and I had some new KM2s in mind. Plains Tire offered me the best deal for the tires with their bitchin' Freedom Plan, this also included the quotes on a front end alignment and new upper and lower ball joints for the passenger's front.

The solution to this problem took a weird turn from what was suspected to be wiped out ball joints causing the passenger's tire to lean outwards, if the truck was parked on a level surface with the wheels pointing straight forward you can just make out the angle of the rim in relation to the axle and see it was pushed out at the top. What was figured a whole day of work at the shop turned into three days.

The ball joints on the passenger's side were tight as can be, the wheel bearings were seated properly and the tie rod was not bent. However the driver's side ball joints were destroyed. At first this didn't make any sense; how could the loose knuckle on the drivers side make the caster look off on the passenger's side with the passenger's side being rock solid?

The front end specialist stated that his computer data base compiled of 13 different large auto vendors had no solution whatsoever to adjust the camber on one of the most commonly found axles, even though his lasers shown it was off, I called bull on this, and told him that there was an eccentric sleeve that could adjust the top ball joint in or out like the Fords. I needed to find proof so I dug around here on CK5 for some info and found two aftermarket solutions along with the vendor name that sells them; an eccentric preload sleeve for the top ball joint, and a shim that was sandwiched between the knuckle and the spindle...turns out that replacing the ball joints on the driver's side and adjusting the toe fixed the problem

Here is the shop data:

Front Left
Actual Before Range
Camber: 1.0 1.0 0.8 2.3
Caster : 7.9 7.9 7.0 9.0
Toe :0.02 -0.54 -0.08 0.08

Front Right

Camber: 0.5 0.4 0.4 2.3
Caster : 8.0 8.0 7.0 9.0
Toe :0.03 0.68 -0.08 0.08

Front End
Actual Before Range
cross camber: 0.05 0.7 -1.0 1.0
cross caster : -0.1 -0.1 -1.0 1.0
total toe :0.05 0.15 -0.16 0.16

After adjustments, everything checks out. So for those caught in the situation I was in, the solution is new ball joints on the driver's side with some toe adjustments. Also while its ripped apart it wouldn't hurt to make sure the wheel bearings are packed with grease and seated properly, and the hubs cleaned out.

 

[The Pumpkinator]

Also if anyone has any tips tricks or other things they would like to point out, it would be much appreciated!

 

[sweetk30]

i dont understand thay way you posted the numbers all grouped like that.

but i will tell you .

caster is tilt front to back for how fast the wheel returns to center and how easy it is to turn the wheel.

camber = money = tilt in and out of the tire off center. can wear edges of the tires if to much . and if off cross specs can cause pull.

toe = money = tires pointing in and out as a pair. if to far in will wear outside edges. if out to much will wear outside edges. and can cause pulling or vary scarry darting of the vehicle in direction.

caster needs to normaly be .50-1.0 higher on the right side.
camber needs to be as close to matched per side.
toe for our style rigs needs 1/8-1/4 " toe in front side of tires.
the bigger the tires the more pressure thay can put on parts so toe can go 1/4" range more and be o.k.
reason i say money on camber and toe is these off spec will eat tires and our money.

when i use to do alignments i always gave the cust a full print out . not the stupid hard for reg people to figure out #'s thay havent got a clue on.

pic #1 = reg print most shops give. its cheep easy to print and cover up sloppy alignment work. = hard for customer to read . yes the #'s are green but how close to center is green to the normal person. ??? and its just not fun to look at and try and understand.

pic #2 = advanced print out i love. its more to print out but VARY easy for cust to read and understand . plus hard to do crappy alignment work as it will show up faster to all who see it. BIG red and green colors with vehicle reference. also arrows pointing to how close to spec you are. there is good green on the endges. but best green on the center. this style of showing the customers over the years has resulted in 75% more sales easy if you ask me. thay all can understand it in the end so much better than a sheet of #'s

and most guys dont stock the spindle shims. and lots dont like to install them its a pain in the a$$ to them. next the upper bushing on 1/2 and 3/4 tons ball joints is not realy designed for adjustment. its used more for preload of the ball joints. there is off set bushings but thay are not the best solution to the problem.

basicly the guy at the alignment bay wanted super easy money from you via a ( set the toe and let it go ) alignment job. but good you stuck to your guns and fixed it good.

 

[The Pumpkinator]

Thanks for that explanation and those pics.I'm no front end specialist, don't get me wrong. I had the shop print me out the angle measurements, the data print looks nearly identical to that of your first pic, I would have just scanned and uploaded it but I don't have a scanner. Far as I know the only way to adjust the caster on a solid front axle would be to shim the leafs on the perches to make the yoke coming out of the diff pointing down or up...either that or figure out how to rotate the pressed on axle Cs (good luck), but being such a short coupled vehicle it makes sense to have the Cs tilted back as far as they are.

I had figured that my camber angle was out due to a top ball joint being blown out on the passenger's side where the tire was ate up. my guess is that most of the wear was caused by freeway time, since the driver's side knuckle was loose it was tugging on the passenger's side knuckle via the tie rod causing it to toe in and out rhythmically by its own, but that's my guess

Other than that I am pleased with the mechanic's work, he was honest and thorough, the camber looks to be within spec on the passenger's side, so with the usual tire rotations I can get some decent life out of my new KM2s

 

[4X4HIGH]

The outside of your tire being bald was caused by too much toe in.

 

[rob h]

Take it off the wheel and turn it around then you can use the other half...lol...I had to, just kidding now back to your scheduled program.

These guys are a great bunch of guys, they will help you out...

 

[The Pumpkinator]

Take it off the wheel and turn it around then you can use the other half.

that's how I could of made slicks...

The truck has been back from the shop for a day, only the one tire was ruined and the others were evenly bald, I just wanted to share my results as future reference so that if others have the same issue I had they can find their solution in a single post. Sorta like a follow up being that the problem was completely different from what I expected.

I am very pleased with these new KM2s, they're surprisingly quiet on the street for how aggressive the tread pattern is, and they are awesome in the deep snow. I cant wait to test them down in Moab in a few months!