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Let me remind you of the terrible build quality of the Cutlass Cieras, the Buick century (All the new gen A bodies). THEIR TERRIBLE.
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If you're going to rant... at least use the right words.
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Why is it all GM headliners sag? Every GM car my family has ever owned (and there have been around 15 of them), they all had saggy headliners. Yet I never had this problen in any of our fords? (around 6 of them).
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They probably sat in the sun all day for eternity with the windows rolled all the way up. The only ones I ever replaced were subject to these conditions... and the interior was faded as well.
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the new GM a bodies from 82-95 were TERRIBLE. They had a decent ride, but the handling was terrible, maintanance was a bitch , and while the motor never died, it did have a serious rod nock for 30k.
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While they were terrible for cars... they were spot-on for a typical FWD car. I didn't find maintenance that bad when you compare it to having to remove subframes or tear apart all the plastic on the top of the motor like a typical Ford or Chrysler. Sure, it wasn't like working on a TBI truck or an S10 but it wasn't like working on a new F150 or a Cherokee either.
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GM used a wax rope seal on the Turbo TA- WTF was that? Couldnt use a real seal??
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Must've worked at the time. Chrysler uses these retarded rocker setups that wear out every 60k on their I4s and I6s... couldn't use a real rocker setup?
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As for car like stuff under a truck- I seem to recall the 700r4 under both cars and trucks- and the camaro also used a 10b rear- Of which was more suited in the car, than all the 1/2 ton based trucks (including our beloved k5!).
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Yeap, and as long as you kept them from gear hunting or running without the torque converter locked up they lasted a long time. It's not like the catastrophic failure nearly all Dodge pickups have or the AODs girlyness and goofy valvebody.
There are a plethora of different 10 bolts ranging back to the 60s. The one you're talking about in the Camaro was the 7.5/7.625 variant which was also used in S10s. They'll survive 400hp as long as you aren't runny sticky tires (or taller than stock).
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I've had my fair share of problems with import cars, of which have also left me stranded.
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Reliability is key for me.
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Initial quality and long term realiability are different qualities. Just because a car is awarded "Car of the Year" award.. it doesnt mean its gonna last a long time. Take car of the year for 1989- THe Ford Probe- aka, "the mustang replacement"- Basically a Mazda powerplant with american shells-. I loved the handling and comfort of that car- and throughout its life required less repairs than my 88 mustang GT. DOES ANYONE's MAP LIGHT WORK?
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All that's relative. Don't forget the Taurus SHO (slightly higher output) with a yamaha engine that produced all its power after six grand... sounds cool but it doesn't go anywhere fast.
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I'd much rather have a crown vic than a camry- But the popularity of vehicles (and their brands) drive sales- a crown vic is a much more substantial vehicle compared to a camry- yet, camry sales are significantly higher, (and more costly).
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Popularity is relative. It's not necessarily the cars more people buy but the kind of people that buy it. If you're not an 18-40 year old cars aren't marketed to you and no one pays attention to them. It's also about "keeping up with the Jones'". This is the only reason why SUVs are still predominant. Once again the world will be full of Caravans.
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My friend had a 2001 impala- it was a very very nice vehicle, absolutely huge trunk, and I think it looks much better than my other friends camry- but its not initial price, its the long term durability.
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It's actually more about TCO (total cost of ownership). Since ricers aren't getting any better gas mileage these days they have to find other ways to compare their vehicles.
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And as for "More american cars on the road"- thats not a fair comparion- its just that people who own american cars, tend to keep them/not change them for a newer car. I think just with this website, we have saved at least hundreds, if not more k5's from making it to the scrap heep. We're keeing the image and following alive-. Once a car/truck looses its image, its toast. No more parts, no more support.
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It's still about intended audience. Kind of like how the S10 was only kept around for so long was to keep their fleet fuel economy so high. If image were everything the Blackwood wouldn't have been such a failure.
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How's parts cost for a Pinto? A contour? A subaru Justy? THeir all expensive, cause nobody keeps them around!
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The last Pinto rolled off the assembly line what... 30 years ago? Most of them rotted long ago. The ones that didn't rot out were robbed for parts for people's buggies. Contours are still around and parts are pretty cheap which is why junkyards are full of Contours with all their parts still on them. They're like an Escort... dime a dozen. I don't know anything about Subarus other than they make nice RTI ramps.
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And as for unions- Yes, the union fights for good wages for the union workers- But people forget that nobody is in business to loose money-. Quit the bickering about "how the company is making all this money"- Yes, their job is to provide wealth for their investors- many of which are other hard working americans who own stocks, or their mutual funds are invested into the auto industry-. So really, if you think about it, unions are robbing money from everyone else.
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Unions can be good and bad. Just like people can be. Many union workers are lazy pieces of [darn]. This is what costs money and makes unions look bad. Everything else about a union is positive. Many small companies with small unions are better off with unions because they're self-policing among other things. Unions can also help morale and work ethic. However, a union like at Michigan Tech blows donkeys in July. 40% of the people doing 80% of the work.
Wherever unions aren't there is a large difference in pay. Wherever unions aren't there are fewer jobs. Wherever unions aren't there are zero benefits. I'd rather work for a union shop making $35k than work at a closed shop making $40k, have to pay $5-9k a year for benefits, and have thousand dollar deductibles on most everything.
Not everyone can work in the service industry. When the middle class shrinks so does the economy. When manufacturing jobs disappear so does a lot of other things.
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Someone tell me why mustangs are still built ass backwards, require human labor at the very end, due to "errors" on the line, and cant move equipment properly, cause the floors are still cobblestone from the Model T?
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Mustangs are just plain backwards. All cars require human labor to build. All old factories aren't designed for modern equipment. This is why changeover exists in Ford, GM, and Daimler-Crapsler. There are a great many plans nearly three score old still being used today.
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Maybe the real conclusion is that two "equally" priced cars- one american, one import- someone said that the profit is 4x greater for the import- While I also dispute that statement, for arguments sake, lets say it is-
Why doesnt the american car company build more efficiently? Why doesnt the american car company cut the cost of labor?
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American car companies are actually pretty gosh darn efficient. GM has regular operations audits to make sure everyone is working enough. However, there are geriatrics with 35+ years in that still go to work every day and drag ass if they even do anything productive at all. Since they're union they can't fire them or force them to retire. A lot of these geriatrics don't do anything with their life except work so they're chickenshit to retire. Their "work" usually amounts to riding a tricycle around the plant. There are a lot of people like this working for the auto companies. So, essentially, they're paying $28+/hour for these old farts to hold chairs down or shoot the breeze with other old farts. It's nothing to find people still working for GM when they started back in World War II.
The foreign auto makers don't have to deal with any of this stuff. Plus the benefits are miniscule and your "retirement" is actually just a 401k. That's right... no pension.
Yeap, that's right, most of the foreign auto makers here in the US pay equivalent to most service industry jobs. At least with the service industry jobs you get real benefits.
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Maybe they should just cut the cost of cars! Oh wait, that would reduce profit.....
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Tell the old farts to retire.
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Imagine if the U.S. govt didnt impose such high taxes on imports- Rumor has it that bush wants to increase taxes and tarrifs on imports even HIGHER (more than 30%).
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If they did that, the foreign auto companies would love it. They could still tax the piss out of our cars going there while importing more here.
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The problem has been bigger than just "cars"- America is at a trade deficit with almost EVERY country. We only exported some 100 cars to South korea vs their thousands of kia's. Daewoo's, and Hyundai's.
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If you look at it you'll find it's because all those countries seem to think that they "deserve" to be in our markets but they should be able to keep us out of theirs. Look at how Canada pissed and moaned when we essentially closed our market to their grains.
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Think thats bad? America pays almost 100 billion dollars every year for overseas bond holders- due to our vast trade deficit. Think thats bad-.....
America was the looser in NAFTA- (north american free trade agreement)- In fact, we are still at a trade deficit with mexico and canada- meanwhile we're importing a whole lot from them!
I would just like to say this- Buy what you want. It doesnt really make any difference, but it sends a message to everyone else what the consumer wants. A great example is the pontiac Aztek- It was butt ugly, and nobody wanted it. So nobody bought it. Nobody was forced to purchase anything. And hence, it is no longer made.
Obviously, someone wanted IFS for GM trucks- And people BUY them. So they keep making them. If after 5 years, nobody bought a single GM ifs truck and bought only SFA Fords and Dodges- You can bet GM will rethink its path.
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Uh huh... NAFTA helped everyone but the US and its people. It hurt everyone in the US. What hurts manufacturing hurts everyone down the list... including hotel owners.
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I shop at walmart- It is an american owned company. It hires vast amounts of employees, of which are normal people from the area of which they live. THey hire thousands of employees-.
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They hire thousands of employees at sub-par wages, deny full-time status to just about everyone, and give little to no benefits. To get a retirement and benefits you're pretty high on the list.
Think of it this way... you're subsidizing your peers with your tax dollars. A family of four that work at wallyworld are also living on aid.
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Does it hurt the "mom and pop" shops? Sure. But the mom and pop shop sure did charge a lot for a garbage can that costs me 9 bucks at walmart costs me 30 at the "local hardware store". And I doubt the mom and pop stores got the garbage can for 29 bucks and only charged you 1 dollar for their services. I believe americans got fed up with the prices most smaller stores were charging- Hardware stores, lumber stores, plumbing stores, plumbers, - Why else would home depot, Lowes, Walmart, and Costco still be around and thriving?
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Wal-marts business practices is what hurts mom and pop stores and you as well. Wal-mart will demand a 100,000 widget order from company X. Company X can't fill that order with their current production facility. Wal-mart demands a really low price for that 100,000 widget order and a near delivery date but company X figures they'll be alright because of the volume. So they order new equipment and hire new employees to reach that delivery date. Company X now has a bunch of debt, makes that delivery date, and Wal-mart never orders another widget so company X starts charging other businesses more for the widgets. This hurts the other businesses and company X. Sometimes company X survives, sometimes it doesn't.
A lot of small businesses look at an item as to how much they need to sell it for to be worth their time as compared to how much the market will bear. That's why many speedshops went out of business. They decided they needed $400/carb and only sell 3 per month instead of charging $300/carb and selling 4 per month. Most small businesses don't understand volume at all or how to get people in their stores. In order to get people in your store you need to have really good deals, perhaps instead of selling it at cost sell it a bit lower. They also don't understand the predictability and calculability americans enjoy or how to use it to their advantage.
In my home town, Carter lumber sells almost everything they have for less than the Home Depot not 1500' away. They understand how to make a living.
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Demand drives market. We are the demand. The Edsel had lights that would twist, when you turned the steering wheel, to illuminate corners better during night time driving. Nobody bought the Edsel, even though it was the most innovative safest vehicle of its time. Now lexus has put it on their cars. Ooh. 1970 based idea. Only took 30+ years for it to catch on.
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Careful marketing and cost at its best. Cadillac had the most powerful FWD production car ever built as of today way back in 1970.
